Omaha Hi Hand - Turn Action

westside8

Playing a little bit of Omaha on Stars while doing a couple of SnGs, just wondering if I can get some comments on how I played this hand from Omaha veterans

I'm in the cutoff in the 0.5/1 game with $60

:ks :kd :10d :7s

Limped after 3 limpers. Button also limps, SB complete and BB checks.

Flop comes down :6s :2s :jh - Gives me second nut flush draw

Checked around

Turn :kh - Gives me top set, still has second nut flush draw

UTG raises pot, the player has shown he overvalues overpair (pocket pair) as I saw him called/raised with AA/KK when the board is QJ9, or three to a suit. 1 caller to me, should I raise (if so, pot?). Flat call and see if I get the boat since my flush draw might not be good? Also with a second flush draw out there, too early to commit to the pot?

Thanks.

GTA Poker

Pot.

The best hand he can have against your hand would be an AAQT double suited 2 nut flush draw wrap which is unlikely, he could also have a lower set or a single nut flush draw with a lower set or something wayyyyyyyyyyyyy worse.
In the worst AAQT scenario your are even money, against anything else in his range you are ahead. Of course, your odds are even better with 2 callers. POTPOTPOT!

DrTyore

Allright...

So, 7 pre-flop limpers = pot of $3.50.

First: the limp is fine. Rarely is it smart to raise pre-flop, you're not often more than 60% to win the hand, and more money in a pot mean more it could cost you to draw (if necessary).

2nd: Check on the turn is fine - you have an over pair. In Omaha, this is about equivalent of third button (not quite, but it's BR healthy to think that way)

3rd: Now it gets interesting.... $3.50 bet at you, and you have the "Current nuts" or CN, there are two cards that will give you the pure nuts (PN - Ah and Kc), and that leaves 9 cards that give you the realistic nuts (RN any of the 6,2, or J pairing), remember, quads are slightly more common in OM, don't fear them, but don't run apeshit crazy into them either - yea.. I made all these up.

The last card you want to see is a (non-ace) heart - makes it a hard decision for you. So, of the remaining 44 cards, you have 11 that make you golden. Also, any card that is a brick is good too - in this case there are 4 (8's & 7's that aren't suiting up the board). So, there are 15 cards that will guarantee your hand is best out of the 44 remaining. My quick math tells me that about 1/3 of the time you will have at LEAST the RN hand.

I would raise. I don't know if I'd go pot, because as I said, strictly card-wise, you're going to hit the lock-up hand 1/3 of the time, so you don't necessarily want to chase away both players. It also swells that pot to pound on them on the river when / if you hit. If you don't hit, they'll be worried about your push here. That kinda board, I figure the guy has maybe top two pair, and a decent draw, or there's the old standby of he has 6-6-K-A and he thinks he has a boat. Besides the double suitedness, this is an excellent board for you so far.

So... say you raise atop of him again, the pot is currently 10.50, and you can make it 14, and allow yourself to get it up to $28 with no callers. If both guys call you back, the pot jumps to obscene proportions. I think you want to make a raise that allows you to get all in if you're nutted, but fold with a decent stack left if disaster strikes. If you were to raise say $10 on top, this would put the pot at $24, with two more callers, it swells to $44 - a good size as it is 2/3 of your current stack, and you can get your remaining $46 in on the river. Also, and don't ask me why, non pot-sized bets seem to scare people more! <Shrug>. I think someone will point out that they're supposed to call $10 into a pot of $24, but you do have two "defensive" suited cards, which protect and ruin their odds for the spade draw (as I said, you're NOT hoping to flush up, unless it's a paired heart or the A), so that makes them miscalculate their odds, and Sklansky loves you... too.

So, based on what the turn is, and given you have position (1,000,000 x more important in PLOM btw), you can now act smarty. If you make either the PN or RN, and they're sill enough to raise into you, push cram and slap your money down - if you run into quads, well, that sucks, reload and do it all again, and I'll owe you a beer. If one of the cards that give the potential for someone ELSE to win, well, check it out if you can (the check-raise is DEVASTATING in PLOM), and if not, you'll have to decide how much you're willing to complain about losing on top set.

The only info you didn't give is the other chip stack sizes, and the callers tendencies. Personally, I think this is how I move in this situation, though it takes a LOT of practice to figure all that out relatively quickly. Isn't Omaha fun?

Mark

Pinhead

Wes did you run into a smaller set and get 1-outed again? Because the last time was pretty funny for me

Also, I think Mark is confusing Hearts and Spades (since Wes doesn't actually have a heart in his hand)
Hopefully Mark will be doing more of this on the weekend. I assume the .5/1 is actually the blinds, in which
case the pot PF is $7 not $3.50...and a river 5 isn't a brick to somebody with 43xx

I'm not actually going to comment on the play of the hand since I know almost nothing about Omaha, but I couldn't
resist giving you both a hard time in one time-saving post...especially Mark

DrTyore

Well, thank you Brad!!

I changed the outs calculations, but for the math now (sorry, been playing limit all night).... sigh

Pot starts at $7, with his pot raise and call, the pot gets to $21, meaning wes can put in $56 of his remaining $59. Again, do you want to chase everyone away? Probably not, so maybe a re-raise of about 15 bucks will swell the pot so you can get all in, but leave you with $37, not an irrelevant stack. This (with two callers) will lead to a pot of $73. If you get re-raised, well, push those chips in, and swear like a sailor at the dealer to drop some love for you.

So, basically - same advice, different numbers

Mark