Who does the math anyway?

TheBusDriver

This might be a topic for the general section, but I respect the opinion of you guys far more than the average stranger.

The math crossed my mind a few times last night. Once when AJ raised taking away my pot odds, so the math told me to fold, and I did. Then I thought, the math always gets me in trouble, and I more often than not use it against players who do the math like religion (i.e. ugly cousin). Then later in the tourny it was very clear Justin burned his math book, and starting playing the man to man game.

When it comes down to Math vs gut which do you go with?

beanie42

I play by feel most of the time. I generally only go by odds when it is a really close decision or when the odds are ridiculously good (call with any 2, etc.).

SirWatts

The frame of the game is math. Your feel or reads just tell you what numbers to put in the equations.

Yorkpoker

both good comments.

I think the mastery of the game is knowing the math (at least having a good enough handle to approximate accurately) and then use feel to make up the ground.

Looking at some of the pros, they are all experts at reading people. They likely all know the math as well (to the nth decimal) but are able to remember your hands and tells well enough to not need to know equity at any given time.

Read the story DN posted about his hand at the RHPT when he figured a guy for K9 and was dead on. That is what makes him a winner.

The other thing to remember about math is that although it is correct in the long run, any one given instance can be the exception. This includes the one hand you should technically fold, but REALLY have a good feeling about as you are rampaging and rushing all at once.

BigChrisEl

I am not a math player and play more by my gut. I find that when I play the math I tend to get myself into situations are more sticky because I made a call because I have odds and then having to make another call even though I'm beat but because I'm getting odds to do so.

I find it is good to know the math however because if you know you are playing against a math player you can use it against them by not giving them odds to call your bets, even though you may not have a hand anyways.

Hork42

Remember to keep implied odds in mind when making your decision. Often your immediate odds will be unfavourable, but if you do make your draw, you have the chance of taking down a large pot.

This is especially true if you have a non-obvious draw like a gapped-connector that turns into a straight. If you're drawing to a flush, it may be more obvious when you make it and your opponent may not pay you off. But if you're holding something like 96, and you complete a straight, they may not see it coming as easily.

JHJ

Poker envolves two things math and psychology. Math is great to frigure out where you are and compare it to a general number of hands. When it comes to playing the math, you should be good enough that you know where you stand in most situations. But the key is to know what your opponent has so you can calculate the odds you have of beating him/making a better hand/or being out drawn. Math is secondary to me after the flop always. Once you play a lot you know where you stand in general based on your hand and the flop. My suggestion is to know the math and not to call anything that goes strongly against the math, cause even if your opponent has less then you, the risk still probably isnt worth it. When you get down to small numbers of players left in a tournament the math becomes less important and the psychology becomes really important.

If everyone is playing the math perfectly then the odds will work out to everyone having the same number of chips in the long run. The key is to break the math at the right time to gain the advantage against the other players. If that means playing 3 5 then so be it!

Chugs

SirWatts wrote:

The frame of the game is math. Your feel or reads just tell you what numbers to put in the equations.

That is one of the most eloquent quotes i've seen in a long time.