Floping the Nuts Part II
I am playing a 1/2 cash game and find myself in a hand with a woman whom I know and believe to be a decent player, although I haven't seen her at the tables in 8 months. She has decided to auto straddle my Big Blind. The dealer is sitting between us if that makes any difference.
I have A7 spades. 4 limpers of 4.00 I call the straddle for the first time in an hour. She raises to 25.00 as she has done most of the night. Folded to me, I call.
Flop comes K 6 3 spades. I raise 50.00. She re-raises me to 100.00. I have 280.00 left. I push wanting her to believe I am on the draw.
After a good 7 minutes she ask to see a card? How should I have answered this question? What would you do?
I will put up what I did at 5:00 pm and let you know how the hand turned out.
Prophet 22
I have A7 spades. 4 limpers of 4.00 I call the straddle for the first time in an hour. She raises to 25.00 as she has done most of the night. Folded to me, I call.
Flop comes K 6 3 spades. I raise 50.00. She re-raises me to 100.00. I have 280.00 left. I push wanting her to believe I am on the draw.
After a good 7 minutes she ask to see a card? How should I have answered this question? What would you do?
I will put up what I did at 5:00 pm and let you know how the hand turned out.
Prophet 22
Comments
Tell her you'll let her see BOTH cards for only $280. I can't see how showing her either card will help get a call.
ditto, what's the point...I can't stand people that do that, just call or fold already!
In my humble opinion, when people ask a question like that, they are looking for an excuse to make them feel better when they fold. I would stay quiet and let her call to see the bad news. If she folds, I would not show her anything and let it burn at her. She will be more likely to pay you off later. With that in mind, I would not attempt to bluff at her later in the day.
What were you thinking when you called with A7?
As far as the other question is concerned, sit their quiet without saying a word. If she had taken 3 minutes I would have called the clock on her, no need to think about this for 7 minutes she's wasting everyone's time.
stp
Great flop though.
Don't show her a dam thing.
Hobbes
My post was completely different than this one. I called against two overly aggressive players that were, at the time, playing pretty much any two cards. I had a history with these two players and a repuation to use to my advantage. I was unlucky in that hand to walk into to monsters and of course got lucky to hit trips. I also only called a raise of $9 whereas Brent called a raise of $23, evn though I know the stack sizes and %'s are comparable to Brent's situation. My post was also not about the preflop call, as I learned it was a poor one (in that case). My post was about my post flop play.
Now, if Brent had said "This lady had always overbet the pot huge with micro-pairs and I knew it was at worst a coin flip" than yeah sure he can call here. Although even that is suspect, he was wayyyy out of position and could have easily been re-raised by anyone else in the pot.
Another thing I think you should consider, I would play 75c anyday to a raise before I play A7s. Hopefully atleast a couple of the good players on here can agree with me on that one.
stp
There's no one else in the pot - they all folded. He is definitely out of position, though.
Not one of the good players but I would hesitate to call a big raise (assuming I had more than a micro stack) with either of those hands unless my name is Kreskin.
My comments should not be construed as an endosement for calling an obnoxious overbet with A-7 suited and you can justify your 5-7 call with a shortstack and subsequent poor play (I would hope you call with 5-7 hoping for a flush, straight, or two pair/ not to catch a single pair) all you want.
I just don't think you should be one of the firsts on the board to criticize others for making a loose pre-flop call.
/s/ Newbie
Sounds like he knew she was playing any 2 cards
You've never played with me, my 75c was one example. If I can't critique (not critisize) who can? Sheeesh.
stp
As to the OP, I am curious as to what hand the lady raised $25 and whether she folded. Any chance the Prophet could end the suspense early.
I would have gone and gotten a sandwich. Told the dealer to open your cards if she called.
Brent did not ask for feedback on the pre-flop call. Yes, I commented on it but only because I've known Brent for a while and enjoy bugging him about his pre-flop decisions, which I frequently tell him are dubious.
As for the big re-raise on the flop, this does not represent a draw to me. This looks like someone trying to defend a made hand against a draw or a good hand with a strong draw. Something like AK, KK, or AA one of them a spade. Maybe even a small set. If she's playing something like QQ or JJ or a weak king, I would expect this kind of bet to chase her out. Showing her the Ace would lead her to believe you either had Aces or AK along with a strong draw. Showing the 7 could only lead her to think you had some kind of flush. If she's got a mid-pair or crappy king, neither card would entice her to call.
I can't wait to hear the bad beat ending where she went runner runner for quad queens.
Let me define a straddle. The person under the gun doubles the big blind and has the option to act last before the flop. She raised it to 25.00 total, which was a pot size bet with the other people who had called her straddle.
Let me start out by saying it is hard to describe on the forum about playing poker. I have given you one hand. I sat at that table for an hour before I made that move. I also bought in for 150.00 and in 2 1/2 hours walked out with 1K. I appreciate the thoughts about my play. I do have 2 poker coaches that I run things by as well as other guys I enjoy talking poker with. This is a game where I believe we can all learn from others so for someone to say it is a brutal call, I can live with that, I like playing poker and when I called the 21.00 raise, I thought this is not about the cards, it is about the person involved. I had watched her for an hour, one thing for sure is she had know idea of what cards I was playing on that hand.
Greg is right, I really didn’t know how to respond to get the call I wanted. I decided to show the seven. I believed her to have a pair and she was trying to represent a flush when she re-raised. Or she had the flush and was wondering if her Jack was good enough. She had me covered by 50.00. After I waited another 5 minutes she calls saying that she thinks I am bluffing.
She shows Jack 10 spades. I turn over my cards and say I have the nuts and show the Ace. Turn 8 spades, river a heart.
As far as position and why I made the call, I have already talked with one of my poker coach. And his lessons and thoughts are important to me.
Greg, I know you didn’t like the play but we can talk on Saturday.
Prophet 22
PS I would like to know the philosophy on calling for the clock. Strength weakness etc.
Your poker coach needs to go back to coaching women's gymnastics.
stp
Re the clock, I don't know if it shows strength or weakness. Mostly just frustration - like let's get on with the @#$@$ game! It is rude to the other players to take an unecessarily long time to decide. If you can't make up your mind in a minute or two, how can 5 or 10 help? Are they hoping to get some kind of tell? There was a classic 'clock' play in the WSOP coverage this year. The woman agonized forever about whether to call all-in with some kind of schlock like KJs. The guy with AA called the clock on her. I really thought she would call. She timed out and was folded but didn't last much longer anyway.
Haha, only if his coaches will enlighten me with regards to my play afterwards. Totally kidding around though guys. Although if you really take me seriously, I'm sure I can find the link to Zithals parody of the heads up challenge and we can continue on with this ridiculousnous.
stp
Somebody find my toaster! Now everyone sit in a circle...
Nice hand, Brent.
JohnnieH
I think it is too risky to push here. I will do this exact play if I know my opponent knows me and how much I know about poker. They will then put me on top pair, trying to push out the flush draw.
Other wise I will play this hand a little slower. I will take 30 seconds to think about her raise and then raise her another $50, hoping to entice her into pushing or at least raising again. On the turn I would then bet half my remaining chips and the rest on the river giving her pot odds to call.
Keep in mind this is just hypothetical since I never flop the nuts and I am more of a tournament player.
Look at her and shrug or whatever. Do not show her a card.
Then if she is about to fold announces "OK... you pick one and I will turn it over."
What you want to do (thank you Mike Caro) is restart her thinking process if she is about to do what you do not want here to do. So, if she is about to fold do something... ANYTHING... to get her to reconsider. Knocking over a stack of chips is a good one. Standing up is also good.
I card rooms I play in, though, you are not allowed to turn up one card.
Thanks for the advice. You have some good ideas here. I also appreciate you not bashing me for playing A 7 suited. I guess you are being kind seeing as enough people already did that.
Each card room has it's own set of house rules and showing cards is allowed in most of the rooms I play. I just didn't know if showing her a card would entice the call I wanted.
Prophet 22
That's the problem with you kids today, no patients. As a player who gets the clock called on him allot. I learn more about you than anything else. This is a product of internet play, you action junkies play 3 or 4 tables 1min per hand. Poker is a strategy game, not a real time 1st person shooter. If you get frustrated it's a leak in your game, don't blame the thinker. It's not rude to the other players. I think we all forget how long real poker takes. We try to squeeze it into a our pressurize ADD lives.
My 2 cents to the OP, loose pre-flop call. Excellent read and post-flop play.