Folding Pre-Flop w a Monster
I'm starting to realize that going all-in pre-flop is generally a bad idea. How many of us have been burned pre-flop holding AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AKs, AQs, etc. and still getting one or two callers after going all-in to lose to garbage. I recall some comment about Phil Ivey's tournament play and that he tries to avoid going all-in preflop as he knows that he can out play most other players after the flop, river or turn. Does anyone else try to avoid going all-in pre-flop even with a monster hand? This is assuming you are not playing in a turbo tournament or are late in a tournament where the blinds are quite high relative to the average chip count. Of course position and number of callers would also be an issue.
PokerJAH
PokerJAH
Comments
Basically, I prefer post-flop play and getting the rest of the money in then, but I'm willing to put all my chips in pre-flop with those 2 hands.
Excellent response Beanie - I feel exactly the same way.
I'll assume this relates to AA/KK. Yes, I'd call the entire table's all-in (barring the magic read of AA for someone). You may not be favored to win more than 50% of the time against multiple opponents, but you are still the favorite to win the hand. And you're actually worried more about weak hands (2 live cards, suited/connected) than you are about real hands (since, for example, with AA you have AK, AQ, and any pocket pair significantly dominated).
As before, avoiding it (preferring post-flop) and be willing to do it are 2 different things. With AA you should never fold pre-flop (except in special satellite bubble situations). With KK, you should almost never fold pre-flop, barring that "super read".
AK is great to get all in preflop in the right situation since it is difficult to play post flop. My problem is I do it too often against KK and AA. Or 22.
The others are all situational.
I believe you almost did at Lucky Lous' last year, right? All-In preflop against pocket 7s?
Few months back at Niagara (when I was still allowed in the city) I was sitting at a 1/2nl table with one of my good buddies. He limps UTG with KK, utg+1 who is EXTREMELY tight makes it $20 to go, 2 calls, action back to my buddy who makes it $100, UTG+1 pushes for $450 more, one of the earlier limpers call with a shorter stack, my friend thinks for about a minute and folds KK face up, the entire table, including myself, were in disbelief (most people commented on how stupid he is). Low and behold UTG+1 flipped over AA and took down the pot.
I couldnt believe he folded KK while getting about 2:1, with $100 of his own chips in the pot. My friend is not very tight either.
I don't think I'd ever be able to make that laydown.
Is it possible to not go broke when you have KK and some one has AA regardless of chip stacks?
It is possible. I've had KK and gotten re raised pre flop and just called. When the A comes out I folded. He did have AA. I was extrememly short chipped after but I put him on AK preflop and didn't want to race on the bubble.
Now, switch that to a big stack, 100xbb or more. You may be able to figure out if you are beaten pre-flop. 'may'... I can't yet since most of the people I have played against would push with AK, KK or QQ (or worse!) and maybe even AQ so it is pretty hard to let KK go. Heck, I just saw 3 guys push on the first hand of a SNG. They had 88, AKo and ATs. 88 won unimproved.
which leads me to think now a days that I play for the flop.
since I have adopted this idea, KK has won me alot more during sit n go's
Cash games well that s just another thing.
ppl still call suited connectors too much and catch them