Bristol St. 2013 OFCP Championship - Wed. May 15th - 7pm (Waterloo)
This year, it'll be a first for both the WSOP and for Bristol Street!
Rules
1. Dealer deals out 5 cards to each player. (Until the final table, deal out a dummy hand if there are less than 4 players at the table.
2. The player to the left of the dealer arranges their cards first, then each player in order does the same, ending with the dealer.
3. The player to the left of the dealer draws a card and plays it. This continues until each player has played 13 cards.
4. Starting with the player to the left of the dealer, that player pays out the other players, starting with the player to their left and going around the table. NOTE: When paying out a player, you will never owe them more than they currently have in their stack at the time of the payout.
5. If the player runs out of chips while this occurs, no more bets are paid out from this player and that player is eliminated.
6. If two players foul, neither owes the other 6 chips.
7. Once all points are paid out, the dealer shift to the left and a new hand begins.
8. Tables are 4-max, and kept as balanced as possible.
9. Tables will attempt to enforce a 20 second per hand rules (act within 20 seconds, or your card automatically goes in the top most available slot)
Points/Payouts:
For each player to your left:
a) If they beat you in 2 of 3 hands, pay them 1 point.
b) If they beat you in all 3 hands, or you've fouled, pay them 6 points.
c) Then, pay out the royalties you owe them.
- 20 - Royal Flush
- 15 - Str8 Flush
- 10 - Quads
- 6 - Full House
- 4 - Flush
- 2 - Straight
- Middle Row scores double
- Top row scores, 1 point for pair of 6s, up to 9 points for AA, 10 points for 222, etc.
Blinds Structure : 4 hands per blind, first level is 5 hands (the number indicates the value of 1 point)
1. 25
2. 50
3. 75
4. 100
5. removed
6. 150
7. 200
8. removed
9. 300
10. 400
11. removed
12. 600
13. 800
14. 1000
15. 1500
16. 2000
17. 3000
Reserves:
1. Zithal
2. waltsfriend
3.
4. DrTyore
5. DataMn
6. Ranger
7. Quimby
8. SeekTheGrail
9. moose
10. beanie42
11.
..
32.
The Bristol Street Nightclub and Casino presents...
::h: THE BRISTOL STREET 2013 OFCP CHAMPIONSHIP :c::d:
Open Face Chinese Poker Tournament
Wed, May 15th - 7:00pm
(doors open at 6:30pm. Feel free to use 6:30-7:00 to get in practice games.)
$20 Buy-in Freeze-out - 32 player max.
$$$ Pay-out $$$
1st place - 45%
2nd place - 25%
3rd place - 15%
4th place - 10%
5th place - 5%
(Note: Top 4 payout with less than 24 players, Top 3 with 16 or less)
2013 Player of the Year Race
::h: THE BRISTOL STREET 2013 OFCP CHAMPIONSHIP :c::d:Open Face Chinese Poker Tournament
Wed, May 15th - 7:00pm
(doors open at 6:30pm. Feel free to use 6:30-7:00 to get in practice games.)
$20 Buy-in Freeze-out - 32 player max.
$$$ Pay-out $$$
1st place - 45%
2nd place - 25%
3rd place - 15%
4th place - 10%
5th place - 5%
(Note: Top 4 payout with less than 24 players, Top 3 with 16 or less)
2013 Player of the Year Race
Rules
1. Dealer deals out 5 cards to each player. (Until the final table, deal out a dummy hand if there are less than 4 players at the table.
2. The player to the left of the dealer arranges their cards first, then each player in order does the same, ending with the dealer.
3. The player to the left of the dealer draws a card and plays it. This continues until each player has played 13 cards.
4. Starting with the player to the left of the dealer, that player pays out the other players, starting with the player to their left and going around the table. NOTE: When paying out a player, you will never owe them more than they currently have in their stack at the time of the payout.
5. If the player runs out of chips while this occurs, no more bets are paid out from this player and that player is eliminated.
6. If two players foul, neither owes the other 6 chips.
7. Once all points are paid out, the dealer shift to the left and a new hand begins.
8. Tables are 4-max, and kept as balanced as possible.
9. Tables will attempt to enforce a 20 second per hand rules (act within 20 seconds, or your card automatically goes in the top most available slot)
Points/Payouts:
For each player to your left:
a) If they beat you in 2 of 3 hands, pay them 1 point.
b) If they beat you in all 3 hands, or you've fouled, pay them 6 points.
c) Then, pay out the royalties you owe them.
- 20 - Royal Flush
- 15 - Str8 Flush
- 10 - Quads
- 6 - Full House
- 4 - Flush
- 2 - Straight
- Middle Row scores double
- Top row scores, 1 point for pair of 6s, up to 9 points for AA, 10 points for 222, etc.
Blinds Structure : 4 hands per blind, first level is 5 hands (the number indicates the value of 1 point)
1. 25
2. 50
3. 75
4. 100
5. removed
6. 150
7. 200
8. removed
9. 300
10. 400
11. removed
12. 600
13. 800
14. 1000
15. 1500
16. 2000
17. 3000
Reserves:
1. Zithal
2. waltsfriend
3.
4. DrTyore
5. DataMn
6. Ranger
7. Quimby
8. SeekTheGrail
9. moose
10. beanie42
11.
..
32.
Comments
Got lessons from moose and seekthegrail.
Cost me $40
stp
When's the tutorial?
Mark
Also, if you haven't yet, remember to send an email!
Shaun Deeb tutorial I saw a while ago:
PCA 2013: Open Face Chinese Poker Tutorial with Shaun Deeb - YouTube
They claim this isn't rigged but I'm not so sure. A royal, seriously?
Please check your rule #6. I thought that if you foul you still pay out everyone to your left.
I'm ok playing either way, just wanted to point this out.
We're estimating that you should be able to get in 3 hands per level, so the blinds will raise after every 3 hands, except for level 1, where we'll get 5 hands to get into the swing of things.
Assuming more than one table, each table will play hand for hand.
The main reason to include this rule is for table balancing. If you get moved to a table it could take 6+ minutes for you to play another hand.
To help keep the game moving, tables are asked to impose a maximum of 20 seconds per action.
The net might be zero, but the consequence of the order of the payout might make a difference in the tournament outcome. The rule is important I think.
Dave's Poker Blog: Open Faced Chinese Poker Strategy - 10 Tips
"The third key point is the player to the left of the button resolves payment with the other players first and then the second player and so on. This is important because if the first player has a foul hand he pays everyone and then his hand is mucked. Imagine that all 4 players have a foul hand. The first player pays players 2, 3, and 4 while the second player would only pay players 3 and 4, and player 3 would only pay player 4. Player 4 pays no one and collects 18 units."
That's how the position factors in with how much risk you are willing to take.
P.S. I will be late but will be there in the first level. Hopefully my dummy doesn't foul me.
One of the problems with a new game like this is that there are many variations, including some scoring ones like this. It just doesn't make sense though - it gives WAY too much of an advantage to the dealer. They already have enough of one in being able to set their initial 5 cards last.
As backup, I would use the fact that the Open Face Chinese Poker App scores Moose's/my way - not the crazy way that this guy proposed.
The website description was how I first understood it and just needed clarification.
Moose brought up a better way to state the above.
"If you've fouled out, you cannot receive chips."
Much cleaner, thanks!!
I agree with "If you foul you cannot collect chips" The ordering of paying out / collecting to the player to your immediate left then clockwise applies for the following reason in a tournament.
Player 1 has 10 points left. Player 2 is to the immediate left. Player 3 has 10 points and is to the left of player 2. Player 4 is the dealer so is last to act and has 12 points left.
Player 1 vs player 2 results in 6 points for a sweep plus 4 points in royalties total 10 points for player 2 which busts player 1.
Regardless of how player 1 does vs players 3 or 4 (even if 3 or 4 fouls) they do not pay player 1 and action immediately moves to player 2 vs player 3 then player 2 vs player 4 and ends with player 3 vs player 4.
If player 2 vs player 3 results in 6 points for a sweep plus 4 points in royalties total 10 points for player 2 then player 3 busts as well.
Player 4 fouls but only pays player 2 6 points for fouling + 4 royalties = 10 points and is still alive in the tournament since they do not have to pay player 1 or 3.
If all 4 players foul then I believe the rule is shuffle up the cards and deal the next hand.
By the way Rob not sure how many players / table you will have but I would recommend you deal 4 hands per level so each player gets a dealer spot before the limits go up.
Player 1 has 16 points left. Player 2 is to the immediate left. Player 3 has 10 points and is to the left of player 2. Player 4 is the dealer so is last to act and has 12 points left.
This time player 1 fouls but only has enough chips to payout player 2 (10 points) and player 3 (6 points) then busts. Player 4 gets nothing from player 1 and now player 3 can survive the battle vs player 2 (gained 6 and still loses 10) and if player 4 still fouls as well he is busto as he has to pay both player 2 (10 points) and player 3 (remaining 2 points).
Sometimes it is good to be last in line and other times not so good. Looking forward to the Bristol OFCP Championship! Cheers, Steve
What about royalties?
This
I found this page today that has the rules that they used at EPT9 Monaco:
EPT9 Monaco: New tweaks to Open-Face Chinese - PokerStarsBlog.com
One of the other important things that it notes: The final table is suggested to be 5 players, with the person on the puck sitting out. This will prevent any heads-up tables until the very end.
Players are only eligible to win or lose the amount of chips they began the hand with. As an example, Player A has 12 points; he can win or lose only 12 points from Player B. If he wins 8 points from Player B, he now has a total of 4 points remaining of his original 12 for his transaction with Player C. If he wins or loses those 4 points he will have concluded his actions and will have no transactions with Player D.
Also I agree with Steve, it should be 4 hands per level, giving each person the button once per level.
Let's say player A has 5 units, and hits a flush on the bottom. Players B and C both foul, but D hits a large hand and A owes him 12 points. A can only collect 5 units total from B and C, and then gets knocked out by D, whereas under our current rules he can double up through B, then double up through C, and then pay D the 12.
In each transaction someone is theoretically on the hook for their current chip total, so by extension they should be able to collect an amount equal to their current chip total during each transaction.
Your scenario is incorrect anyways as per the rule from your link. A wins 5 points and he is done for the hand. He has no points left to play with D. D can not eliminate him.
A better scenario would be that to start the hand:
A 5 points
B 10 points
C 20 points
D 40 points
D should be able to start the hand knowing that he can not be eliminated by A, B or C, as they collectively can only win 35 points from D. If C loses 5 points to A and collects 5 points from B, he can only collect 10 points from D. Players should be able to know what the relative risk/reward is at the start of the hand and it should remain the same to the finish, regardless of position. Similarly A should be able to start the hand knowing that he only needs to ensure he beats B to avoid elimination.
It should be treated as 6 independent heads up matches per hand. If players are allowed to accumulate points during the hand and then use them against players in later position then the matches are no longer independent.
In other words, Points should only be in play once per hand. D should not be able to win C's chips twice by A beating B and C for 5 points each then D beating A for 10 points and then beating C for another 10 points.
B 10 points
C 20 points
D 40 points
I think Player A should play his 5 points against each player.
If it was a 4-way allin in NL player A would quadruple up and I don't see why s/he should be limited to just a double up.
For reference, here are the rules from the link..
The tournament rules for Open-Face Chinese
1. Game will be dealt 4 handed.
2. Final Table will be played 5 handed with the button being dealt out.
3. Players will receive cards 6 through 13 individually, face down. When they act, the next player will then be dealt their card.
4. Players who expose a card out of turn will be penalized 1 point per active player in the hand.
5. Players who miss a hand will pay a 3 point penalty per active player in the hand, but will not have to pay any royalties accrued on that hand.
6. Players who miss a hand may not receive any penalty chips from any other players in the hand.
7. Once clock is called, players will have 30 seconds to act on their hand. Players who do not act before time expires will have their hand declared fouled and will pay a full penalty plus all applicable royalties.
8. Verbal action is not binding and a player's turn will not be completed until they have placed their card and removed their hand (like Chess).
9. Players will be allowed to step away from the table provided their hand has no remaining decisions to be made (EX. Flush on bottom, straight in middle, with 3 cards to come that can ONLY be placed up top, or a hand that is already fouled and cannot be redeemed).
10. Players will NOT be allowed to step away from the table during hands where decisions remain. Any player who does so will have their hand declared fouled and will pay a full penalty plus all applicable royalties.
So it sounds like the way payouts go is..
A / B complete payouts
A / C complete payouts
A / D complete payouts
B / C complete payouts
B / D complete payouts
C / D complete payouts
For the comparison to NLHE that Quimby mentions, yes, from the short stack side, Player A would quadruple but, but looking at it from the other end, the chip leader for a given hand would never be eliminated.
An example to demonstrate this is the case where the chips are split 10 / 11 / 12 / 20
Let's assume A > B > C > D and the point difference somehow involves maximum payouts.
In Quimby's scenario,
A / B : A gains 10 from B (A:20, B:1)
A / C : A gains 10 from C (A:30, C: 2)
A / D : A gains 10 from D (A:40,
B / C : B gains 11 from C (but C only has 2 left) B: 3, C: eliminated.
B / D : B gainst 11 from D (but D only has 10 left) B: 13
So, the two short stacks have eliminated the two big stacks.
In Moose's scenario.
A / B : A gains 10 from B (A:20, B: 1), A is done with payouts.
B / C : B gains 1 from C (B:2, C:11), B is done with payouts.
C / D : C gainst 11 from D (C: 22,
To be honest, both scenarios seem extremely weird. In the second one, the second best hand is now the short stack.
The other scenario that makes things wierd: 10 / 10 / 30 / 30.
Let's assume A v B results in B winning all of A's chips (A is eliminated.), B's chips have been used, so that even if C and D both have Royals, neither can touch B, and B ends the hand with 20 chips.
My head is gonna ass-plode.