Fox (BBC Z) vs. Zen (Dave Scharf)

literationliteration
in Brags, Beats & Variance
Ok, this isn't some MuchMusic battle but I noticed something interesting from these posts.

Here, BBC references an article about becoming a fox...
http://www.pokerforum.ca/forum/index.php?topic=4247.msg35292#msg35292


Here Dave references the Zen of poker...
http://www.pokerforum.ca/forum/index.php?topic=2900.msg24215#msg24215


Can I remove the word 'versus' and attribute this to differing styles or is this about understanding the texture(s) of the game and picking spots to put money in?  I might need more education and/or experience here because texture(s) is a poker associated work I've only seen recently in...

http://archiveserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=495010&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=all&vc=1

Thanks.

Comments

  • BBC ZBBC Z
    Foxes and Farmers is an article that tells you to start thinking more about your opponents and less about your cards. Farmers play big hands and fold marginal ones against all opponents. Foxes are smarter. They understand that a farmer only plays 'the nuts', thus, his blind is up for grabs every orbit. Farmers dont think at this level.

    This is the same argument that Miller is making in his 'take off the training wheels' post. You don't want to think in terms of 'I want 5 limpers before I play JTs' because you completely ignore player types. You want to think in terms of 'Two loose opponents limped in front of me, and they take 90% of their hands down to the river if they hit any piece of the board' so although my preflop limp with JTs may be marginal, I know I can outplay them on the flop if I make top pair or hit a flush draw.

    I think that Dave's post is more along the lines of how to deal with the very long run that +EV tournament poker is. Sometimes there are just situations you are trapped in that you can't escape and times that you play perfectly and bust out. They're all part of one long session, so don't get stressed about it.

    What I don't think the zen post refers to is just conceding defeat that 'You didn't get AA enough times in the tourney to win' or that you were too card dead to do anything.
  • literationliteration
    Thanks.  Good reply and some recent events are not such a big deal with this reminder...
    BBC Z wrote:
    They're all part of one long session, so don't get stressed about it.
  • Dave ScharfDave Scharf
    Foxes ARE zen.

    Chuck Thompson's article is one of the few classics in poker. If you have not read it and thought about it, do.

    But, my comments about "zen" are, I think, "fox-like." Foxes will take every single chip they can lay their hands on, and no more. This has NOTHING to do with what their cards were. It have everything to do with being adaptable and going with the flow.

    When I am off my game, I am applying the wrong weapons to the wrong players. That is not taking what I have been offered. That is trying to take more than my share.
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