I sincerely hope that all those "not voting" responses to the poll are from the younger forum members. Regardless of your political slant, please vote!
I agree with Trevor, if you don't vote ... you can't complain. Personally I usually vote for the candidate that will benefit my community the most. If he/she is crooked and takes all kinds of favors, if that makes my home life in this town better - so be it! All joking aside, I do vote for based on the local politics and usually ignore the party tag on the candidates.
One option people may not know about is to decline your ballot. You show up and register and when they hand you the ballot, you refuse to vote. It throws them into quite a tizzy but they do have to tally it. Basically, you are saying "None of the above". Far better than not bothering to show up.
I have to agree that if you are able and capable of voting you should do so. Â There are members of the armed force past present and future putting their lives at stake for us to cast this vote. Â
That being said stick with the liberals and do not be fooled by Steven Harper. Â Harper reminds me of McGuinty who will promised the world and deilver on nothing but tax increases and broken promises. Â Every one is looking for change and then change brought us worse. Â That's just my 2 cents.
Regardless if it's for the liberals, conservatives, Green or Mary Jane party exercise your right and vote.
Refusing your ballot, or spoliing it was one alternative I was brought up being told is better than not voting. However, after having worked with an elections centre (I was responsible for entering votes into a computer), I would like to point out that there is no record of the number or refused or spoiled ballots... they're not even counted.
Spoiling a ballot is just a matter of principle to me.
If you don't vote, don't bitch about the gov't.
If you spoiled/declined your ballot (even if they don't get counted), then that is how you VOTED.
 Refusing your ballot, or spoliing it was one alternative I was brought up being told is better than not voting. However, after having worked with an elections centre (I was responsible for entering votes into a computer), I would like to point out that there is no record of the number or refused or spoiled ballots... they're not even counted.
Mark
You know what, you're right! Mostly anyway. Your note prompted me to look it up.
It is only declined Ontario Provincial election ballots that are counted as a separate category. Declined federal ballots are counted in the 'Rejected' category. These are supposed to be reported somewhere by somebody... maybe not by you. 'Rejected' includes the ones where you write "F You Mulroney" on the ballot.
'Spoiled' ballots are not counted as they are never given to voters. These are ones that are damaged or determined to be in error before they get to the voters. So when you say you are going to spoil your ballot, technically you can't...
God we are in trouble, I think I'm voting Liberal, at least they are the lesser of all evils (IMHO)....but we are in serious trouble regardless. I have a feeling the Conservatives will win...this is not a good thing, unless you like the way the US is run right now? NDP maybe my second choice...some interesting ideas but we'll be in big trouble financially if they win. Overall it really sucks if these guys are the best our country has to offer!
It is amazing how the media can influence the decisions of Canadian voters in such a big way.
I will be voting Conservative this election. Because I KNOW Stephen Harper is not scary. For those who presume he is, where has this information come from?
5 Seconds clips of news that often dictate the message for the purposes of "selling" themselves?
Or from Liberal ads, that for obvious reasons have a vested interest in creating fear of Mr. Harper.
I sat down and had dinner last year in London with Mr. Harper and his wife - at no time was I afraid.
For the Liberals out there, they can liken this to Dalton McGuinty's first poke at Premiership.
The PCs and the Media defined Dalton before he even had a chance. They painted him as an inexperienced goof, he couldn’t be your premier. As a result, the Harris government won a second majority.
However, much like Stephen Harper today, McGuinty spent some time as leader of the Liberal party and was able to define himself.
Indeed he was not the bumbling idiot he had been defined as the first election.
Last year, Mr. Martin and media was successful in making Stephen Harper look evil using this same strategy - define your opponent before they have the opportunity to define themselves.
This worked as well for Martin with Harper as it had for Harris with McGuinty.
But Harper, like McGuinty, was not what the opposition made him and intelligent Canadians now realize he is not the devil. We were spoon fed stragetic clips by the media and spin doctoring by the Liberals - YES - they same thing Mike Harris successfully did to McGuinty.
However, the PC strategy in next election did not work and McGuinty was elected. Similarly, the Liberal strategy will not work this election and Harper will get elected - with my support.
And as for spoiling ballots - although they are not counted - your name is checked when you arrive at the polling station showing that a ballot was received.
** I tried to be relatively unbiased in my post by showing that defining candidates is successfully completed by each party **
God we are in trouble, I think I'm voting Liberal, at least they are the lesser of all evils (IMHO)....but we are in serious trouble regardless. I have a feeling the Conservatives will win...this is not a good thing, unless you like the way the US is run right now? NDP maybe my second choice...some interesting ideas but we'll be in big trouble financially if they win. Overall it really sucks if these guys are the best our country has to offer!
Even when the Conservatives win, we will still be seen as a left leaning country by the US right wing.
I made a mistake of voting NDP once (remember Bob Rae).
As for the Liberals, do you really want someone in charge of the country that:
steals from us and gives to their friends
wastes our hard earned $$
thinks we cannot take care of our kids without putting them in daycare
only gets tough on crime when i suits them
brags about budget supluses (that were actually created cause they cannot properly forecast) and will not give the money back to the people that it belongs to
It is amazing how the media can influence the decisions of Canadian voters in such a big way.
This is a rediculous statement, how else do people get their information then from different forms of the media? What I got from this is 'I'm smarter then you." Well, you're not!
I will be voting Conservative this election. Because I KNOW Stephen Harper is not scary. For those who presume he is, where has this information come from?
Good for you but how do you know...you had dinner with him and didn't feel scared? Ahhh that's sweet, it's nice he took some people out for dinner before he screws the whole country over.
There is a wealth of information out there if you want to do the research, one link for example:
In particular there is a lot of good stuff in the Leaders, Parties, and Issues section.
I sat down and had dinner last year in London with Mr. Harper and his wife - at no time was I afraid.
LOL, you mean even when he picked up the butter knife? It's amazing how dinner with someone can influence the decisions of Canadian voters in such a big way.
The only thing I agree with in this post is that the Conservatives will win, not because they have a better platfrom but because of the mistakes Paul Martin has made. If you take the time to actually read the platform of each party at this point in time it appears Canada is better off with the Liberals in power.
As for the Liberals, do you really want someone in charge of the country that:
steals from us and gives to their friends
wastes our hard earned $$
thinks we cannot take care of our kids without putting them in daycare
only gets tough on crime when i suits them
brags about budget supluses (that were actually created cause they cannot properly forecast) and will not give the money back to the people that it belongs to
To answer your question, no....but are the alternatives better? IMHO NO!
Here are some more links to information people may or may not want?
Even when the Conservatives win, we will still be seen as a left leaning country by the US right wing.
I made a mistake of voting NDP once (remember Bob Rae).
As for the Liberals, do you really want someone in charge of the country that:
steals from us and gives to their friends
wastes our hard earned $$
thinks we cannot take care of our kids without putting them in daycare
only gets tough on crime when i suits them
brags about budget supluses (that were actually created cause they cannot properly forecast) and will not give the money back to the people that it belongs to
Just my hard earned 2cents....
Hobbes
Personally I feel that this election 2 years pre-mature is a gigantic waste of $$. For that I blame the opposition, which is mostly the conservatives. We will likely end up with another minority government which means we haven't taken a step forward, but prolonged the pain and might have another upheaval in 2 years again anyway. Elections are not cheap to run (the actual vote counting/collecting/etc.). That is actually the issue that has angered me the most this election.
The media is the only source of information most people get and they have to decide what they believe in and what they do not. Â I think the liberal campaign was poorly run but they have my vote because Harper has views that can be deemed extreme in this day in age. He has in the past and has yet to firmly state that they have changed. Â
Missile Defense he will revisit -- I am not in favour of that.
Same Sex Marriage - Â If you want to I do not see a problem with it. Â This will be revisited.
GST reduction -- I would benefit more from it then a income tax cut but I think it takes to much out of public coffers and therefore will lead to cuts somewhere else.
Daycare - Â Let's give everyone $1200 a year then tax it charge GST on the services and in the end you get a buck a day. Â Maybe you can buy a computer from the buck a day company.
Rebate for commuters using transit- Â This is a total buying vote pledge as it will not change anyone's driving habits. Â It is a cry to buy Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver votes. Â Hmm last I checked Toronto and Montreal were Liberal strongholds. Â There needs to be a plan to actually get people on the rail and commuting much like there is in Europe. Cash handouts serve no purpose. Â That being said I do not think the liberals have a plan for this either.
Iraq ?? Where does Harper stand. Â I have yet to clearly see anything come out of Harper's mouth to say Canada will go into Iraq or we won't? Â Canada will be peacekeeping or go into combat? Â I personally would have a problem with any Canadian troops in Iraq in any form.
The only benefit that a Harper government would bring is better US/Canada relations. Â I agree with the Liberals in terms of keeping Canada as much Canadian as it can be. Reality thou is that Canada is largely influenced by the US and we do share western values and given that we should be closer to best friends and set aside some of the differences in order to keep North America prospering, clean and safe. Â
As I was writing I see three more responses. Â
Hobbes I guarantee that every level of government in any democratic country wastes money. Â That's what government does. Â I didn't see the Conservative opposition introduce to many crime platforms in the last 5 years. Â It seems like now it suits them as well. Â Opposition party do introduce bills that governments pass. Â But where were the Conservatives then???
It is better to be conservative on your budget forcasts then spend beyond your means. Â The liberals should be praised for the surpluses. Â Now what they do with them is up to another debate. Â
I agree that the election is premature and is due to the conservatives. They trash Martin on wanting to hold on to power daily but then let's think at what cost does Harper want to get into power. I am guessing the election could be comparable to the sponsorship scandel in costs. Hmm makes you wonder.
Regardless I think everyone should vote but it is pretty clear where I will be putting my X. Â
It is amazing how the media can influence the decisions of Canadian voters in such a big way.
This is a rediculous statement, how else do people get their information then from different forms of the media? What I got from this is 'I'm smarter then you." Well, you're not!
The media mis-reports so many things (both from the right and the left), that I almost ignore traditional news outlets now. Â Most people do get their information from these and are easily influenced. Â The few who actually dig a little deeper will still differ in their opinions, but do so based on the facts and there values, not how they are reported. Â I love democracy, but I believe it is too heavily and negatively affected by a combination of media-influence and apathy. Â While I want the conservatives to win this election, I believe any victory they achieve will not be based on there actual value, but on media image, and will be slightly hollow. Â Based on how Harper was previously (incorrectly) painted by the media, the low poll numbers were again media-based rather than factually-based.
To answer your question, no....but are the alternatives better? IMHO NO!
This really depends on what you believe and value. Â While I disagree with your assessment of the alternatives, I'm glad that you posted those links. Â "Thinking votes" are what we need, rather than just the party-line or media-darlings.
Harper has views that can be deemed extreme in this day in age
You view Harper as extreme compared to the current norms. I view the current norms as extreme and Harper as a return to something more acceptable. That's why we get to vote
Harper has views that can be deemed extreme in this day in age
You view Harper as extreme compared to the current norms. I view the current norms as extreme and Harper as a return to something more acceptable. That's why we get to vote
Well said and I respect that. That is why Canada is a great place to live as we can all agree to disagree and most of the time can have a beer or two while doing so. MMM beer
That is why Canada is a great place to live as we can all agree to disagree and most of the time can have a beer or two while doing so.  MMM beer
LOL - that made me think of the hockey game from "Canadian Bacon". Say anything you want, vote for who you want, but never ever say "Canadian beer sucks!".
Comments
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That being said stick with the liberals and do not be fooled by Steven Harper. Â Harper reminds me of McGuinty who will promised the world and deilver on nothing but tax increases and broken promises. Â Every one is looking for change and then change brought us worse. Â That's just my 2 cents.
Regardless if it's for the liberals, conservatives, Green or Mary Jane party exercise your right and vote.
I don't like Steven Harper. He'll do far more harm than good.
I dislike the Liberals, even more since this horrible new ad camapign.
NDP. Uh, Bob Rae anyone?
Green. Ha. They're as good as the Hippos.
Thanks
Couldn't for the life of me, remember the Rhino Party last night
Not all memories are good
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Refusing your ballot, or spoliing it was one alternative I was brought up being told is better than not voting. However, after having worked with an elections centre (I was responsible for entering votes into a computer), I would like to point out that there is no record of the number or refused or spoiled ballots... they're not even counted.
Mark
If you don't vote, don't bitch about the gov't.
If you spoiled/declined your ballot (even if they don't get counted), then that is how you VOTED.
Remember VOTE EARLY...VOTE OFTEN...
Hobbes
It is only declined Ontario Provincial election ballots that are counted as a separate category. Declined federal ballots are counted in the 'Rejected' category. These are supposed to be reported somewhere by somebody... maybe not by you. 'Rejected' includes the ones where you write "F You Mulroney" on the ballot.
'Spoiled' ballots are not counted as they are never given to voters. These are ones that are damaged or determined to be in error before they get to the voters. So when you say you are going to spoil your ballot, technically you can't...
JohnnieH
ps..Go Marxist-Leninist Party!! JUST KIDDING!!!!
ScottyZ
I will be voting Conservative this election. Because I KNOW Stephen Harper is not scary. For those who presume he is, where has this information come from?
5 Seconds clips of news that often dictate the message for the purposes of "selling" themselves?
Or from Liberal ads, that for obvious reasons have a vested interest in creating fear of Mr. Harper.
I sat down and had dinner last year in London with Mr. Harper and his wife - at no time was I afraid.
For the Liberals out there, they can liken this to Dalton McGuinty's first poke at Premiership.
The PCs and the Media defined Dalton before he even had a chance. They painted him as an inexperienced goof, he couldn’t be your premier. As a result, the Harris government won a second majority.
However, much like Stephen Harper today, McGuinty spent some time as leader of the Liberal party and was able to define himself.
Indeed he was not the bumbling idiot he had been defined as the first election.
Last year, Mr. Martin and media was successful in making Stephen Harper look evil using this same strategy - define your opponent before they have the opportunity to define themselves.
This worked as well for Martin with Harper as it had for Harris with McGuinty.
But Harper, like McGuinty, was not what the opposition made him and intelligent Canadians now realize he is not the devil. We were spoon fed stragetic clips by the media and spin doctoring by the Liberals - YES - they same thing Mike Harris successfully did to McGuinty.
However, the PC strategy in next election did not work and McGuinty was elected. Similarly, the Liberal strategy will not work this election and Harper will get elected - with my support.
And as for spoiling ballots - although they are not counted - your name is checked when you arrive at the polling station showing that a ballot was received.
** I tried to be relatively unbiased in my post by showing that defining candidates is successfully completed by each party **
Even when the Conservatives win, we will still be seen as a left leaning country by the US right wing.
I made a mistake of voting NDP once (remember Bob Rae).
As for the Liberals, do you really want someone in charge of the country that:
Just my hard earned 2cents....
Hobbes
Good for you but how do you know...you had dinner with him and didn't feel scared? Ahhh that's sweet, it's nice he took some people out for dinner before he screws the whole country over.
There is a wealth of information out there if you want to do the research, one link for example:
http://www.cbc.ca/canadavotes
In particular there is a lot of good stuff in the Leaders, Parties, and Issues section.
LOL, you mean even when he picked up the butter knife? It's amazing how dinner with someone can influence the decisions of Canadian voters in such a big way.
The only thing I agree with in this post is that the Conservatives will win, not because they have a better platfrom but because of the mistakes Paul Martin has made. If you take the time to actually read the platform of each party at this point in time it appears Canada is better off with the Liberals in power.
To answer your question, no....but are the alternatives better? IMHO NO!
Here are some more links to information people may or may not want?
http://www.votebyissue.org/cbc/
http://www.canadawebpages.com
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&pubid=968163964505&cid=1137624636564&col=968705899037&call_page=TS_News&call_pageid=968332188492&call_pagepath=News/News
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1137193812025&call_pageid=968256290204&col=968350116795
Personally I feel that this election 2 years pre-mature is a gigantic waste of $$. For that I blame the opposition, which is mostly the conservatives. We will likely end up with another minority government which means we haven't taken a step forward, but prolonged the pain and might have another upheaval in 2 years again anyway. Elections are not cheap to run (the actual vote counting/collecting/etc.). That is actually the issue that has angered me the most this election.
Missile Defense he will revisit -- I am not in favour of that.
Same Sex Marriage - Â If you want to I do not see a problem with it. Â This will be revisited.
GST reduction -- I would benefit more from it then a income tax cut but I think it takes to much out of public coffers and therefore will lead to cuts somewhere else.
Daycare - Â Let's give everyone $1200 a year then tax it charge GST on the services and in the end you get a buck a day. Â Maybe you can buy a computer from the buck a day company.
Rebate for commuters using transit- Â This is a total buying vote pledge as it will not change anyone's driving habits. Â It is a cry to buy Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver votes. Â Hmm last I checked Toronto and Montreal were Liberal strongholds. Â There needs to be a plan to actually get people on the rail and commuting much like there is in Europe. Cash handouts serve no purpose. Â That being said I do not think the liberals have a plan for this either.
Iraq ?? Where does Harper stand. Â I have yet to clearly see anything come out of Harper's mouth to say Canada will go into Iraq or we won't? Â Canada will be peacekeeping or go into combat? Â I personally would have a problem with any Canadian troops in Iraq in any form.
The only benefit that a Harper government would bring is better US/Canada relations. Â I agree with the Liberals in terms of keeping Canada as much Canadian as it can be. Reality thou is that Canada is largely influenced by the US and we do share western values and given that we should be closer to best friends and set aside some of the differences in order to keep North America prospering, clean and safe. Â
As I was writing I see three more responses. Â
Hobbes I guarantee that every level of government in any democratic country wastes money. Â That's what government does. Â I didn't see the Conservative opposition introduce to many crime platforms in the last 5 years. Â It seems like now it suits them as well. Â Opposition party do introduce bills that governments pass. Â But where were the Conservatives then???
It is better to be conservative on your budget forcasts then spend beyond your means. Â The liberals should be praised for the surpluses. Â Now what they do with them is up to another debate. Â
I agree that the election is premature and is due to the conservatives. They trash Martin on wanting to hold on to power daily but then let's think at what cost does Harper want to get into power. I am guessing the election could be comparable to the sponsorship scandel in costs. Hmm makes you wonder.
Regardless I think everyone should vote but it is pretty clear where I will be putting my X. Â
The media mis-reports so many things (both from the right and the left), that I almost ignore traditional news outlets now. Â Most people do get their information from these and are easily influenced. Â The few who actually dig a little deeper will still differ in their opinions, but do so based on the facts and there values, not how they are reported. Â I love democracy, but I believe it is too heavily and negatively affected by a combination of media-influence and apathy. Â While I want the conservatives to win this election, I believe any victory they achieve will not be based on there actual value, but on media image, and will be slightly hollow. Â Based on how Harper was previously (incorrectly) painted by the media, the low poll numbers were again media-based rather than factually-based.
This really depends on what you believe and value. Â While I disagree with your assessment of the alternatives, I'm glad that you posted those links. Â "Thinking votes" are what we need, rather than just the party-line or media-darlings.
You view Harper as extreme compared to the current norms. I view the current norms as extreme and Harper as a return to something more acceptable. That's why we get to vote
Say the following three times. I guarentee you will not be able to complete the third iteration without throwing up.
Primie Minister Stephen Harper
Ugh, I think I'm gonna be sick..
It's funny because it's true LOL. I almost choked.
Well said and I respect that. That is why Canada is a great place to live as we can all agree to disagree and most of the time can have a beer or two while doing so. MMM beer