Good luck with that . . . and God help us all if you are right, because this country will start circling the bowl economically in very short order.
Because the deficit the conservative are running right now will never have to be paid back.....there will never have to be repercussions for the largest deficit ever....only if you don't plan on paying taxes in the next little while. But good for the countries largest companies. They can take home a few more billion.
Stephane Dion had the Stroke, Iggy just pulled the plug.
Rae-Dion
Both won their seats. I guess they polled the Liberal party asking who they would support if they were to choose a new leader .
Justin Trudeau 45%
65% want Ignatieff to step down if he was to lose his seat and the election.
Iggy was another in a long list of wrong choices by this party.
Dion came across as a bumbling idiot still managed to finish 2nd
Iggy just pissed a lot of people off. He was not in the house of commons very often and basically came off as booger. ( To put it nicely ) and the liberals pretty much imploded.
If Trudeau becomes the new leader and is half the politician that his Father was he may bring them back.
-Liberals tanked this election so that Trudeau's kid will look like the second coming when they go from 30 seats to 80 in the next election
-Elizabeth May wins the first (legit, non walkover) seat for the Green Party. Congrats to her for helping bring a fringe party to respectability. However, she will end up spending the next 4 years on CPAC (I think that's was it's called) trying to be the daily soundbite. Also funny as all hell, in her victory speech, talking about the beauty of Saanichton. True? Yes. Hilarious? Absolutely since she's only been living there about a year or so as it was her third strategic move to try get elected (London, ON by-election 2007 and Nova Scotia in 2009).
-Tweet OTD: "Conservatives are like Nickleback - I don't know anyone who likes them but they still seem to do well"
-QOTD: "You can fit the entire Bloc Quebecois on my couch!" - Hockref
Finally, I'm moving to Japan. Safer than living in the police state of Stephen Harper's Conservative Majority government for the next four years. Also, the added possibility of super powers is too much to resist.
-Liberals tanked this election so that Trudeau's kid will look like the second coming when they go from 30 seats to 80 in the next election
-Elizabeth May wins the first (legit, non walkover) seat for the Green Party. Congrats to her for helping bring a fringe party to respectability. However, she will end up spending the next 4 years on CPAC (I think that's was it's called) trying to be the daily soundbite. Also funny as all hell, in her victory speech, talking about the beauty of Saanichton. True? Yes. Hilarious? Absolutely since she's only been living there about a year or so as it was her third strategic move to try get elected (London, ON by-election 2007 and Nova Scotia in 2009).
-Tweet OTD: "Conservatives are like Nickleback - I don't know anyone who likes them but they still seem to do well"
-QOTD: "You can fit the entire Bloc Quebecois on my couch!" - Hockref
Finally, I'm moving to Japan. Safer than living in the police state of Stephen Harper's Conservative Majority government for the next four years. Also, the added possibility of super powers is too much to resist.
I would like to call it the PISSED OFF VOTE.
Quebecers are steamed and had enough of both the Bloc and the Liberals.
It was reported this morning that over half of the NDP members elected in that province do not speak french. Going to be real interesting.
Liberals made a major mistake choosing Iggy as there leader. Plus a long line of mistakes prior to him coming into the picture.
Here is a guy nobody actually liked. Ken Dryden would have been a good choice.
No one wanted this election , The Liberals and Bloc pretty much forced it.
The proof is in the numbers.
I hope Dalton and his gang watched this last night. The Liberals here in Ontario sealed their fate with the HST.
As far as the deficit is concerned. I really don't have a problem with companies with the exception of a few getting tax breaks. There is a better chance of them staying put than heading south.
There is always going to be a deficit. This debt will never be paid off.
Our military: Believe it or not we have one of the best trained armies in the world. Unfortunately our equipment sucks. I would like to see more money put into defense and Our boys do need those new fighter planes. Regardless of what you think.
I would like to call it the PISSED OFF VOTE.
Quebecers are steamed and had enough of both the Bloc and the Liberals.
It was reported this morning that over half of the NDP members elected in that province do not speak french. Going to be real interesting.
Liberals made a major mistake choosing Iggy as there leader. Plus a long line of mistakes prior to him coming into the picture.
Here is a guy nobody actually liked. Ken Dryden would have been a good choice.
No one wanted this election , The Liberals and Bloc pretty much forced it.
The proof is in the numbers.
I hope Dalton and his gang watched this last night. The Liberals here in Ontario sealed their fate with the HST.
As far as the deficit is concerned. I really don't have a problem with companies with the exception of a few getting tax breaks. There is a better chance of them staying put than heading south.
There is always going to be a deficit. This debt will never be paid off.
Our military: Believe it or not we have one of the best trained armies in the world. Unfortunately our equipment sucks. I would like to see more money put into defense and Our boys do need those new fighter planes. Regardless of what you think.
Because the deficit the conservative are running right now will never have to be paid back.....there will never have to be repercussions for the largest deficit ever....only if you don't plan on paying taxes in the next little while. But good for the countries largest companies. They can take home a few more billion.
Ya that's it, tax the companies that actually employ people who pay taxes. They leave, then there is no corporate tax to collect, oh, and no jobs and no taxes from the employees.
In order to keep large employers in a country, you have to give them the incentive to stay. Otherwise, in a global economy, they can set up shop where someone will give them the incentive.
And the largest deficit in history was brought on by the minority government who was told to spend to stimulate the economy, that was facing the biggest recession since the 30s, or be defeated and face another election, by the other parties.
You have to be kidding ? Jean Chretian sabotaged the Liberal Party and created this mess. He never supported Paul Martin, his natural successor, did everything thing in his power to divide the party so he could stay in power longer.
He left just as the sponsorship scandal broke and left the rest to clean up his mess. Its a wonder this hasn't happened sooner.
My biggest concern isn't even party-centric. It's the man the person, Harper. He is a truly awful person and you want him to lead our country because your pissy with the Liberals? That's not making informed decisions as far as I can tell. Do even the slightest amount of research and you will find a long list of shitty, underhanded and truly shitty things he has done. And before people start with the " well all politicians are shitty" you should realize that he is much much worse than any of the other politicians that have lead a legit party for the a very long time.
Highlights of Harper's moves as leader of a minority government:
- appointed a minister of science and technology who does NOT believe in evolution
- while crime rates have been falling across the country, his budget plans to double DOUBLE the existing budget for jails
-cut women's advocacy funding by 40% and shut down 12 of the 16 status of women's offices (after all, he feels they should be silent and in the kitchen)
-The average wage in Canada has fallen since 2008 but the 100 wealthiest Canadians have gotten richer by an average of 1.7 billion each
-one of his top aides has been convicted five times (not once or twice but five times) of fraud and is strongly lobbying to have the government to buy water filtration systems for first nations communities from a company that his wife works for. Must be a coincidence.
-the conservatives have broken many campaign funding laws in this election for which 4 of them may face jail time but probably won't since they're Harper's cronies.
-many ombudsman and heads of commissions that bring forward news or info that Harper doesn't like get fired whenever they make this info public. Makes me feel safe.
-the lobby of parliament usually lined with photos and portraits of former Prime Ministers contain only photos of Harper now.
-his desire to scrap the long form census so there is no legitimate accounting of what Canadians truly are like or need. Then he can make decisions based on his wants and not our needs as a country.
-He is a member of the alliance church which believes that the apacolypse will happen in their lifetime, oppose divorce, view homosexuality as a deviant sin, won't ordain women and strongly oppose a woman's right too choose. But many people think that this won't affect his policy?
-He cut $1.2billion for national childcare in one of many moves to privatize many of our government services. To get an idea how well privatization of government institutions works look to South America and their average quality of life.
-He has never followed through on his promise to cut the $1.4 billion in tax breaks for oil companies
And that's just some of it. I had to condense and shorten some of the points and I haven't even covered them all. This is not my opinion, this is not a conspiracy theory, these are things that have happened or are happening that are on the public record. But most voters clearly are unaware of them because Harper excels at smothering the truth. This is also the least transparent government in the history of our country. They have refuse the release of more information (often illegaly) than any previous government by a massive margin.
Any handful of these things would be scary and if you could justify or explain away a couple there is still a staggering list of evil left. Now you tell me if we are overreacting.
My biggest concern isn't even party-centric. It's the man the person, Harper. He is a truly awful person and you want him to lead our country because your pissy with the Liberals? That's not making informed decisions as far as I can tell. Do even the slightest amount of research and you will find a long list of shitty, underhanded and truly shitty things he has done. And before people start with the " well all politicians are shitty" you should realize that he is much much worse than any of the other politicians that have lead a legit party for the a very long time.
Highlights of Harper's moves as leader of a minority government:
- appointed a minister of science and technology who does NOT believe in evolution
- while crime rates have been falling across the country, his budget plans to double DOUBLE the existing budget for jails
-cut women's advocacy funding by 40% and shut down 12 of the 16 status of women's offices (after all, he feels they should be silent and in the kitchen)
-The average wage in Canada has fallen since 2008 but the 100 wealthiest Canadians have gotten richer by an average of 1.7 billion each
-one of his top aides has been convicted five times (not once or twice but five times) of fraud and is strongly lobbying to have the government to buy water filtration systems for first nations communities from a company that his wife works for. Must be a coincidence.
-the conservatives have broken many campaign funding laws in this election for which 4 of them may face jail time but probably won't since they're Harper's cronies.
-many ombudsman and heads of commissions that bring forward news or info that Harper doesn't like get fired whenever they make this info public. Makes me feel safe.
-the lobby of parliament usually lined with photos and portraits of former Prime Ministers contain only photos of Harper now.
-his desire to scrap the long form census so there is no legitimate accounting of what Canadians truly are like or need. Then he can make decisions based on his wants and not our needs as a country.
-He is a member of the alliance church which believes that the apacolypse will happen in their lifetime, oppose divorce, view homosexuality as a deviant sin, won't ordain women and strongly oppose a woman's right too choose. But many people think that this won't affect his policy?
-He cut $1.2billion for national childcare in one of many moves to privatize many of our government services. To get an idea how well privatization of government institutions works look to South America and their average quality of life.
-He has never followed through on his promise to cut the $1.4 billion in tax breaks for oil companies
And that's just some of it. I had to condense and shorten some of the points and I haven't even covered them all. This is not my opinion, this is not a conspiracy theory, these are things that have happened or are happening that are on the public record. But most voters clearly are unaware of them because Harper excels at smothering the truth. This is also the least transparent government in the history of our country. They have refuse the release of more information (often illegaly) than any previous government by a massive margin.
Any handful of these things would be scary and if you could justify or explain away a couple there is still a staggering list of evil left. Now you tell me if we are overreacting.
Yep, way over reacting! Oh how I remember the Trudeau Liberal days and how so many said the world (well Canada at least) was ending because of some of his beliefs and policies. We got through it just fine. Harper is no better, no worse than many of his predecessors...
So not one of those issues (amongst the many others) matters? If we ignore all that and much more similar behavior to come we can blissfully ignorant and content? Sorry Brent, it's not in my genetic makeup. I fail to see the upside. We put the stewardship of our country into the hands of a person who has demonstrated deplorable judgement. This is cause for concern. Ignoring the truth doesn't make it untrue.
Let me put it this way. Ken Dryden is a sports icon in this country. He is also well liked, respected and a very intelligent man.
No one liked Iggy. Why do you think the Nation voted the way they did. It just ended up that one of the ridings they lost just happened to be his.
Iggy comes back and decides he is going to be the Supreme Ruler. Not like the tard who had his job prior and was going to bring down the Government every 2 weeks and then back off.
Iggy comes back, gets handed the federal leadership, Then decides cause he doesn't like the budget manages to bring down the Minority Conservatives and only shows up less than half the time, along with the Bloc forcing an election that voters never wanted and then shoves a book of promises in Canadians faces that there is no way they can pay for unless they raise taxes. We will raise corporate taxes.
After they do this and more companies close up and move south then the rest of us who still have jobs (If we are lucky) will have to foot the bill.
GST and personal tax hikes were coming if they were elected.
You have to remember Harper was pretty much handcuffed for the last 4 yrs and forced to do stuff he did not want to do.
The Bloc was the same way and look what happened. Bloc is pretty much dead in Quebec and the Liberals have their worst showing ever in Canadian History. LOFL ...
Harper now has a majority and will not be forced into spending money like Devon stated.
And the funding of PP by its supporters comes down to how much money you have. If you're a big oil company you'll "support" the group that supports you. Unfortunately the poor of this country don't have the millions to buy the support in parliament. This is the most disgusting part of the Harper promise to cut off public funding of parties.
Erm . . . most major corporations donate to both sides. It just makes good business sense. That no matter who wins, your company doesn't lose. As for the anti-Israel group that got defunded, boo hoo. This government supports Israel . . . QED.
Because the deficit the conservative are running right now will never have to be paid back.....there will never have to be repercussions for the largest deficit ever....only if you don't plan on paying taxes in the next little while. But good for the countries largest companies. They can take home a few more billion.
Deficits that both Jack and Iggy said needed to be larger to help out every day Canadians. Of course they need to be paid back, but I trust Harper more than the Happy Jack to do that. Maybe not as much as I trusted Paul Martin, but he is out of the picture isn't he?
So not one of those issues (amongst the many others) matters? If we ignore all that and much more similar behavior to come we can blissfully ignorant and content? Sorry Brent, it's not in my genetic makeup. I fail to see the upside. We put the stewardship of our country into the hands of a person who has demonstrated deplorable judgement. This is cause for concern. Ignoring the truth doesn't make it untrue.
First off to call the man evil is wrong period. Evil should be used for people like Hitler, Stalin, Sgt Russell, people who take private or public transportation and blow them up, woman and men who murder their own childern, I look at them to be evil.
Second, if he was as bad as you are saying, and his judgement is way off base, the country has had 3 elections to get rid of him and they have chosen not too. Further more he is getting stronger and stronger with each election the Liberials and NDP have forced. Now at least we can go 5 years before the next election.
Third, seeing as I worked in the corrections of Canada, they are do a raise, never mind the fact that the jails we have are in much needed repair, or should be demolished and rebuild.
Fourth, I see nothing wrong with a politation expressing his religous views before the people for the last 12 years and letting the people decide if they want him to be PM.
As for all the other stuff it seems that the average Canadian doesn't care or likes the direction of the country because he (HARPER) is only getting stronger. Canada seems to be in the top of the polls for places to live. We continue be the envy of others around the world.
Like him or hate Harper connects average Canadians, something the Liberials didn't do this time of round. One thing I know for sure, sooner or later Harper and the Conservatives won't be in goverment.
Out of curosity, did you campeigne for someone in this election? That's how you can make a difference. One of the lowest turns outs at the polls in a while.
Brent
PS I too remember the Trudeau days ... and forutnately Canada is still here.
My biggest concern isn't even party-centric. It's the man the person, Harper. He is a truly awful person and you want him to lead our country because your pissy with the Liberals? That's not making informed decisions as far as I can tell. Do even the slightest amount of research and you will find a long list of shitty, underhanded and truly shitty things he has done. And before people start with the " well all politicians are shitty" you should realize that he is much much worse than any of the other politicians that have lead a legit party for the a very long time.
Highlights of Harper's moves as leader of a minority government:
- appointed a minister of science and technology who does NOT believe in evolution
He was appointed to run the Ministry, not teach the subject. Do you even know what a Minister of the Crown does?
- while crime rates have been falling across the country, his budget plans to double DOUBLE the existing budget for jails
Plenty of room for debate about crime rates, as I can personally attest to now . . .
-cut women's advocacy funding by 40% and shut down 12 of the 16 status of women's offices (after all, he feels they should be silent and in the kitchen)
Citation of his opinions on women, please . . .
-The average wage in Canada has fallen since 2008 but the 100 wealthiest Canadians have gotten richer by an average of 1.7 billion each
Wealthy people usually do well, regardless of the economic situation at a given moment.
-one of his top aides has been convicted five times (not once or twice but five times) of fraud and is strongly lobbying to have the government to buy water filtration systems for first nations communities from a company that his wife works for. Must be a coincidence.
Nope. It's a scummy piece of business. But I do not recall the government signing off on this yet.
-the conservatives have broken many campaign funding laws in this election for which 4 of them may face jail time but probably won't since they're Harper's cronies.
Sponsorship scandal ring a bell?
-many ombudsman and heads of commissions that bring forward news or info that Harper doesn't like get fired whenever they make this info public. Makes me feel safe.
Agreed
-the lobby of parliament usually lined with photos and portraits of former Prime Ministers contain only photos of Harper now.
I'll be in Ottawa this summer, so I'll check this out.
-his desire to scrap the long form census so there is no legitimate accounting of what Canadians truly are like or need. Then he can make decisions based on his wants and not our needs as a country.
Pretty sure there are plenty of polling companies that can pick up the slack.
-He is a member of the alliance church which believes that the apacolypse will happen in their lifetime, oppose divorce, view homosexuality as a deviant sin, won't ordain women and strongly oppose a woman's right too choose. But many people think that this won't affect his policy?
Not sure what his religious views are beyond being Christian. Nor do I care. You think Layton's views do not inform his stances on issues? Or is it that Harper's views conflict with yours?
-He cut $1.2billion for national childcare in one of many moves to privatize many of our government services. To get an idea how well privatization of government institutions works look to South America and their average quality of life.
The Liberals kept promising a National Daycare program but, oddly enough, never got around to it. Even with Majority Parliaments, Why do you think that is?
-He has never followed through on his promise to cut the $1.4 billion in tax breaks for oil companies
Because, beyond a certain point, companies do not pay taxes, they move.
And that's just some of it. I had to condense and shorten some of the points and I haven't even covered them all. This is not my opinion, this is not a conspiracy theory, these are things that have happened or are happening that are on the public record. But most voters clearly are unaware of them because Harper excels at smothering the truth. This is also the least transparent government in the history of our country. They have refuse the release of more information (often illegaly) than any previous government by a massive margin.
Any handful of these things would be scary and if you could justify or explain away a couple there is still a staggering list of evil left. Now you tell me if we are overreacting.
As for your last comments, there are myriad examples of previous governments out right lying to the electorate (I will kill the GST, or how about Trudeau on wage and price controls). Concentration of power in the PMO is not a Conservative idea. Enough people in this country support the message Harper and his party are putting out there. Deal with it.
So not one of those issues (amongst the many others) matters? If we ignore all that and much more similar behavior to come we can blissfully ignorant and content? Sorry Brent, it's not in my genetic makeup. I fail to see the upside. We put the stewardship of our country into the hands of a person who has demonstrated deplorable judgement. This is cause for concern. Ignoring the truth doesn't make it untrue.
You mean as deplorable as forcing the election in the first place? How did that work out for Iggy? You can e-mail him at Harvard next semester . . .
Relax, Shtebs the sky is not falling, and the sun will be out tomorrow.
First off to call the man evil is wrong period. Evil should be used for people like Hitler, Stalin, Sgt Russell, people who take private or public transportation and blow them up, woman and men who murder their own childern, I look at them to be evil.
Second, if he was as bad as you are saying, and his judgement is way off base, the country has had 3 elections to get rid of him and they have chosen not too. Further more he is getting stronger and stronger with each election the Liberials and NDP have forced. Now at least we can go 5 years before the next election.
Third, seeing as I worked in the corrections of Canada, they are do a raise, never mind the fact that the jails we have are in much needed repair, or should be demolished and rebuild.
Fourth, I see nothing wrong with a politation expressing his religous views before the people for the last 12 years and letting the people decide if they want him to be PM.
As for all the other stuff it seems that the average Canadian doesn't care or likes the direction of the country because he (HARPER) is only getting stronger. Canada seems to be in the top of the polls for places to live. We continue be the envy of others around the world.
Like him or hate Harper connects average Canadians, something the Liberials didn't do this time of round. One thing I know for sure, sooner or later Harper and the Conservatives won't be in goverment.
Out of curosity, did you campeigne for someone in this election? That's how you can make a difference. One of the lowest turns outs at the polls in a while.
Brent
PS I too remember the Trudeau days ... and forutnately Canada is still here.
Tldr, and for the record you have zero credibility left with me in terms of politics since I remembered to dig up this beauty from a couple years ago.
Brent
-I never called him evil or drew comparisons to Hitler or Stalin. Nor did I ensinuate he was on par with them. It's not like the only bad people throughout history have been responsible for genocides. There are some bad people who have done bad things that were on a far far lesser scale. The comparison of Harper to any of History's most evil people is silly and has no place in this discussion.
-the reason for my (and many other people's) anger is because people are being so willfully ignorant that they are refusing to listen to anything negative about Harper even though it's true. Not propoganda or slander but facts. Things he has done and is doing. Making the claim that he wins elections, therefore the negative stuff must be untrue is flawed reasoning. Not too mention the fact the roughly 60% of voters did not want him as PM but that's a whole other debate about proportionate representation.
-I don't deny that our corrections system doesn't deserve some attention (and yes I have had a few relatives that have worked for corrections as well) but a double of the budget is a beyond massive increase. On what grounds? What is he intending to do with a super beefed up jail system? All research indicates that increasing incarceration has no effect on reducing crime rate. Especially when the crime rate is already falling.
-Canada is not on the top of any poll in regards to best country to live in, quality of life and overall health. We used to be and we are still in the top 20 in most reliable categories but every year we are falling further down. That is troubling and an omen that should not be ignored.
Milo
-you believe that having someone who doesn't believe in evolution as the Minister of Science is defensible. Seriously? He's sure to do well with that portfolio.
-Rich people do usually weather economic downturns well but the fact they are doing so well while we lost more than 300,000 jobs and the average income dropped in that time span is troubling. Harper's solution? Tax breaks for the rich. Trickle down economics has not worked well anywhere in the world, why do we think it will here? I mean I'm only relying on the fact that it has been tried many times in many countries and it has hurt those countries in the long run.
- the sponsorship scandal had to do with award contracts that were awarded without considering other bidders and then overpaying. Similar to what I mentioned Harper's personal aid is doing in the other part of my post. How can you still be upset about one and dismiss the other. Not too mention that the campaign funding crimes are completely unrelated and the criminals who perpetrated it did so to help keep their power and most likely won't do any time for it.
-Harper's political views are fairly extreme and confllict with those of most Canadians. Another reason he wants the long form census scraped. It is the Canadian governments responsibility to maintain records of it's people, their demographic, income, etc so they can make informed decision based on that. It is not the responsibility of some for profit third party that is not accountable to anyone to provide the government with that info.
-As for my religious views. I have different religious views than those that almost all candidates espoused or claim membership too because it is still political suicide to not belong to an organized religion. So I have always voted for people who have different religious views for me.
-not to defend the liberals but while they didn't move ahead as far as we would like with their national childcare program they didn't move backwards in massive leaps and bounds like Harper has.
- Canada has the largest oil reserves in the world. Yes, the entire world. More than anywhere in the middle east. There is money to be made, taxing companies for access to hundreds of billions of dollars worth of oil will not cause them to all go elsewhere. Their staggering profits will be just fine. They spend millions and millions on lobbying to increase these profits and decrease the governements involvement in their business. Harper is firmly in their back pocket and his decisions in this industry have nothing to do with what is best for Canada.
So many people are glossing over these things with comments like "Well such and such government also did something questionable" or "All politicians lie somewhat". The reality is no Canadian PM has lied this much in a relatively short term and on such a huge scale. Dont' dismiss heinous acts because somebody else has done something bad before. We deserve more and we deserve better. I do not stand for no do I defend any politician of any party when they act in reprehensible manner. Can you say the same?
I especially enjoy the quotes from post 15 and 21. "Welcome to the beginning of the end of the world" and "Armageddon will be here!!!!"
It just got worse from there.
I would like to add that at no point did I say that the world was ending or the sky falling. I've been making statements about some of the many bad things that Harper has done that most people clearly weren't aware of. Many of us see a bad situation in our government that has some long term ramifications that will most likely cause it to get even worse.
Disagree that people are ignoring what you are calling Harper's flaws, merely that the perceive the flaws in the other parties to be worse.
You are right about the oil companies not going elsewhere if we raise the royalties on them to extract the resource. What they will do is pass those expenses on to consumers at all levels of the economy, thus slowing said economy, which is currently the strongest in the OECD.
My point re: scandals, is that all parties have them. It is part and parcel of being in power. How long did it take for some of the Liberal scandals to break? Much longer than the ones you are roasting Harper for, so how is that for Liberal government secrecy?
Census data: Quite frankly, I want government knowing less about me and mine. Quite frankly, I want less government at all levels. There are certain things that government needs to be involved in but, for the most part, I would be more content with government acting as a regulator of the economy, rather than a participant in it.
As for the Science Minister, once again, do you know what is involved with running a government Ministry. His personal views are not relevant, as they will not be part of the decision making process. No one in the Creationist movement is seeking government funding to prove their tomfoolery. His Ministry will be making decisions on funding for various areas of real science, rather than mythology. So, again, what do his religious views matter? That is the type of thinking that dogged Kennedy early in his career (ie he was Catholic and so was beholden to Rome). It is a red herring.
Yup, Harper's views are in such conflict with most Canadians that he was just rewarded with a Majority government, while those who clearly think like you do saw their anointed saviour soundly drubbed out of office. And before you point to Happy Jack, just remember that Quebec's results are more about dissatisfaction with the Bloc than anything else. They certainly were not going to turn to Harper or Iggy to register their displeasure, now were they? Oh, and while you did not specifically refer to Harper as "evil", you did say he was a "truly awful" person in post #74. Po-tay-to, po-tah-to, I guess.
As for whether I blindly agree with the Conservatives on every issue, absolutely not. I think the F-35s are a mistake, but not for the reasons that the opponents of the contract would guess. I would like to see that money spent elsewhere, on things like drones (both recon and armed versions). More SAR and heavy-lift airframes, and rapid deployment forces. I think manned combat aircraft will be an anachronism in a decade or two. Canada has a long history of making sporadic upgrades in it's Armed Forces, so I would like to see us get out ahead of the curve, for once. Buy a shitload of drones for patrolling our far North, and station troops in select bases ready to deploy quickly to any given location in the country
-I never called him evil or drew comparisons to Hitler or Stalin. Nor did I insinuate he was on par with them. It's not like the only bad people throughout history have been responsible for genocides. There are some bad people who have done bad things that were on a far far lesser scale. The comparison of Harper to any of History's most evil people is silly and has no place in this discussion.
Any handful of these things would be scary and if you could justify or explain away a couple there is still a staggering list of evil left. (Your words) Other words could have been chosen and more appropriate, I think.
-the reason for my (and many other people's) anger is because people are being so willfully ignorant that they are refusing to listen to anything negative about Harper even though it's true. Not propaganda or slander but facts. Things he has done and is doing. Making the claim that he wins elections, therefore the negative stuff must be untrue is flawed reasoning.
I am not agreeing or disagreeing with you, the fact is, Canadians feel he is doing a good job and after 2 minority governments they feel it is time to give him MORE POWER. And in our system of government it is enough.
Not to mention the fact the roughly 60% of voters did not want him as PM but that's a whole other debate about proportionate representation.
-I don't deny that our corrections system doesn't deserve some attention (and yes I have had a few relatives that have worked for corrections as well) but a double of the budget is a beyond massive increase. On what grounds?
Most of budgets (at least in the jail I worked at) went to salaries. Jails are in such bad shape and in need of a makeover, that they were giving prisoners 2 days credit for every one day served. So old buildings need to be replaced and it cost money.
What is he intending to do with a super beefed up jail system? All research indicates that increasing incarceration has no effect on reducing crime rate.
There is nothing wrong with being prepared.
I would be open to here suggestions as to what to do with these peopleEspecially when the crime rate is already falling.
-Canada is not on the top of any poll in regards to best country to live in, quality of life and overall health. We used to be and we are still in the top 20 in most reliable categories but every year we are falling further down. That is troubling and an omen that should not be ignored.
I don’t know where we stand today, but top 20 seems pretty good for how many countries there are, never mind the countries that don’t even make the list.
I am going to leave the religious stuff alone, because I think you know where I stand. But I will say this; Canadians know his views and still elected him!! Do you honestly belief you are enlighten to absolute certainty that he is wrong on all the religious views or that they are different from your views. There are lots of great scientists who don’t believe in evolution both past and present. Science hasn’t been always right, it is constantly changing it view throughout history.
I will debate this with you publicly or privately as well as some of the other views he holds in his Christian beliefs.
To be honest, I have tried to keep emotion out of it. As last I made it to personal. I think that Canadians are well aware of some of the points you are making and they still won't Harper as PM. The others parties have taken there fight to the people and lost. 2 leaders have resigned. Canadians won't some stablity at the top and they have spoken for the next 5 years. Shame on the other party leaders for not working harder to convince Canadians he was the wrong man for the job.
Brent
Chris, I guess you will put me on your ignore list then won't you.
You are right about the oil companies not going elsewhere if we raise the royalties on them to extract the resource. What they will do is pass those expenses on to consumers at all levels of the economy, thus slowing said economy, which is currently the strongest in the OECD.
Comments
Because the deficit the conservative are running right now will never have to be paid back.....there will never have to be repercussions for the largest deficit ever....only if you don't plan on paying taxes in the next little while. But good for the countries largest companies. They can take home a few more billion.
Both won their seats. I guess they polled the Liberal party asking who they would support if they were to choose a new leader .
Justin Trudeau 45%
65% want Ignatieff to step down if he was to lose his seat and the election.
Iggy was another in a long list of wrong choices by this party.
Dion came across as a bumbling idiot still managed to finish 2nd
Iggy just pissed a lot of people off. He was not in the house of commons very often and basically came off as booger. ( To put it nicely ) and the liberals pretty much imploded.
If Trudeau becomes the new leader and is half the politician that his Father was he may bring them back.
-Liberals tanked this election so that Trudeau's kid will look like the second coming when they go from 30 seats to 80 in the next election
-Elizabeth May wins the first (legit, non walkover) seat for the Green Party. Congrats to her for helping bring a fringe party to respectability. However, she will end up spending the next 4 years on CPAC (I think that's was it's called) trying to be the daily soundbite. Also funny as all hell, in her victory speech, talking about the beauty of Saanichton. True? Yes. Hilarious? Absolutely since she's only been living there about a year or so as it was her third strategic move to try get elected (London, ON by-election 2007 and Nova Scotia in 2009).
-Tweet OTD: "Conservatives are like Nickleback - I don't know anyone who likes them but they still seem to do well"
-QOTD: "You can fit the entire Bloc Quebecois on my couch!" - Hockref
Finally, I'm moving to Japan. Safer than living in the police state of Stephen Harper's Conservative Majority government for the next four years. Also, the added possibility of super powers is too much to resist.
Good luck with your move!
Come back Jean, please?
Ooh, previous career - assistant bar manager.
Quebecers are steamed and had enough of both the Bloc and the Liberals.
It was reported this morning that over half of the NDP members elected in that province do not speak french. Going to be real interesting.
Liberals made a major mistake choosing Iggy as there leader. Plus a long line of mistakes prior to him coming into the picture.
Here is a guy nobody actually liked. Ken Dryden would have been a good choice.
No one wanted this election , The Liberals and Bloc pretty much forced it.
The proof is in the numbers.
I hope Dalton and his gang watched this last night. The Liberals here in Ontario sealed their fate with the HST.
As far as the deficit is concerned. I really don't have a problem with companies with the exception of a few getting tax breaks. There is a better chance of them staying put than heading south.
There is always going to be a deficit. This debt will never be paid off.
Our military: Believe it or not we have one of the best trained armies in the world. Unfortunately our equipment sucks. I would like to see more money put into defense and Our boys do need those new fighter planes. Regardless of what you think.
Understanding your poker woes more and more.
CTV 2011 Federal Election | Hockey legend Ken Dryden loses bid for fourth term
Ya that's it, tax the companies that actually employ people who pay taxes. They leave, then there is no corporate tax to collect, oh, and no jobs and no taxes from the employees.
In order to keep large employers in a country, you have to give them the incentive to stay. Otherwise, in a global economy, they can set up shop where someone will give them the incentive.
And the largest deficit in history was brought on by the minority government who was told to spend to stimulate the economy, that was facing the biggest recession since the 30s, or be defeated and face another election, by the other parties.
You have to be kidding ? Jean Chretian sabotaged the Liberal Party and created this mess. He never supported Paul Martin, his natural successor, did everything thing in his power to divide the party so he could stay in power longer.
He left just as the sponsorship scandal broke and left the rest to clean up his mess. Its a wonder this hasn't happened sooner.
Highlights of Harper's moves as leader of a minority government:
- appointed a minister of science and technology who does NOT believe in evolution
- while crime rates have been falling across the country, his budget plans to double DOUBLE the existing budget for jails
-cut women's advocacy funding by 40% and shut down 12 of the 16 status of women's offices (after all, he feels they should be silent and in the kitchen)
-The average wage in Canada has fallen since 2008 but the 100 wealthiest Canadians have gotten richer by an average of 1.7 billion each
-one of his top aides has been convicted five times (not once or twice but five times) of fraud and is strongly lobbying to have the government to buy water filtration systems for first nations communities from a company that his wife works for. Must be a coincidence.
-the conservatives have broken many campaign funding laws in this election for which 4 of them may face jail time but probably won't since they're Harper's cronies.
-many ombudsman and heads of commissions that bring forward news or info that Harper doesn't like get fired whenever they make this info public. Makes me feel safe.
-the lobby of parliament usually lined with photos and portraits of former Prime Ministers contain only photos of Harper now.
-his desire to scrap the long form census so there is no legitimate accounting of what Canadians truly are like or need. Then he can make decisions based on his wants and not our needs as a country.
-He is a member of the alliance church which believes that the apacolypse will happen in their lifetime, oppose divorce, view homosexuality as a deviant sin, won't ordain women and strongly oppose a woman's right too choose. But many people think that this won't affect his policy?
-He cut $1.2billion for national childcare in one of many moves to privatize many of our government services. To get an idea how well privatization of government institutions works look to South America and their average quality of life.
-He has never followed through on his promise to cut the $1.4 billion in tax breaks for oil companies
And that's just some of it. I had to condense and shorten some of the points and I haven't even covered them all. This is not my opinion, this is not a conspiracy theory, these are things that have happened or are happening that are on the public record. But most voters clearly are unaware of them because Harper excels at smothering the truth. This is also the least transparent government in the history of our country. They have refuse the release of more information (often illegaly) than any previous government by a massive margin.
Any handful of these things would be scary and if you could justify or explain away a couple there is still a staggering list of evil left. Now you tell me if we are overreacting.
To answer your question YES!!!
So not one of those issues (amongst the many others) matters? If we ignore all that and much more similar behavior to come we can blissfully ignorant and content? Sorry Brent, it's not in my genetic makeup. I fail to see the upside. We put the stewardship of our country into the hands of a person who has demonstrated deplorable judgement. This is cause for concern. Ignoring the truth doesn't make it untrue.
Let me put it this way. Ken Dryden is a sports icon in this country. He is also well liked, respected and a very intelligent man.
No one liked Iggy. Why do you think the Nation voted the way they did. It just ended up that one of the ridings they lost just happened to be his.
Iggy comes back and decides he is going to be the Supreme Ruler. Not like the tard who had his job prior and was going to bring down the Government every 2 weeks and then back off.
Iggy comes back, gets handed the federal leadership, Then decides cause he doesn't like the budget manages to bring down the Minority Conservatives and only shows up less than half the time, along with the Bloc forcing an election that voters never wanted and then shoves a book of promises in Canadians faces that there is no way they can pay for unless they raise taxes. We will raise corporate taxes.
After they do this and more companies close up and move south then the rest of us who still have jobs (If we are lucky) will have to foot the bill.
GST and personal tax hikes were coming if they were elected.
You have to remember Harper was pretty much handcuffed for the last 4 yrs and forced to do stuff he did not want to do.
The Bloc was the same way and look what happened. Bloc is pretty much dead in Quebec and the Liberals have their worst showing ever in Canadian History. LOFL ...
Harper now has a majority and will not be forced into spending money like Devon stated.
Erm . . . most major corporations donate to both sides. It just makes good business sense. That no matter who wins, your company doesn't lose. As for the anti-Israel group that got defunded, boo hoo. This government supports Israel . . . QED.
Deficits that both Jack and Iggy said needed to be larger to help out every day Canadians. Of course they need to be paid back, but I trust Harper more than the Happy Jack to do that. Maybe not as much as I trusted Paul Martin, but he is out of the picture isn't he?
First off to call the man evil is wrong period. Evil should be used for people like Hitler, Stalin, Sgt Russell, people who take private or public transportation and blow them up, woman and men who murder their own childern, I look at them to be evil.
Second, if he was as bad as you are saying, and his judgement is way off base, the country has had 3 elections to get rid of him and they have chosen not too. Further more he is getting stronger and stronger with each election the Liberials and NDP have forced. Now at least we can go 5 years before the next election.
Third, seeing as I worked in the corrections of Canada, they are do a raise, never mind the fact that the jails we have are in much needed repair, or should be demolished and rebuild.
Fourth, I see nothing wrong with a politation expressing his religous views before the people for the last 12 years and letting the people decide if they want him to be PM.
As for all the other stuff it seems that the average Canadian doesn't care or likes the direction of the country because he (HARPER) is only getting stronger. Canada seems to be in the top of the polls for places to live. We continue be the envy of others around the world.
Like him or hate Harper connects average Canadians, something the Liberials didn't do this time of round. One thing I know for sure, sooner or later Harper and the Conservatives won't be in goverment.
Out of curosity, did you campeigne for someone in this election? That's how you can make a difference. One of the lowest turns outs at the polls in a while.
Brent
PS I too remember the Trudeau days ... and forutnately Canada is still here.
As for your last comments, there are myriad examples of previous governments out right lying to the electorate (I will kill the GST, or how about Trudeau on wage and price controls). Concentration of power in the PMO is not a Conservative idea. Enough people in this country support the message Harper and his party are putting out there. Deal with it.
You mean as deplorable as forcing the election in the first place? How did that work out for Iggy? You can e-mail him at Harvard next semester . . .
Relax, Shtebs the sky is not falling, and the sun will be out tomorrow.
Tldr, and for the record you have zero credibility left with me in terms of politics since I remembered to dig up this beauty from a couple years ago.
http://www.pokerforum.ca/f6/us-presidential-election-17687/
I especially enjoy the quotes from post 15 and 21. "Welcome to the beginning of the end of the world" and "Armageddon will be here!!!!"
It just got worse from there.
-I never called him evil or drew comparisons to Hitler or Stalin. Nor did I ensinuate he was on par with them. It's not like the only bad people throughout history have been responsible for genocides. There are some bad people who have done bad things that were on a far far lesser scale. The comparison of Harper to any of History's most evil people is silly and has no place in this discussion.
-the reason for my (and many other people's) anger is because people are being so willfully ignorant that they are refusing to listen to anything negative about Harper even though it's true. Not propoganda or slander but facts. Things he has done and is doing. Making the claim that he wins elections, therefore the negative stuff must be untrue is flawed reasoning. Not too mention the fact the roughly 60% of voters did not want him as PM but that's a whole other debate about proportionate representation.
-I don't deny that our corrections system doesn't deserve some attention (and yes I have had a few relatives that have worked for corrections as well) but a double of the budget is a beyond massive increase. On what grounds? What is he intending to do with a super beefed up jail system? All research indicates that increasing incarceration has no effect on reducing crime rate. Especially when the crime rate is already falling.
-Canada is not on the top of any poll in regards to best country to live in, quality of life and overall health. We used to be and we are still in the top 20 in most reliable categories but every year we are falling further down. That is troubling and an omen that should not be ignored.
Milo
-you believe that having someone who doesn't believe in evolution as the Minister of Science is defensible. Seriously? He's sure to do well with that portfolio.
-Rich people do usually weather economic downturns well but the fact they are doing so well while we lost more than 300,000 jobs and the average income dropped in that time span is troubling. Harper's solution? Tax breaks for the rich. Trickle down economics has not worked well anywhere in the world, why do we think it will here? I mean I'm only relying on the fact that it has been tried many times in many countries and it has hurt those countries in the long run.
- the sponsorship scandal had to do with award contracts that were awarded without considering other bidders and then overpaying. Similar to what I mentioned Harper's personal aid is doing in the other part of my post. How can you still be upset about one and dismiss the other. Not too mention that the campaign funding crimes are completely unrelated and the criminals who perpetrated it did so to help keep their power and most likely won't do any time for it.
-Harper's political views are fairly extreme and confllict with those of most Canadians. Another reason he wants the long form census scraped. It is the Canadian governments responsibility to maintain records of it's people, their demographic, income, etc so they can make informed decision based on that. It is not the responsibility of some for profit third party that is not accountable to anyone to provide the government with that info.
-As for my religious views. I have different religious views than those that almost all candidates espoused or claim membership too because it is still political suicide to not belong to an organized religion. So I have always voted for people who have different religious views for me.
-not to defend the liberals but while they didn't move ahead as far as we would like with their national childcare program they didn't move backwards in massive leaps and bounds like Harper has.
- Canada has the largest oil reserves in the world. Yes, the entire world. More than anywhere in the middle east. There is money to be made, taxing companies for access to hundreds of billions of dollars worth of oil will not cause them to all go elsewhere. Their staggering profits will be just fine. They spend millions and millions on lobbying to increase these profits and decrease the governements involvement in their business. Harper is firmly in their back pocket and his decisions in this industry have nothing to do with what is best for Canada.
So many people are glossing over these things with comments like "Well such and such government also did something questionable" or "All politicians lie somewhat". The reality is no Canadian PM has lied this much in a relatively short term and on such a huge scale. Dont' dismiss heinous acts because somebody else has done something bad before. We deserve more and we deserve better. I do not stand for no do I defend any politician of any party when they act in reprehensible manner. Can you say the same?
I would like to add that at no point did I say that the world was ending or the sky falling. I've been making statements about some of the many bad things that Harper has done that most people clearly weren't aware of. Many of us see a bad situation in our government that has some long term ramifications that will most likely cause it to get even worse.
You are right about the oil companies not going elsewhere if we raise the royalties on them to extract the resource. What they will do is pass those expenses on to consumers at all levels of the economy, thus slowing said economy, which is currently the strongest in the OECD.
My point re: scandals, is that all parties have them. It is part and parcel of being in power. How long did it take for some of the Liberal scandals to break? Much longer than the ones you are roasting Harper for, so how is that for Liberal government secrecy?
Census data: Quite frankly, I want government knowing less about me and mine. Quite frankly, I want less government at all levels. There are certain things that government needs to be involved in but, for the most part, I would be more content with government acting as a regulator of the economy, rather than a participant in it.
As for the Science Minister, once again, do you know what is involved with running a government Ministry. His personal views are not relevant, as they will not be part of the decision making process. No one in the Creationist movement is seeking government funding to prove their tomfoolery. His Ministry will be making decisions on funding for various areas of real science, rather than mythology. So, again, what do his religious views matter? That is the type of thinking that dogged Kennedy early in his career (ie he was Catholic and so was beholden to Rome). It is a red herring.
Yup, Harper's views are in such conflict with most Canadians that he was just rewarded with a Majority government, while those who clearly think like you do saw their anointed saviour soundly drubbed out of office. And before you point to Happy Jack, just remember that Quebec's results are more about dissatisfaction with the Bloc than anything else. They certainly were not going to turn to Harper or Iggy to register their displeasure, now were they? Oh, and while you did not specifically refer to Harper as "evil", you did say he was a "truly awful" person in post #74. Po-tay-to, po-tah-to, I guess.
As for whether I blindly agree with the Conservatives on every issue, absolutely not. I think the F-35s are a mistake, but not for the reasons that the opponents of the contract would guess. I would like to see that money spent elsewhere, on things like drones (both recon and armed versions). More SAR and heavy-lift airframes, and rapid deployment forces. I think manned combat aircraft will be an anachronism in a decade or two. Canada has a long history of making sporadic upgrades in it's Armed Forces, so I would like to see us get out ahead of the curve, for once. Buy a shitload of drones for patrolling our far North, and station troops in select bases ready to deploy quickly to any given location in the country
-I never called him evil or drew comparisons to Hitler or Stalin. Nor did I insinuate he was on par with them. It's not like the only bad people throughout history have been responsible for genocides. There are some bad people who have done bad things that were on a far far lesser scale. The comparison of Harper to any of History's most evil people is silly and has no place in this discussion.
Any handful of these things would be scary and if you could justify or explain away a couple there is still a staggering list of evil left. (Your words) Other words could have been chosen and more appropriate, I think.
-the reason for my (and many other people's) anger is because people are being so willfully ignorant that they are refusing to listen to anything negative about Harper even though it's true. Not propaganda or slander but facts. Things he has done and is doing. Making the claim that he wins elections, therefore the negative stuff must be untrue is flawed reasoning.
I am not agreeing or disagreeing with you, the fact is, Canadians feel he is doing a good job and after 2 minority governments they feel it is time to give him MORE POWER. And in our system of government it is enough.
Not to mention the fact the roughly 60% of voters did not want him as PM but that's a whole other debate about proportionate representation.
-I don't deny that our corrections system doesn't deserve some attention (and yes I have had a few relatives that have worked for corrections as well) but a double of the budget is a beyond massive increase. On what grounds?
Most of budgets (at least in the jail I worked at) went to salaries. Jails are in such bad shape and in need of a makeover, that they were giving prisoners 2 days credit for every one day served. So old buildings need to be replaced and it cost money.
What is he intending to do with a super beefed up jail system? All research indicates that increasing incarceration has no effect on reducing crime rate.
There is nothing wrong with being prepared.
I would be open to here suggestions as to what to do with these peopleEspecially when the crime rate is already falling.
-Canada is not on the top of any poll in regards to best country to live in, quality of life and overall health. We used to be and we are still in the top 20 in most reliable categories but every year we are falling further down. That is troubling and an omen that should not be ignored.
I don’t know where we stand today, but top 20 seems pretty good for how many countries there are, never mind the countries that don’t even make the list.
I am going to leave the religious stuff alone, because I think you know where I stand. But I will say this; Canadians know his views and still elected him!! Do you honestly belief you are enlighten to absolute certainty that he is wrong on all the religious views or that they are different from your views. There are lots of great scientists who don’t believe in evolution both past and present. Science hasn’t been always right, it is constantly changing it view throughout history.
I will debate this with you publicly or privately as well as some of the other views he holds in his Christian beliefs.
To be honest, I have tried to keep emotion out of it. As last I made it to personal. I think that Canadians are well aware of some of the points you are making and they still won't Harper as PM. The others parties have taken there fight to the people and lost. 2 leaders have resigned. Canadians won't some stablity at the top and they have spoken for the next 5 years. Shame on the other party leaders for not working harder to convince Canadians he was the wrong man for the job.
Brent
Chris, I guess you will put me on your ignore list then won't you.
Do you have any idea how the oil companies work?