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Can a man (woman) who has no fear....begin a relationship with god.......?









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  • darbday wrote: »
    Can a man (woman) who has no fear....begin a relationship with god.......?
    .

    Nope. God rules by fear.
  • Hobbes wrote: »
    Nope. God rules by fear.

    Can you explain 'rules'?


    edit: i can think of 3 ways to interpret what you mean is all.....
  • Hypothesis:

    If a person truly has no fear, then they have no need for a higher being. God is a construct based in mankind's fear of their own finite existence. Creation of afterlife / ultimate power / rebirth / reincarnation is the fiction of a mind too afraid to accept their own relative insignificance.

    Mark
  • I just have to break this up......
    DrTyore wrote: »
    If a person truly has no fear, then they have no need for a higher being.

    of course the 'if' and 'truly' are important assumptions....but i do think it can be proven true by logic....but i'm not a logic master and don't know if anyone is...(advanced math majors?)....but maybe no one would argue this....i certainly agree and see it as more than a hypothesis.....

    DrTyore wrote: »
    Hypothesis:
    God is a construct based in mankind's fear of their own finite existence. Creation of afterlife / ultimate power / rebirth / reincarnation is the fiction of a mind.....

    i think this is the hypothesis or so.....not that i for sure agree but its the part that is belief....i just want to separate the two

    DrTyore wrote: »
    ......too afraid to accept their own relative insignificance.

    this part describes a special relationship
  • At the risk of becoming head-spinningly frustrated . . .

    Fear is not relevant to a relationship with God. At least, not as I understand God.
    Background: raised Roman Catholic, now lapsed.
    The Catholic faith of my upbringing utilizes the fear of eternal damnation as a means of keeping it's members from straying . . . one is not to fear God, but rather fear the consequences of an absence of God. In other words, without the absolution of sin, which the Church provides through Confession, the sinful soul is denied Salvation. That is what Catholics are taught to fear . . . at least in my opinion.

    Mark, I am quite aware of my own insignificance, juxtaposed with the world at large. This does not keep me from having an abiding faith in God, or whatever you would choose to call this "higher power". There have been a small number of instances in my life, that can only be explained as epiphanies, that lead me to believe that there is a God. I am not so sure of an afterlife (at least, not in the Catholic sense), but I do believe in God.
  • Milo wrote: »
    At the risk of becoming head-spinningly frustrated . . .

    Fear is not relevant to a relationship with God. At least, not as I understand God.
    Background: raised Roman Catholic, now lapsed.
    The Catholic faith of my upbringing utilizes the fear of eternal damnation as a means of keeping it's members from straying . . . one is not to fear God, but rather fear the consequences of an absence of God. In other words, without the absolution of sin, which the Church provides through Confession, the sinful soul is denied Salvation. That is what Catholics are taught to fear . . . at least in my opinion.

    Mark, I am quite aware of my own insignificance, juxtaposed with the world at large. This does not keep me from having an abiding faith in God, or whatever you would choose to call this "higher power". There have been a small number of instances in my life, that can only be explained as epiphanies, that lead me to believe that there is a God. I am not so sure of an afterlife (at least, not in the Catholic sense), but I do believe in God.


    To me, this is the same reason people believe in Ghosts / Psychics / etc

    To ancient man, thunder was the sky people angered, the sun was a mighty chariot drawn by horses across the sky. A little more modern, and we realize that our flat earth has sun revolving around it. Now we know that we're round, and going 'round the sun.....

    There is no super natural, just the natural that we understand and that we don't. A "god" if you will is a construct so that we "get it", not unlike a house settling at night will lead a child to believe in a boogeyman.

    Mark
  • I would not put God in the same category as ghosts, psychics, etc. . . and I'd like to think you'd give me credit for a few more brain cells than that, regardless. My faith in "God" is not about "getting it", really. It's more about accepting that I will never, entirely, "get it".

    Regardless, I am not here to change your mind, nor have mine swayed (though a drunken Salma Hayek might have a shot). Off to look for the beer vats.
  • darbday wrote: »
    Can a man (woman) who has no fear....begin a relationship with god.......?









    .

    Yes, without question!

    Brent
  • oh gees, this could get volatile... Mod powers winding up..
  • compuease wrote: »
    oh gees, this could get volatile... Mod powers winding up..

    If I was ignorant and unintelligent on capital punishment what will I be called in this thread.

    Prophet :2h :2s
  • If I was ignorant and unintelligent on capital punishment what will I be called in this thread.

    Prophet :2h :2s
    I'm afraid to even look.... ow, my virgin ears (and eyes).. If I was you I would have pretended I didn't see this thread... and I now have fear!
  • compuease wrote: »
    I'm afraid to even look.... ow, my virgin ears (and eyes).. If I was you I would have pretended I didn't see this thread... and I now have fear!

    I actually thought about that, but knowing Mark, I would be called a coward, still I can turn the other check, I haven't made up my mind how far I will get into it with people who have NO intention of understanding what the OP intentions were in starting the thread in the orginal question.

    Have faith Jeff? It will work out ok, Nik and I shock hands at Moose's last week!

    Prophet :2h :2s
  • Dude...

    Where's the hate-on for me coming from? I've never called you anything Brent. I said I was smarter than the average Canadian, still think so. I've said that HVEE has a history of ignorant postings, that's true. I've never said "Brent you are / Brent is...".

    I've disagreed, sure, but never slammed ya brother.

    Mark
  • DrTyore wrote: »
    I said I was smarter than the average Canadian, still think so.
    Mark
    Aha... but what is smart? Is it intelligence, knowledge or wit? or a combination of all three? If so, what percentage of each? Darb, help us here...
  • Darb's just been smoking the "stuff" again guys.:D
  • philliivey wrote: »
    Darb's just been smoking the "stuff" again guys.:D

    ???????????????????????????????

    Brent
  • So many positive waves . . . I'm feeling the man-love now.

    Oh, and Brent? If anyone calls you a faggot, you can take 'em to the CSBC and have them banned.

    Just sayin' . . .
  • compuease wrote: »
    Darb, help us here...
    one moment....don't lock this down ill brb........
  • Milo wrote: »
    At the risk of becoming head-spinningly frustrated . . .
    /QUOTE]

    no need
    Milo wrote: »
    Fear is not relevant to a relationship with God.
    this is not what we are trying to infer....
    Milo wrote: »
    That is what Catholics are taught to fear . . . at least in my opinion.

    i like that you brought this up.....we're gonna work with the type of fear that is not this one...the non god fearing kind....
    Milo wrote: »
    .
    .........or whatever you would choose to call this "higher power". but I do believe in God.

    yes and of course we have to think about god vaguely or broadly to have the discussion....
  • DrTyore wrote: »
    To ancient man, thunder was the sky people angered, the sun was a mighty chariot drawn by horses across the sky. A little more modern, and we realize that our flat earth has sun revolving around it. Now we know that we're round, and going 'round the sun.....


    see i can counter this......by saying that the world was flat.......
    DrTyore wrote: »
    A "god" if you will is a construct......
    Mark

    'A' god is.......but god by definition for this question is not....its is the real god not one we define.....
  • Milo wrote: »
    It's more about accepting that I will never, entirely, "get it".

    +1
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by DrTyore viewpost.gif
    I said I was smarter than the average Canadian, still think so.
    Mark

    compuease wrote: »
    Aha... but what is smart? Is it intelligence, knowledge or wit? or a combination of all three? If so, what percentage of each? Darb, help us here...


    yes this was quite relevant to that thread....
  • I believe that anyone can have a relationship with God, be they afraid or not. It just might not be a healthy relationship. Personally, I have more faith in humans.
  • philliivey wrote: »
    Darb's just been smoking the "stuff" again guys.:D

    ^-^ we need a different emoticon for this....msn has a perfect one...
  • berating is no worse than being offended
  • Cerberus wrote: »
    I believe that anyone can have a relationship with God, be they afraid or not. It just might not be a healthy relationship. Personally, I have more faith in humans.

    it could prob be argued there can only be one relationship with the truest sense of god but the question is more can someone embrace god and act in faith to go to heaven or whatever you would get from that.........if they had no fear........


    the simpler example would be god says come to my heaven and the man says no thx?
    won't you miss your family
    not big deal
    aren't you worried about hell
    naw


    but expand it to other religions or what ever.....once a man had absoulutely no fear....could he still embrace god if god existed
  • darbday wrote: »
    see i can counter this......by saying that the world was flat.......



    'A' god is.......but god by definition for this question is not....its is the real god not one we define.....

    False!

    You asked if a person can form a relationship with god, I'm saying "A god", so unless you're discounting everyone's "god" but your own (very exclusive btw, and presumes a stance of being right, rendering the topic moot), you have to give me that.

    Mark
  • Cerberus wrote: »
    I believe that anyone can have a relationship with God, be they afraid or not. It just might not be a healthy relationship. Personally, I have more faith in humans.

    Hmm...

    Choice between fairy-tale construct, or genocidal, psychotics? Tough one! :)

    Mark
  • darbday wrote: »
    see i can counter this......by saying that the world was flat.......


    That's like saying I can counter the "women in the workplace" argument by saying "A woman's place was in the kitchen".

    Wasn't true then, isn't true now.

    Mark
  • DrTyore wrote: »
    False!

    You asked if a person can form a relationship with god, I'm saying "A god", so unless you're discounting everyone's "god" but your own (very exclusive btw, and presumes a stance of being right, rendering the topic moot), you have to give me that.

    Mark

    yes but its just an example, i mean otherwise we all have discuss who or what god is or if exists or what religion blah blah......we can relate it to our own god or someone else or whatever gives the question some sort of sense....
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