Drinking & Poker
Cash game, .25/.25 NL $50 maximum buyin.
I have a guy that comes to my tournaments, loses out early, gets totally blitzed and then stars in the cash game. He plays really slow, never knows when it is his turn, can't stack his chips and has no idea about chip denominations. If the dealer does not help him, he would not be able to get his chips into the pot.
I have no patience for drunken players or slow playing so if it were only up to me, I would not let him play.
But here is the catch. He is a terrible player and normally loses lots of money so everyone puts up with him. He will go all-in blind, out of turn, before anyone else has even seen their cards.
Just interested what everyone thinks I should do with him. Do I let him play, or give him the boot?
If it was the regular tournament and he couldn't manage, I would toss him for sure. But for the cash game, not sure what to do.
I have a guy that comes to my tournaments, loses out early, gets totally blitzed and then stars in the cash game. He plays really slow, never knows when it is his turn, can't stack his chips and has no idea about chip denominations. If the dealer does not help him, he would not be able to get his chips into the pot.
I have no patience for drunken players or slow playing so if it were only up to me, I would not let him play.
But here is the catch. He is a terrible player and normally loses lots of money so everyone puts up with him. He will go all-in blind, out of turn, before anyone else has even seen their cards.
Just interested what everyone thinks I should do with him. Do I let him play, or give him the boot?
If it was the regular tournament and he couldn't manage, I would toss him for sure. But for the cash game, not sure what to do.
Comments
stp
If you boot him or scare him off we can't win as much at the cash game (I use the term we wishfully).
Anyone who calls a $10 raise in a 25c/25c game with only a blind in with 74o is great.
He's the most +ev
I believe that literally the game would have gone twice as fast without that one player at the table. Although it seems +ev to have this player at the table, the variance is huge. I sat at the cash game for six or seven hours and only saw pocket jacks once and pocket eights once each. I managed to win two reasonable pots with A-K and K-Q. I lost all of my winnings at the end of the night when I called an all-in against this player with top pair when he had hit a set. I was incredibly annoyed with the situation after watching him make the same kind of all-in bet with only bottom pair in a dozen different hands. I only showed down three hands all night at the cash game.
I don't think that I would play in that cash game again under the same circumstances. If I am going to have to make those kinds of high risk decisions, I would like to see more than 15 hands an hour.
I don't know how you tactfully handle the situation with that player, but if you are asking for opinions about whether people would prefer to play with that kind of player or not, I vote for not.
If not, then get him another beer!
If it makes a difference to your question Johnnie, I didn't enjoy myself while playing with him.
I agree with you there. Before moose and I left, I think it took 40min+ to get one orbit.
Moose looked like a five year old kid coming down the stairs on Christmas morning the whole time he was sitting at the table. I could see he wanted to leave but he couldn't push himself away from the table.
it's called gambling. You "called" the all-in and he had a hand.
that's poker
I am not debating the point that losing top pair to a set is part of the game. I am saying that I do not enjoy participating in a game where there really isn't any play or strategy. It came down to catching cards and/or flops at the right time.
My other point is that I would feel less annoyed right now if I had walked away from the game up $400 for the night rather than down $50 because of that one hand. However, unless I am playing against this person every week, or getting a chance to play many more hands per hour, the possibility of winning money from this player does not come close to my overall frustration with the style and pace of play at the table.
Is this why you're upset? Not the fact his play slowed down the table? I wasn't there so I don't understand the whole situation, however you always want weak players at the table. The game goes slower, but the dead money should keep everyone engaged in the action. I just don't see the problem with having a slow fish sitting in.
On another note: What gives anyone the right to ask this player to leave the table? I guess if the whole table is annoyed with this guy, they could ask the TD, right? But I doubt EVERYONE would want this fish to leave.
Is he a workmate, employer or something like that. That could change the way you go about this.
If he's just a random guy well then you can give him the boot with little to no consequence. If he's close to you or one of your regulars then it becomes more prickly.
Even though I wasn't present, I'll have to agree with Johnnie. It seems that your only upset at losing to this fish. I myself don't mind playing with drunks, sometimes I'm the drunk myself but there is a line of responsibilty when it comes to behaviour. If this fish was just playing dead money poker , let him be, but if his behaviour was getting out of hand such as spilling beer on the table for the 5th time or worst case scenario..getting violent..call the bouncers and kick him out!
I will play in this game everytime.
No-one listened to your message about drinking except for DrTyore, Hobbes and myself. The drunk guys were the same drunk guys. But it was a hell of lot quieter for some reason.
I assume these are you golfing buddies and they get just as drunk golfing. No amount of talking will make them better poker players or less drunk. It was still a friendly game - if there were arguments or angry drunks it would be one thing but they stay and drink because they are having a good time.
Roll him in The Village
PokerForum.ca: Where the whine is cheap
PokerForum.ca: Where the whine is cheap
I am not upset because I lost money. I am just saying that I would have been consoled by the frustrating play of the entire evening if I had at least made money from the time I put in at the table.
Absolutely, the slow play was the part of the game that was most frustrating for me. On top of that, the only play vs. this person was to pick a hand, hope you catch the flop, and hold your breath to the river to see what happens. This is not my idea of fun poker. I don't really think that it is profitable poker either, since you take advantage of a small set of your poker skills.
There may be players at the table that were happy with the situation, but where do you draw the line. Does it have to be everyone or is a simple majority of the players enough to make the decision.
I am guessing that all of the forumers who played at this table sat there expecting to make money from this fish. However, from what I saw, there was only one person who actually left the table having made money based on this particular person's bad play.
In the long run, over many sessions, you would probably make money against this player. This is a short run, relatively few number of hands situation.
Sounds like you need to open-up your game a bit if you are waiting for 88+ to play vs this purported fish.
I don't know this guy at all other then the three times he has been to my place to play poker. He seems to be a real nice guy except he just gets totally hammered. He honestly kept thinking the $5 chips were worth $5000 and kept trying to make bets like $25000. Nothing is getting broken and he is a happy drunk so there is no problem with that.
I think there were three or four other people drinking a lot. I know them from the golf course that I belonged to a few years ago. The only time I see them now is playing poker. If I never had them out again it would not bother me at all.
I was just curious to know what other people thought about it.
I did not wait for 88+ to play - I said that I only got two pocket pairs all night. It normally cost at least $11 to see any flop and there was a good chance that the the bet was going to be all-in after the flop. As I said, over the course of the evening I only went to show down three times. I never caught the flop when I was in the hand vs. this player. I assume that you are not suggesting that I play Q-3 off suit against this kind of player.
Edit: I just remembered that I did win with K-5 off suit for a fourth show down early in the night. I called the $15 preflop raise from the small blind when there had been five previous callers and caught two pair on the flop.
I really can't believe that people want to play an average of fifteen hands an hour with a person that was consistently calling out a bet of $2000 when he had a couple of hundred dollars in front of him, but thought that he was playing with tournament chips.
If I had a game I'd say give him my number.
When an UTG raise in a .25/.25 $50 max game to $10.50 gets called 5 ways including by yourself then there were plenty of fish at the table.
Was my WTF? chip a handy resource at that game? yep. Did I need to pull my STFU chip? Not once the entire day and that made it a fun game.
I find this an ironic statement from you Rob. There were several times throughout the night where you were clearly annoyed by the speed of play and started jawing with the players. I was surprised that it didn't escalate.
You asked me why I was willing to deal at the table, and my answer is simple. There is no way I would play in this game without a dealer who was vigilant about moving the action - as hard as that was at this table. At least while I was dealing, I had something to occupy my time since I was didn't have many playable hands.
you don't say
Maybe they should impose a max drinks per hr limit on this fellow.
They aren't his mother.
He has fun losing all his money and betting all crazy while drunk, then he is satisfied at the end of the night.
You have fun stacking this donk (4 out of 5 hands, waltsfriend remember this) and you are satisfied.
everybody goes home happy!
OP is the house person and is looking for some advice.