Holy crapshoots, Batman! Somebody wants me to play satellites at PokerStars, so I took a close look at the most popular satellites, the Steps SNGs. The $2,100 Step 6 is probably the worst value ever I have ever seen for any $2K+ tournament. Its Online Patience Factor is less than 6 and the Skill Level is only 3.
The $50 satellites I played to win a package offered much more play for the money and luck was less of a factor, with an Online Patience Factor of more than 8. Even Fallsview's $1,240 live WPT satellites, which has high overhead of staff working 4-6 hours, has better play value. As somebody on 2+2 posted, it's unbelievable that PokerStars is profiting $900 with no incremental overhead, and giving less than two hours of crapshoot play for a prize pool of $18K.
The worst Step is the $82 Step 3 turbo, which has the highest rake of over 8% and an Online Patience Factor of less than 1.5! Even the $1 turbo satellites I played gave more play and required more skill to win.
Has anybody ever seen a decent analysis of PokerStars satellites and know the link? I did a search on 2+2 but the only good link I've found so far was all in French. I'm hoping that I won't have to do all the analysis from scratch.
B/c its not like I turned $700 into 3.2 million from the steps or anything like that...+ I should have a fucking WPT win under my belt as I obviously should but Sirwatts and his tens stopped my aces of course soo instead you guys chat about him Fine! lol
$ 700 into $ 3.2 million.....you are my hero!!!!!!
teach me, show me the way!!!!
Look bottom line is he used points he earned and translated it into a $216 ticket. not a bad days work one would think that would be a good thing. maybe I am too logical there.
$ 700 into $ 3.2 million.....you are my hero!!!!!!
teach me, show me the way!!!!
Look bottom line is he used points he earned and translated it into a $216 ticket. not a bad days work one would think that would be a good thing. maybe I am too logical there.
Raised with AK, one caller. Flop K 9 3 rainbow. I pot, he (can only assume it was a he since he took me out and is obviously skilled to do so) min raises and I know I'm either killed or it's a woman and she's a donk. I push the rest of my measily stack and villain shows 99.
Finish 7th for a good run but it wasn't meant to be...untill next time.
You seem overly concerned with patience and skill factors and not concerned enough with EV. The two, believe it or not, are not the same.
Step 3s are fantastic for someone rolled for them because you can take advantage of the structure where you get to replay if you come 3rd to 5th. That is really not hard to do most of the time.
Not to mention, you pick up more FPPs etc while not having to buyin again.
Stars charges $90 rake on Step 6 because they can. And there's a reason they can.
Poker is all about maximizing EV for me. I maximize EV by taking many factors into account instead of ignoring them, e.g., Patience Factor, rake, taxes, luck factor, payout structure, how skilled the opposition is, etc. Just because we can win Step 3 or Fallsview WPT satellites does not mean that there are no better choices for us. For example, if Fallsview increases the fees again this year or does not give more playing time for the overly high rake/hour of the $460 satellite, then even though I can win there, I will probably play somewhere better, e.g., the few forum-organized rake-free satellites and online (non-Steps).
I have analyzed the Steps SNGs and they are fantastic - for maximizing PokerStars' hourly rake and profits! It gives the :fish: the illusion of winning something in each Step when in fact there will be up to 3,000 losers required in order to award one Step 6 package to a ryanghall or SirWatts. I'm pretty sure that your win rate will be even higher by playing non-Steps satellites with a higher Patience Factor than that of Step 6 (PF = 6 only) where you can use your skills more instead of fish getting lucky with the relatively fewer hands of the Steps structure. I'm willing to make a friendly motivational bet that I can win more event packages through non-Steps satellites than you can with PokerStars Steps SNGs. :smilie:
You seem overly concerned with patience and skill factors and not concerned enough with EV. The two, believe it or not, are not the same.
Step 3s are fantastic for someone rolled for them because you can take advantage of the structure where you get to replay if you come 3rd to 5th. That is really not hard to do most of the time.
Comments
The $50 satellites I played to win a package offered much more play for the money and luck was less of a factor, with an Online Patience Factor of more than 8. Even Fallsview's $1,240 live WPT satellites, which has high overhead of staff working 4-6 hours, has better play value. As somebody on 2+2 posted, it's unbelievable that PokerStars is profiting $900 with no incremental overhead, and giving less than two hours of crapshoot play for a prize pool of $18K.
The worst Step is the $82 Step 3 turbo, which has the highest rake of over 8% and an Online Patience Factor of less than 1.5! Even the $1 turbo satellites I played gave more play and required more skill to win.
Has anybody ever seen a decent analysis of PokerStars satellites and know the link? I did a search on 2+2 but the only good link I've found so far was all in French. I'm hoping that I won't have to do all the analysis from scratch.
I play these steps as STP does - with FPP's.
So, if you buy in for 60 FPP why all the fuss about rake?...and if you're buying in for cash at the top level are you really worried about rake?
KRT
(just jumping back into the forum)
teach me, show me the way!!!!
Look bottom line is he used points he earned and translated it into a $216 ticket. not a bad days work one would think that would be a good thing. maybe I am too logical there.
How is the smarter of the two brothers?
I raise to 600 with the blinds 100/200. BB pushes after plenty of thought for another 2100, I have him covered by about 1K. I instacall.
He shows 109o
Flop 9 10 J
turn 10
River 4
I finish 3rd for a retry.
stp
Raised with AK, one caller. Flop K 9 3 rainbow. I pot, he (can only assume it was a he since he took me out and is obviously skilled to do so) min raises and I know I'm either killed or it's a woman and she's a donk. I push the rest of my measily stack and villain shows 99.
Finish 7th for a good run but it wasn't meant to be...untill next time.
stp
* stirring the pot
You seem overly concerned with patience and skill factors and not concerned enough with EV. The two, believe it or not, are not the same.
Step 3s are fantastic for someone rolled for them because you can take advantage of the structure where you get to replay if you come 3rd to 5th. That is really not hard to do most of the time.
Not to mention, you pick up more FPPs etc while not having to buyin again.
Stars charges $90 rake on Step 6 because they can. And there's a reason they can.
Ryan
I have analyzed the Steps SNGs and they are fantastic - for maximizing PokerStars' hourly rake and profits! It gives the :fish: the illusion of winning something in each Step when in fact there will be up to 3,000 losers required in order to award one Step 6 package to a ryanghall or SirWatts. I'm pretty sure that your win rate will be even higher by playing non-Steps satellites with a higher Patience Factor than that of Step 6 (PF = 6 only) where you can use your skills more instead of fish getting lucky with the relatively fewer hands of the Steps structure. I'm willing to make a friendly motivational bet that I can win more event packages through non-Steps satellites than you can with PokerStars Steps SNGs. :smilie: