13 Cards makes the effort to come on this board in the face of constant flaming for what? He is a masochist? Not likely. I think he does it to try and improve his room. Get some feedback, use it to improve. Makes sense to me, but just my opinion.
He does get a bit too defensive sometimes but I can see where it comes from. I would get defensive if I was surrounded by a bunch of Jackals too. Everything he seems to say gets taken to the Nth degree and attacked.
From personal experience I have never seen a dealer error in the room (Nor have I played there a ton), but I have seen a ton of assholish behavior at the tables (all from players).
LOL at people running in to defend BBC. The guy is both sharp and funny and but he opened the door on this one. If you want to be critical of others make sure your post doesn't read like it was written by a 4 year old.
If you want to be critical of others make sure your post doesn't read like it was written by a 4 year old.
You're right, the picture 13cards put up showing the mistake instead of further response to the many unanswered questions was much more mature and classy.
PSST...I am being sarcastic.
I don't normally beat dead horses since the live ones make more interesting sounds, my opinion of the 'why 13cards would post here' is well documented, and has nothing to do with furthering his profession or masochism.
I don't normally beat dead horses since the live ones make more interesting sounds, my opinion of the 'why 13cards would post here' is well documented, and has nothing to do with furthering his profession or masochism.
i'm guessing that by about pg 8 we'll have some discussion of what the actual rule is and how it should be interpreted here...
agreed! let's try to get on topic. personally, i don't think it's right to try and look in the muck for the board cards. the dealer made a mistake and the board cards are gone. deal with it. as far as who wins the hand? i really don't know. split it perhaps? if i personally had the busted K high flush and knew i lost to the A high i'd give him the pot. however, if i had the A high, i don't think i could just demand the other guy to give it to me (even though i do deserve it). other than split i don't know what else to do. sucks to be the two guys in the pot when the dealer fucks up i guess.
The bigger issue here is the way most people play at FV. They all like to pretend they are on tv..more often than not when someone tries to pull a bluff and they get caught there is this 30 second stare down when they should just open their cards. Its like high noon at the o'kay coral or something.
Mix that in with dealers who can barely pitch properly (just calling it as it is...and there is nothing we can do about it as the best dealers deal underground which is a widely known fact...due to $$$) it just adds for a mess.
The fact that both of these players were trying to angle shoot each other is ridiculous. Flip your hand, be awarded the pot and be done with it.
I tell players this all the time at fallsview, it wastes time and it kills the session.
I mean really, the calibur of play at fallsview does not warrant such tv antics....but I guess that is why it is the biggest fish tank this side of the border....lol
Not posting much but this interests me (and I didn't get in on the last Fallsview thread ).
From a purely technical point-of-view, I agree with 13 - don't touch the muck. Reconstruct the pot from memory (of dealer/players), and go to the camera if the 2 players in the hand don't agree on the board. Then award the pot to the winner.
However, from a customer-service perspective, I'd offer to reimburse the first player. Yes, he's acting like an idiot, but the house made a mistake. You can't expect dealers to be perfect, and the casino should treat these errors as a cost of doing business. While I don't run a casino, when I have made mistakes with a ruling in my home games, I have offered to reimburse the players (and I've seen Zithal do this at Bristol as well). My games are rake-free, so this is purely out-of-pocket, but worth it to me to maintain my reputation. Considering the revenue Fallsview makes from rake/session-fee, and the goodwill they lose with their customers, I'd think this would be a no-brainer. However, I do only run rake-free home-games, not a for-profit casino, and I have a lot of local competition (with Bristol, g2, Moose, etc.) rather than a monopoly, so I can see why they might not want to do this...
I am so glad that no one here ever makes mistakes at their job.
The business I am in is highly competitive. Most customers will purchase from the company that makes them feel the most "warm and fuzzy", or that they feel they are getting the best value from. Usually it is a combination of the two.
Having said that, when I or one of my staff makes a mistake, the first thing I do is accept responsibility, the second is to compensate the customer. Either with price, service or product. Otherwise they lose that warm feeling which has a negative impact on the short and long term effects of my company.
Hey, did someone call for a cab? By the way, you can leave that popcorn where it is, and wash your greasy hands before getting in please. i just had this baby detailed.
Good post Trevor, (beanie42) in case some don't know. Now we see why there is very little controversy at most any of the local home games. These guys, g2, Trevor, Zithal, Moose, and yes even Buzzzarrd Dave are stand up guys, who's reputation seems to be very important to them.
This could get very good and I have no intention of pulling any mod stuff.. lol. We may get some fatalities out of this one. Any of you guys want to order pepi's to go along with the popcorn... Rob, have you got the BBQ ready yet....
I'm going to play devil's advocate here or what not.
Honestly speaking, I've played there probably between 20-30 times now. Whether it was 1/2, 2/5, or 5/5, I haven't encountered any of the problems I have read about here. I've encounter some slow dealers, once in awhile some guys would be loud/obnxious at the table (heck, I've played with Mario and they go beyond him love you malt!), but have had no issues other than a couple of problems I had with dealers/players at the WPT satellites but I already discussed this with Jason while he was still the PR manager. While these occurences are probably not isolated as there has been many documented, are we being overly criticle to the staff/other players due to our "superior" knowledge of the games and the rule of the game?
Hopefully my next trip down in a couple of weeks will be like my previous ones...
I hate angle shooting, & lately there is lots of it unfortunately. It really ruins the game for newbs (whom make us $) when they feel they've been taken advantage of.
I also hate how everyone at FV refuses to show their hand at showdown (despite being the aggressor), yet refuse to muck. If you were the aggressor, you're 1st to show, unless you wanna muck. I don't know why guys can't get this concept. For example, a guy bets a marginal hand, gets called, yet waits 30 s for the caller to show.
Even better is when the aggressor has close to the nuts, yet still refuses to show until the caller shows, then they slam down their hand. Wow, you're so good at slowrolling, congrats.
The business I am in is highly competitive. Most customers will purchase from the company that makes them feel the most "warm and fuzzy", or that they feel they are getting the best value from. Usually it is a combination of the two.
Having said that, when I or one of my staff makes a mistake, the first thing I do is accept responsibility, the second is to compensate the customer. Either with price, service or product. Otherwise they lose that warm feeling which has a negative impact on the short and long term effects of my company.
But that just me.
This is unfortunately very true in the business world these days. I screwed up....I'll just eat it. I didn't communicate perfectly with my customer.....I'll eat it. I made you wait a little bit to see me...I'll discount you.
Think about what this says to your customers. It tells them that your service or product has no real value in the marketplace, that you have nothing to offer that is different or better than the next guy so at the first opportunity you will drop your pants and get it fed to you.
If you act in business like you are selling a commodity you end up dealing with all of the shitty customers who shop the shit out of you, want everything for nothing and never give you word of mouth advertising because you didn't really make them believe you offered something special. If you can offer quality service and product, attention to detail and a little bit of humanity warts and all people will love you for it.
I don't think that Falls view should be offering money up from their coffers to pay for dealer errors. As a player you should be protecting your own cards, following the action, and making sure nothing gets screwed up before you get paid. If it happens to some other mouth breather at the table too bad, maybe he'll pay attention net time.
I don't think that Falls view should be offering money up from their coffers to pay for dealer errors. As a player you should be protecting your own cards, following the action, and making sure nothing gets screwed up before you get paid. If it happens to some other mouth breather at the table too bad, maybe he'll pay attention net time.
So, in this scenario, I have to protect my cards, and also what, judo chop the dealer when he goes to prematurely muck the board?
Okay.. I suggest we get 4-5 forumers to go to FV, and bring LANCES for our card protectors... that way they're long enough to protect the board / repel incompetent dealers....
And think how good it'll look on TV alone with our slowrolling.
So, in this scenario, I have to protect my cards, and also what, judo chop the dealer when he goes to prematurely muck the board?
Okay.. I suggest we get 4-5 forumers to go to FV, and bring LANCES for our card protectors... that way they're long enough to protect the board / repel incompetent dealers....
And think how good it'll look on TV alone with our slowrolling.
Mark
Or when the dealer reached for the board cards you could say, "Whoa, wait a minute....Who has the best hand here?" Either that or just continue to breathe out of your mouth until you have something to bitch about and then come to life.
Comments
13 Cards makes the effort to come on this board in the face of constant flaming for what? He is a masochist? Not likely. I think he does it to try and improve his room. Get some feedback, use it to improve. Makes sense to me, but just my opinion.
He does get a bit too defensive sometimes but I can see where it comes from. I would get defensive if I was surrounded by a bunch of Jackals too. Everything he seems to say gets taken to the Nth degree and attacked.
From personal experience I have never seen a dealer error in the room (Nor have I played there a ton), but I have seen a ton of assholish behavior at the tables (all from players).
LOL at people running in to defend BBC. The guy is both sharp and funny and but he opened the door on this one. If you want to be critical of others make sure your post doesn't read like it was written by a 4 year old.
You're right, the picture 13cards put up showing the mistake instead of further response to the many unanswered questions was much more mature and classy.
PSST...I am being sarcastic.
I don't normally beat dead horses since the live ones make more interesting sounds, my opinion of the 'why 13cards would post here' is well documented, and has nothing to do with furthering his profession or masochism.
Seats available plus I picked up a case of the new Lakeport Ale which isn't bad.
Good thing, cause it looks like we may be here a while.
That is lot of words to say nothing.
What is his purpose here, if I may ask?
someone besides me sees the humour here right?
Edit: ok, I'll try to find the link
here ya go: http://www.pokerforum.ca/f7/my-first-pda-public-display-asshole-ishness-15012/#post139888
So you are saying that his underlying purpose for coming to this forum is to call a spade a spade?
agreed! let's try to get on topic. personally, i don't think it's right to try and look in the muck for the board cards. the dealer made a mistake and the board cards are gone. deal with it. as far as who wins the hand? i really don't know. split it perhaps? if i personally had the busted K high flush and knew i lost to the A high i'd give him the pot. however, if i had the A high, i don't think i could just demand the other guy to give it to me (even though i do deserve it). other than split i don't know what else to do. sucks to be the two guys in the pot when the dealer fucks up i guess.
Chop it and move on.
Jeezus H guys, will you moose or Hobbes please give me call when we have one brewing? Please pass me a cold one.
Mix that in with dealers who can barely pitch properly (just calling it as it is...and there is nothing we can do about it as the best dealers deal underground which is a widely known fact...due to $$$) it just adds for a mess.
The fact that both of these players were trying to angle shoot each other is ridiculous. Flip your hand, be awarded the pot and be done with it.
I tell players this all the time at fallsview, it wastes time and it kills the session.
I mean really, the calibur of play at fallsview does not warrant such tv antics....but I guess that is why it is the biggest fish tank this side of the border....lol
Why did 13cards tell you that basic competency is out of your reach today?
The link takes you to a specific post... of mine.
edit: LMFAO!!!! It is random when the computer logs Itsame on...but the timing is PRICELESS
From a purely technical point-of-view, I agree with 13 - don't touch the muck. Reconstruct the pot from memory (of dealer/players), and go to the camera if the 2 players in the hand don't agree on the board. Then award the pot to the winner.
However, from a customer-service perspective, I'd offer to reimburse the first player. Yes, he's acting like an idiot, but the house made a mistake. You can't expect dealers to be perfect, and the casino should treat these errors as a cost of doing business. While I don't run a casino, when I have made mistakes with a ruling in my home games, I have offered to reimburse the players (and I've seen Zithal do this at Bristol as well). My games are rake-free, so this is purely out-of-pocket, but worth it to me to maintain my reputation. Considering the revenue Fallsview makes from rake/session-fee, and the goodwill they lose with their customers, I'd think this would be a no-brainer. However, I do only run rake-free home-games, not a for-profit casino, and I have a lot of local competition (with Bristol, g2, Moose, etc.) rather than a monopoly, so I can see why they might not want to do this...
Good call. And its only been a few hours too.
The business I am in is highly competitive. Most customers will purchase from the company that makes them feel the most "warm and fuzzy", or that they feel they are getting the best value from. Usually it is a combination of the two.
Having said that, when I or one of my staff makes a mistake, the first thing I do is accept responsibility, the second is to compensate the customer. Either with price, service or product. Otherwise they lose that warm feeling which has a negative impact on the short and long term effects of my company.
But that just me.
And know when NOT to mess up?
Mark
. . . So, where to? ^-^
This could get very good and I have no intention of pulling any mod stuff.. lol. We may get some fatalities out of this one. Any of you guys want to order pepi's to go along with the popcorn... Rob, have you got the BBQ ready yet....
Honestly speaking, I've played there probably between 20-30 times now. Whether it was 1/2, 2/5, or 5/5, I haven't encountered any of the problems I have read about here. I've encounter some slow dealers, once in awhile some guys would be loud/obnxious at the table (heck, I've played with Mario and they go beyond him
Hopefully my next trip down in a couple of weeks will be like my previous ones...
I also hate how everyone at FV refuses to show their hand at showdown (despite being the aggressor), yet refuse to muck. If you were the aggressor, you're 1st to show, unless you wanna muck. I don't know why guys can't get this concept. For example, a guy bets a marginal hand, gets called, yet waits 30 s for the caller to show.
Even better is when the aggressor has close to the nuts, yet still refuses to show until the caller shows, then they slam down their hand. Wow, you're so good at slowrolling, congrats.
This is unfortunately very true in the business world these days. I screwed up....I'll just eat it. I didn't communicate perfectly with my customer.....I'll eat it. I made you wait a little bit to see me...I'll discount you.
Think about what this says to your customers. It tells them that your service or product has no real value in the marketplace, that you have nothing to offer that is different or better than the next guy so at the first opportunity you will drop your pants and get it fed to you.
If you act in business like you are selling a commodity you end up dealing with all of the shitty customers who shop the shit out of you, want everything for nothing and never give you word of mouth advertising because you didn't really make them believe you offered something special. If you can offer quality service and product, attention to detail and a little bit of humanity warts and all people will love you for it.
I don't think that Falls view should be offering money up from their coffers to pay for dealer errors. As a player you should be protecting your own cards, following the action, and making sure nothing gets screwed up before you get paid. If it happens to some other mouth breather at the table too bad, maybe he'll pay attention net time.
So, in this scenario, I have to protect my cards, and also what, judo chop the dealer when he goes to prematurely muck the board?
Okay.. I suggest we get 4-5 forumers to go to FV, and bring LANCES for our card protectors... that way they're long enough to protect the board / repel incompetent dealers....
And think how good it'll look on TV alone with our slowrolling.
Mark
/g2
Or when the dealer reached for the board cards you could say, "Whoa, wait a minute....Who has the best hand here?" Either that or just continue to breathe out of your mouth until you have something to bitch about and then come to life.