2011 Election Thread.
This should stir up some kind of crap storm.
Thoughts on who you think is going to win. Majority, Minority,
Maybe a coalition Government,
I could say something about the revelation that Jack Layton was caught in a RUB n TUG but I am going to leave that one alone.
One thing I would like to know is. Were are the Liberals and the NDP going to find all of the money to pay for these big promises.
I can see more jobs heading waaaaaaaaay south if they increase corporate taxes. We saw this during the Bullroney years.
Ignatief keeps saying I am not going to raise personal taxes. Mr McGuinty also said this and look were we are now.
I don't think Mr Harper has done such a bad job here and probably deserves a chance to do something. A majority Government should be in the works. I am getting tired of going to the polls and 300 mil+ of our money being wasted every 2.4 yrs because jack and whomever is leading the Liberals didn't make it to the potty on time.
Thoughts on who you think is going to win. Majority, Minority,
Maybe a coalition Government,
I could say something about the revelation that Jack Layton was caught in a RUB n TUG but I am going to leave that one alone.
One thing I would like to know is. Were are the Liberals and the NDP going to find all of the money to pay for these big promises.
I can see more jobs heading waaaaaaaaay south if they increase corporate taxes. We saw this during the Bullroney years.
Ignatief keeps saying I am not going to raise personal taxes. Mr McGuinty also said this and look were we are now.
I don't think Mr Harper has done such a bad job here and probably deserves a chance to do something. A majority Government should be in the works. I am getting tired of going to the polls and 300 mil+ of our money being wasted every 2.4 yrs because jack and whomever is leading the Liberals didn't make it to the potty on time.
Comments
Internet discussions about politics? No fucking chance.
Also, didn't read Hvee's post, but given track record, I say the opposite.
Mark
Tories win another minority, NDP oust the Lib as Opposition. First vote in the HoC fails, Libs and NDP form a coalition , Jack Layton is the new PM.
There is no way the Liberals will support an NDP goverment with them being subservient.. The other way ok, but not with Ignatieff at the helm. That would be suicide for him...
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Really??
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+1, good troll
You with 52 posts and I am a troll.
I asked a simple question.
Take a pill Mark.
- Conservative minority
- NDP becomes official opposition (but just barely)
- Ignatieff resigns after the election
- Another pointless election within 2 years
but why? in this case he got it spot on.
I have no idea who to vote for yet but I can tell you for damn sure it won't be Harper.
How can you say he has done a good job when,
-he was handed a huge surplus and has parlayed it into a monster deficit (how is that for fiscal conservative)
-Has lied repeatedly to the Canadian public and parliament since he was elected on a platform that was fully loaded with knocking the liberals for not being accountable
-has singlehandedly lost our place on the world stage as a respected country (UN security council anyone? oh yeah, we're not on it and we created the fucking thing)
-told his minions to forge documents to fabricate the position of an investigative panel (no way Oda made that choice on her own)
-tells us 150 million dollar planes will be bought for 75 million.......you kidding? we going to take them with no engines, navigation or weapons?
-will get 'tough on crime' while building jails when crime levels were dropping. Every first year sociology student knows the only way to reduce crime is to invest in education and social programs, not cut them and 'get tough on crime'.
the list goes on and on and on.
"Ignatief keeps saying I am not going to raise personal taxes. Mr McGuinty also said this and look were we are now. "
Yes, we have a health care system brought back from the brink of total collapse (brought on by the common stupidity revolution of Mike Harr-ass) and you can get great service. Trust me I've had the misfortune of having a number of family members have to use these services over the past few years.
Conservative supporters in Canada have no qualms with insulting those who don't hold the same beliefs as them so I see no harm or foul in saying that if you support the conservatives you are a stupid person who can't see what is right in front of them and/or you are completely morally bankrupt.
The major problem with conservative supporters is they won't even look at their opinions and question them to see if they are wrong. This blind devotion leads to what happened to Ontario during the Harr-ass years and the destruction of the states under 8 years of Bush rule.
Whomever you vote for do it with an understanding of what is at stake. At this point I'd vote for the fucking bloc. They will do less to hurt this country trying to break it up than the conservatives will.
not even sure why I wasted my time writing this, the people who need to consider these positions will never get their heads out of their asses long enough to even think about the issues with any level of intelligence. Now begin the attacking of my character and totally disregarding the issues and points I brought up as that is the conservative way.
/end rant
Postcount e-peen ITT.
You didn't actually ask any question. You asked us to give our predictions then proceeded to spout some campaign rhetoric and make an absurd statement that I quoted. You then followed it up with "A majority Government should be in the works" as if that's the only logical outcome.
If you had posted something a little less inflammatory, as Johnnie, Comp and Brenner did, I'd be more willing to participate. However, this is a textbook troll.
Anyways, I'll give you a 6/10. Could've put a bit more rhetoric in there and left out the first sentence that gave away your intention. However, you did get a few bites out of us, so points for that.
I agree with Mike on this. I was starting to compose a rebutal on the pointless part of his last point but it devolved into a multi paragraph tirade about the atrociousness that is the Harper party. I decided against it and deleted it all. As was mentioned above, those that support him are immune to facts and reality and will accept no information that pulls back the curtain on their fearless leader.
For myself, I still haven't decided how I'm going to vote. I'm not excited by an Iggy lead Liberal party (as PM or leader of the opposition), I like Jack Layton's charisma and enthusiasm and I like some of the NDP platform but I'm worried that they have made a lot of promises that they can't keep because they had little likelyhood of getting in anyway (at the beginning of the campaign). Green might be an option to try and send a message to the other parties but I've done some research on my Green candidate and I don't want to put my vote behind this particular person because they are pretty flaky and definitely not a person I want representing me. While I have voted conservative in the past (the old PC, not this party) I would never EVER vote for a Harper lead party. The man is a loathesome prick who I am thoroughly ashamed of to have as the leader of Canada.
If the Conservatives win a Majority, Iggy is done, and he is probably done in any case, which would leave Bob Rae as a caretaker leader until the anointed saviour of the party, Trudeau the younger, can ride in on his double rainbow of salvation. HArper would probably announce that he will not seek re-election, allowing for a stable transition of control of the party to someone who is actually a conservative (hello, Jim Prentice?). I think Layton will be the only current party leader that will still be in Ottawa for the next race, but even that will depend on his health issues.
I am hoping for the following results to come from this election:
I want to see the NDP surge in Quebec be a reality. As much as I loath some of their platforms, and the hypocrisy of certain positions they have contorted themselves into, I despise the Bloc Quebecois even more, and would love to see them decimated as a party.
I want the Liberals to stop acting like the right wing of the NDP, and start acting like the left wing of the Conservative Party again. The budgetary surplus mentioned earlier was a product of Paul Martin's fiscal stewardship. True, it was that stewardship (and the downloading of costs that ensued) which has contributed to some of the problems that exist in various provincial Health Ministries, but those can be resolved without much trouble, if cooperation can be managed.
I want a Conservative Party that runs the way the Big Blue machine did in the 60's and 70's in Ontario. In other words, I want a Conservative Leader who focuses on getting the economy right, and who does not give a rat's ass about a particular social issue beyond what our Constitution says. You want to spend you time with a same sex partner? Great! Just don't forget to pay your taxes, and be courteous to that Muslim family down the block.
You can tell me I am living in Candyland now . . .
+1
We're on a slippery slope towards american conservatism.
And there is blind, unquestioning zealots in all three of the parties, hence the "hidden agenda" fear mongering of the Liberals in previous campaigns, or the NDP wanting to represent "all Canadians" while cozying up to some fairly repugnant niche groups that form the core of their support (at least in the GTA). Conservatives are guilty of all of this too, don't get me wrong. It's part of the reason I feel so saddened that a guy like John Tory was never able to get into power here in Ontario. He is actually a man who believes in public service, and I think a government run by someone of his ilk, would have been very "Canadian" in both outlook and application.
I truly believe that the people most needed in public office these days take one look at the swamp that politics has become and decide quite quickly that they can channel their desire to serve elsewhere.
I mean, take a look at our debt. Any sensible person knows that, to get out of debt, you need to either increase your revenues (raise taxes), or cut your expenses (cut services). Name me one party that is promising to do either one in a believable fashion.
The Conservatives talk about cutting taxes, without cutting program spending,
The NDP talk about increasing spending, and increasing taxes on corporations,
The Liberals want to increase spending, but they'll have to icrease taxes to do it, too.
So, how does that solve our debt/deficit issues?
This is what concerns me most about another Harper win. Not just his win now but what it will mean for Canadian politics down the road. Considering how he was able to get away with all kinds of shit before with his minority government another term of minority means even more "alterations" to Canadian politics to ensure Harper's supremacy in all things. If he gets a majority government then forget about it. He'll be on the fast track to ensuring that the average Canadian knows even less (next to nothing) about what his government is doing and why they are doing it and the weak opposition will be even more ineffective on keeping him in check.
The problem these days is that "politician" is a career choice rather than just another venue for public service.
As for the "Americanization" of our politics, I think you can blame Minority governments in part for this, as all parties know that, with an election possible at any time, they need to position themselves to capitalize on the moment, rather than focus on running the country. Minority parliaments used to be a check on one partiy's ideology. Now, they are simply a means to constantly hammer home their individual talking points, while demonizing the opposition.
CPC 34.6%,
NDP 31.4%,
LPC 20.4%
Even if the numbers are off a bit, I doubt the Cons will drum up enough votes to finally win a majority.
Hell, the NDP might get some strategic votes from the Libs/Bloc and win a few extras seats in Quebec and win a minority government. Stranger things have happened!
I am economically conservative, socially libertarian and, sadly, without a Marijuana Party candidate to waste my vote on. In the past I have voted Conservative, NDP, and even declined my ballot (officially, as opposed to just not showing up). Still not sure who to vote against this time out. I can guarantee it will not be the Liberal candidate, however, as he was less than useless when my wife was trying to sort out her citizenship issues.
Panties . . . and don't you read the posts?
I am thinking of using "1 potato, 2 potato . . .". You can't go too far wrong with a good 1 potato, 2 potato, can you?
Conrad Black: Exeunt the poltroons of separatism | Full Comment | National Post
Take a coin with you and flip it when you get to the ballet box. It gets a laugh every time. I've done it twice. True story.
Of course you do. Does this story sound familiar?
Tories defunding Planned Parenthood, MP says - Canada Votes 2011 - CBC News#
You really don't think there's a chance that with a majority they wouldn't overstep? Please.
EDIT: Also, are you honestly saying Lib's and NDPer's are setting platforms to apease Hindu's and Sikh's? Come on man.
Well.. that's appalling.
Mark
The laundry list of reprehensible behavior of our current PMO is quite long. One of my faves is his appointment of a veteran's ombudsman then firing said ombudsman for taking issue with Harper's plan to massively scale back veterans' rights and benefits. Great move by a person who often claims that the other parties are unpatriotic and don't want to support the military. Again, this man is simply a truly awful person.
As a person who supports the military, Milo, I would think that alone would remove him for consideration. I can't claim to know who the best alternative is but I do know that Harper is the worst.
+1
Mostly I vacillitate being just skipping your posts and going for the ignore button but you nailed it right here.
If that was someone from an official party office, I hope they catch the culprits. Pretty dirty trick.
I did not say that, but would not disagree with it. All parites pander in varying degrees to what they see as their "base". For the Liberals it has traditionally been immigrants, for the NDP it has been the youth vote.
But, to your point, no I do not think that it would happen. Trost is a wing nut back-bencher, and Harper has already said that social issues are off the table as far as he is concerned. So, given the controlling nature he has demonstrated, and people like you vilify him for (rightly, I might add), which will it be? Does Harper decide, or the back-bencher?
As for defunding Planned Parenthood, why not? I think they, like MADD, are no longer the organization they started out to be. I am quite certain that previous governments either cut, or refused to fund, certain groups that might have had a "conservative" outlook, so why the outrage? That is simply politics in this day and age.