looking for advise, run like sh*t in jan
i just run stupidly cold in FTP this month, i don't want to use the word rigged. but it just seem that i'm been setup to die.
most of money lost due to unfair situation (unlucky or rigged) then there is monkey tilt.
20 day of hell, i can't run that bad, over 38k hand. what's the problem><
most of money lost due to unfair situation (unlucky or rigged) then there is monkey tilt.
20 day of hell, i can't run that bad, over 38k hand. what's the problem><
Comments
Remember you haven't seen your worst run yet.
Johnny is correct. You haven't seen your worse run and the run your on is just variance. I can show you some graphs of me (and I am winning) that would make you give your head a shake. I've seen graphs of beanie's play where he is down more than a few buy in's. If you can't take the heat get out of the kitchen.
My advice, play 1 game get your head completely in the game if you want to play at all. 4 or more tabling during this point is spewing money. And no I dont' think on line poker is rigged (at least at the stakes I play). But if you are playing at UB or AP good luck.
[x] Full Ring
So you have played 40,000 hands in 20 days?
My head would hurt.
That graph is pretty sick by the way. 60 deg down for 8K hands, 60 deg up for 12K, and then down again for 17K more.
What kind of PT stats are you running at?
This is full ring right?
I don't play FR other than live poker but I would hazzard a guess that all of your profit comes from your big hands and all of your losses come from your coolers. So when you run good you run really good and when you run bad you run really bad.
Do you think that you get good value out of your middling hands? Do you think you read hands well? Do you have a really good idea of what your opponent is holding by the time you get to the river?
Did you tilt out around 30k-34K hands? Your sklansky bucks seem to take a massive hit there.. now, I dont know how it arrives at that number but anytime that EV dips substantially like that, I'd be concerned.
Out of 17 losses with overpair vs a set he lost on average 40BB. I wouldn't think this is the problem. These stats are only for the hands that go to showdown too so it doesn't include his folds. It would seem to me that he is controling the pot size well in these situations.
Maybe, Maybe not. All we have are pretty pictures, so knows if he's just pushing 40BB into a 1 bet pot on the flop..
PT stats add.
i'm getting some advise on 2+2 as well.
they basically told me to cut down the table, and try to improve my post flop play.
they say, my poor post flop is cost this.
i figure it make sense. i play for "stack" because i knew my post flop play were weak(i'm always seem monster,if you remember my earlier post lol )
so i make it simple. if i'm good, i'll stack. if i don't think i'm good, but with fairly strong hand, i'll check call, and try to see a cheap showdown.
generally, there is pro and con for this style. and better player can easiely put me on hands, and explore my weakness.
i take this as wakeup call, and start to mix thing up.
i think my style work fairly well at 25NL, but 50NL where there are few more better players, just make tough.
Chuckie I don't think that your problem is that you are playing $50NL instead of $25NL. The difference between these levels is really very small. There is a little more pre-flop aggression and 3 betting and a smaller precentage of total fish at $50NL, that is all.
What I take away from that thread is that you really don't have any idea of how to play postflop. Your preflop game is pretty tight and pretty aggressive and this is good. You have not taken the time to understand what postflop lines mean from your average villain and how to use these lines to exploit weaker/average players.
Unfortunately you are playing far too many tables before you have actually built your poker skills. My advice to you would be to go back to $25NL and play 6 max on 2 tables at a time. The money won't matter to you, you can open up your game and learn to read hands and play post flop.
You posted a screen shot of 159,000 hands played and a winrate of 0.02PTBB/100 hand. You need to either make a decision cut down on the tables, read and post some hand histories to improve your game or seriously consider finding a new hobby.
i'll try the 6 max table
i always want to get into 6 max and headup, but i am afraid because i super good at wrong timing. such as, fold when bluff, push when they are not bluffing.......once in a while i get it right, and then suckout....it's very discouraging. but i am over bankroll for 6 max at 25NL. so i'm gonna try it.
currently getting $390+ does help, but i don't want to play for rakeback.
i want to improve, so i don't endup as pickup penny from sidewalk as my new hobby
This is great advice. I had a long stretch where i was breakeven/slightly ahead and I realized that if i wanted to become a better player I needed to change somethings up. The two big things I did were play less tables and focus more on how my opponents were playing and work on my heads up game. Becoming a better heads up player significantly improved my post flop play... playing heads up you are put in so many marginal spots with marginal hands that it forces you to become a better hand reader which will do wonders for your 6 max game.
The blinds come fast in 6 max so it forces you to open up your game. You will need to get reads instead of autopiloting with the top 10% of opening hands. It will force you to think post-flop or you will spew money. You will need to be very aggressive from late postion. That button is pure gold so raise and raise from that spot. Few people will adjust to anything that you are doing at the table so don't get all metagame and start thinking on the Nth level.
Try and put your opponent on a range of hands and narrow that range on every street. Maybe even draw your self up a chart of what hands are included in a 15% VPIP range, what hands are added to a 20%, how about that guy playing 35%, what is he coming into the pot with? This is very, very, important!!!! Exercise your brain and don't play on auto-pilot. Even donks do things for a reason so stop and figure out why he did what he did and make plan for the hand before you click a button.
Look for standard lines from people and figure out what they mean as far a villains hand. Take some paper and write them down.
You are moving down to improve your game. Slow down play a few tables and learn something!
Good Luck Chuck.
a buddy of my who doesn't play online, but has done very well live (not pro, but he brought a new jetta with money won from poker last year)
he just spent a day view my Jan.08 HH
he told me not to change my style of playing, but get some balls.......
he told me that i didn't play it right, because i didn't lose enough to come close to playing it right, and that is due to "seeing monster under the bed sydrom"
therefore he does not reccommand me working on my postflop, because of seeing monster under the bed sydrom, when i do run into one (which happen to everybody) it would be diaster for my game.
he can't see me taking down alot of pot. so i better stick with play for stack style. which is poker made simple, and put pressure back to the other side, which is better then thinking, because thinking will take in alot of pressure, and usually not good for player with seeing monster under the bed sydrom.
he just laughing at me, check call down with a set...... and say even when i lose money here,this set will be good more often then bad, if i don't get my stack in, i would lose out of profit which will be more then money lost.
to sum it up, bankroll is there, so i don't have to worry about bad run, and i'm proper roll for the level, and just pickup some balls, and be happy that people are willing to put money in with me(tight image) when i have the goods.
what do you guys think about his opinion? i'm a firm believer that when you beat, you beat. and it doesn't matter what hand you have.
i can understand what he is saying.
p.s:he agree i play too many table. because some people at live, take up to 1-5 minute to make a decision, that is 1 table. and online only give you 15second, and running multi-table is not a good thing for decision making.
Yer talking about 'balls', but thats not exactly productive advice on what changes you need to make to your game.
So....
If you stink at postflop, play the 20 Big Blind Rathole Style:
Buy in for minimum.
Play the 20 Big blind stack size game.
That way there is just about zero play on the turn and the river.
Rathole the money when you are above 30 Big blinds.
Play AK TT+ in EP (maybe add AQs)
Play AQ+ 88+ in MP (Maybe add AJs, KQs)
Bet 5 Big blinds preflop and push all in on a good flop.
Develop a thick skin for the insults people type to you about being a small stack rathole nit.
After a few tens of thousands of hands if you are winning slowly increase your buy in stack size.... 21,... 22 ... 23 big blinds. Soon you will have enough to play the turn..... then the river....
Slowly ease your way into learning postflop play... that's really where you want to end up...
Comments?
Either play short stack or buyin for full, anything in the middle (especially increasing buyin by 1BB) really doesn't serve any purposes. Drop in limits/number of tables and start learning to play postflop like mentioned, or just shortstack ninja around. IMO, you are better off buying in full and start learning postflop plays if anything as that will be more beneficial and more profitable in the long run.
I dunno if I agree with this method of learning postflop play. This is pretty much shove or fold strategy which doesn't help in postflop skills such as betsizing, potcontrol, etc..
I don't see where this is going to develop his game at all. The guy has logged over 160,000 hands and you suggest that he start shortstacking uNL?
Learning to play post flop needs to be done on a full stack, period. And 1BB increases to his stack is just silly.
Chuckie, if your buddy has told you to "not work on your post flop" and you agree with this in anyway you are doomed to life of grinding rakeback profits at the micro stakes. Good luck with that.
Your comment of "you are a firm believer that if you beat, you beat" shows your total lack of understanding in the game at such a basal level. After 160,000 hands your bad habits may have become so ingrained into your mindset that you may never break them.
I have given you some advice on how to regroup earlier in this thread. If you have questions about it fire away. If you want to post hands, I will contribute my thoughts on them. If you think that you simply need to get some balls... You are on your own.
Caddy
thanks for the advise
i didn't agree to my friend method. he doesn't play online, he couldn't understand online.
i can see his way work with 1/2 NL live, so many people won't laydown TPWK, or MPTP, but online is different issue.
I didn't go to 6 max yesturday, i want to get some datamine going first.
i did pretty well FR at 50NL. grind in $180 in two hour, but of course, variance factor kick in.
set over a set (-$90) and KK against a maniac VPIP 72/36/12, he bet with nothing, bottom pair, middle pair. draw....etc.
no way i'm laying that down against manaic.
unfortunely he has AA (-60).
that still leave me $30 profit, for 1000 hands. so roughtly 3bb/100
i can see the importance for working on post flop play.
for yesturday, won without showdown is $80, all-in (-$50).
if i didn't cut the table, and focus on playing poker, and picking up those dead money. it would have be a bad night for me.
i quote the above comment, can you explain more?
P.S: i notice, when ever i see a bet that i don't understand. I just raise it. is that standard line? or too donky.
of course, i'll note it when he fold/call/reraise. so i can use it again him
This is exactly what I am referring to. The bet/fold mentality. Don't raise because you are confused. You cost your self alot of money in playing this way because you are playing street by street without any idea of what your villain is holding and making your decisions based on feel alone.
Don't get me wrong, playing by feel is great but if you don't have any idea of what is going on post flop, what is your feel based on?
If your process sounds like this, "He fired 2 bullets on a dry board, he must have it. I fold" or "I think he is bluffing, I raise." You are missing alot of what is important.
Here is a hand I played last night from memory and what went through my head:
Villain is 20/12 with AF of 1.75 over 125 hands. He will donkbet flop when he has a small piece like midpair to top pair weak kicker. We both have 100BB @ 50NL.
He plays as many hands out of the blinds as he plays from the button so he is not aware of the importance of position.
I raise :10c:10d to $2 on the button. He calls from SB.
Now at this point based on our above reads he know he holds a range that looks something like the following:
We can also discount the top part of his range like AK, AQ, AA, KK, QQ, maybe even JJ. While it is possible that he holds any of these hands, he would usually re-raise them preflop given his PFR numbers.
(Pot $4.5) Flop::4s:jh:2c
He checks, I bet $4 and he calls.
Now he is Out of Positon but he liked his hand enough to call a Pot Sized Bet. He also didn't donk bet into us which we know he likes to do with hands that catch a small piece of the flop which is something to note as well. Now we can start to remove some of this range it now looks something like this:
(Pot $12.5) Turn::4s:jh:2c:4d
He Checks, and I check behind.
I check for a these reasons:
First is pot control. I don't have a huge hand here and I am not looking to play for stacks with a pair of 10's. Checking behind keeps the pot small enough that I can call any bet he throws at me on the river if I think I am good.
Second is deception. I would fire a cbet on the flop with virtually all of my opening range on this flop. When I check behind on the turn he could very well put me on an Ax that missed the flop, any 2 broadways that missed or even some low suited connectors like 56, 67, 78, or 89.
(Pot $12.50) River::4s:jh:2c:4d:6s
He now bets $9 into me.
Well 35 just got there but it isn't really part of his range so I'll pay it off if that is what he has. A4, 44, 22, and 66 have me crushed as well as any hand with a Jack in it. But all of this is a small part of his flop calling range.
What hands play this way against me on the river?
Jx looking for some value, any of the big hands mentioned above or a pocket pair that thinks I likely have 2 high cards that have totally missed this board. I am pretty good against this range of hands.
Do I raise or just call?
I think a J calls down a reasonable bet here and of course any of the big hands will too while all the medium pocket pairs that we beat will likely fold.
I think a call is in order here.
Do you work your way through hands in this way? You should be. Even on the hands where you fold pre-flop you should be trying to read other peoples hands.
i actually have smilliar hand yesturday with TT as well.
i folded river bet........
i'm gonna go post some HH from some hand that i think i play it differently.
open o
Seat 1: macumba ($58.20)
Seat 2: TTDA ($47)
Seat 3: KhamsyN ($29.25)
Seat 4: menzdavid ($38.20)
Seat 5: ChesapeakeJanie ($22.95)
Seat 6: ammelia ($18.60)
Seat 7: aimz10 ($42.10)
Seat 8: allyasia ($52.45)
Seat 9: kennyric1 ($66.85)
KhamsyN posts the small blind of $0.25
menzdavid posts the big blind of $0.50
The button is in seat #2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to allyasia [Kh As]
ChesapeakeJanie raises to $1
ammelia calls $1
aimz10 calls $1
allyasia raises to $5.75 pretty standard.
kennyric1 folds
macumba folds
TTDA folds
KhamsyN folds
menzdavid folds
ChesapeakeJanie calls $4.75
ammelia calls $4.75
aimz10 calls $4.75 wow
*** FLOP *** [3d 5c 8c]
ChesapeakeJanie bets $17.20, and is all in
ammelia folds
aimz10 folds
allyasia has 15 seconds left to act
allyasia has requested TIME
allyasia: i'm gonna give you money i have no stats on this guy, but he just got to the table, and play like 80% of the hand, when pot big enough, he push on the flop. first two time there is no SD. it's a pretty big bet to call, but i think AK is ahead most of his range here.
allyasia calls $17.20
ChesapeakeJanie shows [Qs Jh]
allyasia shows [Kh As]
*** TURN *** [3d 5c 8c] [7d]
*** RIVER *** [3d 5c 8c 7d] [6h]
ChesapeakeJanie shows Queen Jack high
allyasia shows Ace King high
allyasia wins the pot ($55.25) with Ace King high
ChesapeakeJanie is sitting out
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $58.15 | Rake $2.90
Board: [3d 5c 8c 7d 6h]
Seat 1: macumba didn't bet (folded)
Seat 2: TTDA (button) didn't bet (folded)
Seat 3: KhamsyN (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 4: menzdavid (big blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 5: ChesapeakeJanie showed [Qs Jh] and lost with Queen Jack high
Seat 6: ammelia folded on the Flop
Seat 7: aimz10 folded on the Flop
Seat 8: allyasia showed [Kh As] and won ($55.25) with Ace King high
Seat 9: kennyric1 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 1: MrRuffles ($66.45)
Seat 2: iasgbyg ($45.25)
Seat 3: Goso ($10)
Seat 4: pretending ($52.75)
Seat 5: BD Mack ($46.10)
Seat 6: allyasia ($47)
Seat 7: p70babi1ity ($55.50)
Seat 8: podo1 ($23.75)
Seat 9: Ya BoY ThA OG ($267.80)
Ya BoY ThA OG posts the small blind of $0.25
MrRuffles posts the big blind of $0.50
The button is in seat #8
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to allyasia [Qc Ac]
iasgbyg folds
Goso folds
pretending folds
BD Mack folds
allyasia raises to $1.75
p70babi1ity calls $1.75
podo1 folds
Ya BoY ThA OG folds
MrRuffles folds
*** FLOP *** [8d Ks Qh]
allyasia bets $3
p70babi1ity calls $3
*** TURN *** [8d Ks Qh] [Ts]
allyasia checks
p70babi1ity checks stats
*** RIVER *** [8d Ks Qh Ts] [5d]
allyasia checks
p70babi1ity bets $4.50 44/10/3.5 i think he would be his weak K when i check the turn. so i call here . cheap enough
allyasia calls $4.50
*** SHOW DOWN ***
p70babi1ity shows [Th As] a pair of Tens
allyasia shows [Qc Ac] a pair of Queens
allyasia wins the pot ($18.30) with a pair of Queens
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $19.25 | Rake $0.95
Board: [8d Ks Qh Ts 5d]
Seat 1: MrRuffles (big blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 2: iasgbyg didn't bet (folded)
Seat 3: Goso didn't bet (folded)
Seat 4: pretending didn't bet (folded)
Seat 5: BD Mack didn't bet (folded)
Seat 6: allyasia showed [Qc Ac] and won ($18.30) with a pair of Queens
Seat 7: p70babi1ity showed [Th As] and lost with a pair of Tens
Seat 8: podo1 (button) didn't bet (folded)
Seat 9: Ya BoY ThA OG (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 1: FabFour70 ($54.75)
Seat 2: allyasia ($115.70)
Seat 3: jose2128 ($16.90), is sitting out
Seat 4: thauer ($51.25)
Seat 5: rafter_ad ($38.35)
Seat 6: flux32 ($22.80)
Seat 7: PurpleGoo ($58.15)
Seat 8: spartacus3 ($21.55)
Seat 9: jademonolith ($22.85)
thauer posts the small blind of $0.25
rafter_ad posts the big blind of $0.50
The button is in seat #2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to allyasia [2d 2c]
flux32 folds
PurpleGoo folds
spartacus3 folds
jademonolith calls $0.50
FabFour70 folds
allyasia raises to $2.25
thauer folds
rafter_ad has 15 seconds left to act
rafter_ad folds
jademonolith calls $1.75
*** FLOP *** [6c 5s 6s]
jademonolith has 15 seconds left to act
jademonolith bets $3.50
allyasia raises to $10.50 I give him no credit for hitting
jademonolith folds
Uncalled bet of $7 returned to allyasia
allyasia mucks
allyasia wins the pot ($11.65)
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $12.25 | Rake $0.60
Board: [6c 5s 6s]
Seat 1: FabFour70 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 2: allyasia (button) collected ($11.65), mucked
Seat 3: jose2128 is sitting out
Seat 4: thauer (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 5: rafter_ad (big blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 6: flux32 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 7: PurpleGoo didn't bet (folded)
Seat 8: spartacus3 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 9: jademonolith folded on the Flop
I think this is where problem is. after reading the caddy's post.
he folded. so i think my hand is good here.
but had him call i did probly shut down. unless i hit a 2.
had him reraise, i did probly get push off with the best hand.
i have no stats on villian, new to the table. had this been a better player that know 6 or 5 is not in my rasing range. I think i did get push off here.
Seat 1: FabFour70 ($50.40)
Seat 2: allyasia ($113.80)
Seat 3: jose2128 ($32.65)
Seat 4: bdls0406 ($26.75)
Seat 5: rafter_ad ($38.30)
Seat 6: zpcm13 ($56.60)
Seat 7: ewertz ($50.65)
Seat 8: KrazeeKramer ($60.10)
jose2128 posts the small blind of $0.25
bdls0406 posts the big blind of $0.50
The button is in seat #2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to allyasia [Kh 9h]
rafter_ad folds
zpcm13 folds
ewertz folds
KrazeeKramer folds
FabFour70 calls $0.50
allyasia raises to $2.25
jose2128 folds
bdls0406 has 15 seconds left to act
bdls0406 calls $1.75
FabFour70 folds
*** FLOP *** [9c 6d As]
bdls0406 checks
allyasia bets $3
bdls0406 calls $3
*** TURN *** [9c 6d As] [Ad]
bdls0406 checks
allyasia checks
*** RIVER *** [9c 6d As Ad] [5h]
bdls0406 has 15 seconds left to act
bdls0406 bets $6
allyasia has 15 seconds left to act
Gavrilo1918 sits down
Gavrilo1918 adds $50
allyasia folds
Uncalled bet of $6 returned to bdls0406
bdls0406 mucks
bdls0406 wins the pot ($10.70)
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $11.25 | Rake $0.55
Board: [9c 6d As Ad 5h]
Seat 1: FabFour70 folded before the Flop
Seat 2: allyasia (button) folded on the River
Seat 3: jose2128 (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 4: bdls0406 (big blind) collected ($10.70), mucked
Seat 5: rafter_ad didn't bet (folded)
Seat 6: zpcm13 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 7: ewertz didn't bet (folded)
Seat 8: KrazeeKramer didn't bet (folded)
Villian stas 38/13/11, I play it too tight. i think i should of look him up.