Guys, I understand your concern. I have discussed this issue with all_aces, as well as sloth. Both all_aces and myself decided this issue should be left to sloth for various reasons. Here is a couple of quotes from my conversation with him which will explain our reasoning to leave the decision to Neil. (He words it much better than I do)
As for the matter at hand, I can see the problem. When does it stop being a "Home Game" and start being advertising for a club that takes a piece of each pot? Hmmm.... Maybe it would be best to implement a policy for the Home Games section that says it's just for non-raked games. Raked games can advertise in the advertising section. The problem with that is that NO games are legally supposed to be raked, so specifying that the Home Games section is to be for NON-raked games is, in a way, acknowledging that there are a lot of illegal raked games happening out there.
I don't think we can simply go ahead and delete some of the posts, and leave others, without specifying a set of guidelines as to what is and what is not acceptable. The trouble will lie in the wording of said guidelines. Since we are skirting some legal issues here, as well as possibly pissing off some of the heavy hitters of the underground poker scene, I think this is a decision that should be left to Neil. Not trying to pass the buck, but it is his site and he is responsible for it to some extent.
As far as Neil making the decision, I have been in touch with him and he knows of the situation. He last contacted me about 48 hours ago, and I have replied but haven't heard from him yet. Once a decision has been made on his end, I will make sure it will be passed down and actions will be taken whatever they might be. I hope you guys understand this situation and how in some ways, our hands are still tied for the time being.
The problem with that is that NO games are legally supposed to be raked, so specifying that the Home Games section is to be for NON-raked games is, in a way, acknowledging that there are a lot of illegal raked games happening out there.
I understand the concerns about separating games based on rake, since that could cause problems legally. As a suggestion, "Home Games" could be for games played in a persons home. Me, Zithal, g2, JohnnieH, etc. all host games where we live, in our residence. If somebody hosts a game in a hall, club, or bar, who cares if it's raked or not, it's not a home game. For example, "Lucky Lou" wasn't raked, but it sure wasn't a home game.
If you keep the definition fairly basic, where "Home Game" means "game in your home", it simplifies things (I think). There may still be a few raked games in the Home Games section, but I can live with that, since it would curb 90% of the problem.
I think one possible ways that we might go with (again, pending Neil's decision) is that we will have one section for Home Games, and one section for other games. That will includes any club games, bar games, etc etc. Again, all that have to wait until Neil makes a decision on the subject, and then most likely I will get on moving threads around and cleaning it up a bit.
Couldn't an 'ignore' feature be added to this site? This was we could simply ignore such posters as 'THE UNIT' among other clubs and wouldn't have to see all of there annoying updates/bumps.
A feature similar to that is already available. It is at the bottom under a poster's name on the left menu bar beside their posts.
Sorry, but this feature is useless. It simply replaces their post with "This user is ignored". The thread is still listed in the section, and under "unread posts".
Ignoring the whole "which section" problem, I have 2 questions. Is bumping allowed? If so, when will the forum guidelines be modified, and if not, will this ever be enforced?
Yeah, they do still show up, how annoying! I've PM'd a couple of the raked illegal games to let them know how I feel rather then giving them a free bump...
Just curious, but how patient? It's been over 2 weeks since the last "official" reply, and over 2 months since this thread started. Due to the lack of enforcement, the problem continues to get worse.
Beanie...can't imagine what you are complaining about...I mean seriously, only 14 Club announcements on the "Home Page" first page...
I strongly suggest that all Home Games now be posted in the "Advertising" Section, as lord knows no one ever posts there.
Advertising?? Advertising?!?!??! How can you call the club games posts advertising??????!!!
Those people are simply announcing a service they provide. A service that, if you consume, they will likely make lots of money, a so-called "profit" if you will. A profit that they make after providng a service to us.
But if you're tempted to call posting a service in the hopes of making money, "advertising", then, I must say that, welll.... that you're, ummmmm...... ahhh....
FUCK THAT leave it how it is , i dont wanna go near the advertising page to look for torunys , i like it how it is right now....
you would
Seriously, though, it's almost impossible for a person who wants to invite some players over for a game to post a simple note in that section and not have it bumped right off the page in an hour. Gotta define what IS a Home Game, and what IS a CLUB game and give each their own section. Hell, I'll even volunteer to moderate both sections...free of charge
Seriously, it wouldn't matter where it posted, if they wanted to bust up a game ANYWHERE they will. They have other resources to utilize to locate illegal games, and most likely they have a pretty good idea exactly where they are mostly being played anyway. Breaking up the current section into two separate ones isn't going to make it a bigger risk whatsoever.
I doubt many of you saw my new topic in the Home Games section earlier today. I simply requested the location of the pokerforum.ca pool so I could pee in it. In addition I tried to give Wes a friendly little kick in the butt to do something about the situation detailed in this thread. Within minutes it was deleted (technically just moved to thread jail haha) and I have not received an explanation as to why. I can understand that the post was deleted because there was no useful information in it, and it definitely did not belong in the Home Games section, but I would really appreciate an explanation. I have had posts of mine deleted before (ok, once... I felt like such a rebel!) and I received an explanation promptly. Maybe it's just the slowness of PMs of late, so I will give the mods the benefit of the doubt.
The purpose of that post was to test to see if the mods were enforcing the rules. It surprised me to learn that apparently they are... except for good ol' rule #7.
Anyway, I have been on MSN with Wes (westside8, a moderator of this forum for those of you who don't know)... and he says he is waiting to hear back from Neil (sloth, forum owner), so I guess I can understand how his hands are tied.
/g2
P.S. If this post gets deleted I am simply going to RAMPAGE. Have a nice day.
What is brutal is these club owners are now bumping irrelevant threads like "under new management". Who cares...shouldn't this be under the advertising section. When will the madness end.
If the clubs don't get there own section that differs from the home games maybe they should have one-post only which they can expand on or delete from that way the same club won't have 3 or 4 different posts on the first page.
It is really getting out of hand....hopefully Sloth will put an end to it soon.
OK, i have been following this thread and the other ones havig to do with the home games section. There seems to be a few people who are confused where the line is drawn between "home games" and "non-home games".
THIS INFURIATES ME!!!
to end the confusion, here is the mother F*#king line!
If your game is held in the basement, or kitchen, or living room of your HOME, with or without rake, it is a home-game.
Now, if you rent a unit, or a hall, or a bar, IT'S NOT A HOME GAME!!!.
The REAL problem
The real problem is not that the non-home games posters are using the home games section to post. The real probem is that there is not a section designed for them specificaly. now, seeing as they have nowhere for their posts, they are using the closest thing! Who can really fault them for using the best vehicle available? (their constant bumping and rule breaking aside of course, we love you beanie!)
here is the solution:
instead of spliting the home games section into "home games" and "non-home games", rethink the section name from the start.
The section should be changed form Home games, to LIVE GAMES.
GREAT!, now that we have that established, can we now all agree that each of these games actually fall under that category? All of these games are in fact LIVE games, right?
Here's where the difference is made. Make 2 different "Sub-sections". Home game, and non-home games. if someone posts a game where they are having it in their home, but are taking a rake, so be it. they ave the right to post there. but lets say the airport club postsin the actual home games section. BANNED!!!  BOOYAH!!
ok, now i see alot of the non-home games fellers getting mad. "people are just going to ignor our posts and we wont get the exposure we need"
oh yeah? well too bad baby! if someone WANTS to read about your "$120 double shootout freezout W/Rebuys for the first 3 hours", they will visit the "non-home games" section.
To conclude this massive post i have made, Itruly home this goes into effect soon.
there is nothing to argue about here. Your game is either in your home, or it isnt. The fact that most (if not all) non-home games are raked, is coincidental.
Comments
As far as Neil making the decision, I have been in touch with him and he knows of the situation. He last contacted me about 48 hours ago, and I have replied but haven't heard from him yet. Once a decision has been made on his end, I will make sure it will be passed down and actions will be taken whatever they might be. I hope you guys understand this situation and how in some ways, our hands are still tied for the time being.
I understand the concerns about separating games based on rake, since that could cause problems legally. As a suggestion, "Home Games" could be for games played in a persons home. Me, Zithal, g2, JohnnieH, etc. all host games where we live, in our residence. If somebody hosts a game in a hall, club, or bar, who cares if it's raked or not, it's not a home game. For example, "Lucky Lou" wasn't raked, but it sure wasn't a home game.
If you keep the definition fairly basic, where "Home Game" means "game in your home", it simplifies things (I think). There may still be a few raked games in the Home Games section, but I can live with that, since it would curb 90% of the problem.
CPF + Red Baron= Dave make funny.
Thanks for working on this guys!!
stp
Oh yeah, cool. I'll try it and see if those threads still show up.
stp
Ignoring the whole "which section" problem, I have 2 questions. Is bumping allowed? If so, when will the forum guidelines be modified, and if not, will this ever be enforced?
lol.
Yeah, they do still show up, how annoying! I've PM'd a couple of the raked illegal games to let them know how I feel rather then giving them a free bump...
stp
I completely agree. IMO, we could use a "Ignore all posts from the member" feature.
Advertising?? Advertising?!?!??! How can you call the club games posts advertising??????!!!
Those people are simply announcing a service they provide. A service that, if you consume, they will likely make lots of money, a so-called "profit" if you will. A profit that they make after providng a service to us.
But if you're tempted to call posting a service in the hopes of making money, "advertising", then, I must say that, welll.... that you're, ummmmm...... ahhh....
HEY LOOK! IT'S A DISTRACTION!!!
you would
Seriously, though, it's almost impossible for a person who wants to invite some players over for a game to post a simple note in that section and not have it bumped right off the page in an hour. Gotta define what IS a Home Game, and what IS a CLUB game and give each their own section. Hell, I'll even volunteer to moderate both sections...free of charge
Does the advertising page offend you, Cole? Is it really that hard to click on another thread to view club games? I'm sure your Mum can help you.
Saying that I don't think they should be posted in advertising but in another thread possibly entitled, "Illegal Games and Where to Bust Them".
Yeah, because cops looking to find illegal club games would never think to look in the Home Games section.
I like "home games" and "other games". Other games can also include the rake-free bar tourneys etc. so it's not like it's just a "club games" section.
Are you kidding? No way they would think to look there. It's a perfect cover.
Besides, it is not like anything is really being done about small illegal games in the first place.
The purpose of that post was to test to see if the mods were enforcing the rules. It surprised me to learn that apparently they are... except for good ol' rule #7.
Anyway, I have been on MSN with Wes (westside8, a moderator of this forum for those of you who don't know)... and he says he is waiting to hear back from Neil (sloth, forum owner), so I guess I can understand how his hands are tied.
/g2
P.S. If this post gets deleted I am simply going to RAMPAGE. Have a nice day.
If the clubs don't get there own section that differs from the home games maybe they should have one-post only which they can expand on or delete from that way the same club won't have 3 or 4 different posts on the first page.
It is really getting out of hand....hopefully Sloth will put an end to it soon.
BUMP
Thanks for you patience.
Note Westside's post in the home game section? Great start Wes, thank you.
to end the confusion, here is the mother F*#king line!
If your game is held in the basement, or kitchen, or living room of your HOME, with or without rake, it is a home-game.
Now, if you rent a unit, or a hall, or a bar, IT'S NOT A HOME GAME!!!.
The REAL problem
The real problem is not that the non-home games posters are using the home games section to post. The real probem is that there is not a section designed for them specificaly. now, seeing as they have nowhere for their posts, they are using the closest thing! Who can really fault them for using the best vehicle available? (their constant bumping and rule breaking aside of course, we love you beanie!)
here is the solution:
instead of spliting the home games section into "home games" and "non-home games", rethink the section name from the start.
The section should be changed form Home games, to LIVE GAMES.
GREAT!, now that we have that established, can we now all agree that each of these games actually fall under that category? All of these games are in fact LIVE games, right?
Here's where the difference is made. Make 2 different "Sub-sections". Home game, and non-home games. if someone posts a game where they are having it in their home, but are taking a rake, so be it. they ave the right to post there. but lets say the airport club postsin the actual home games section. BANNED!!!  BOOYAH!!
ok, now i see alot of the non-home games fellers getting mad. "people are just going to ignor our posts and we wont get the exposure we need"
oh yeah? well too bad baby! if someone WANTS to read about your "$120 double shootout freezout W/Rebuys for the first 3 hours", they will visit the "non-home games" section.
To conclude this massive post i have made, Itruly home this goes into effect soon.
there is nothing to argue about here. Your game is either in your home, or it isnt. The fact that most (if not all) non-home games are raked, is coincidental.
any takers on a debate with this one?
Johnny