I give up

I admit it, I clearly don't know how to win at this game.

PokerStars Hand #89261636650: Tournament #656011083, $50+$5 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (150/300) - 2012/11/14 23:41:09 ET
Table '656011083 28' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: pipemaster55 (3501 in chips)
Seat 2: Pjustaman (6462 in chips)
Seat 3: ZockSteffen (4761 in chips)
Seat 4: NikiStar777 (24476 in chips)
Seat 5: mouakk (6093 in chips)
Seat 6: Cardsdevil27 (40594 in chips)
Seat 7: DonkCommited (20309 in chips)
Seat 8: djgolfcan (5661 in chips)
Seat 9: 1&1_lol (12478 in chips)
pipemaster55: posts the ante 25
Pjustaman: posts the ante 25
ZockSteffen: posts the ante 25
NikiStar777: posts the ante 25
mouakk: posts the ante 25
Cardsdevil27: posts the ante 25
DonkCommited: posts the ante 25
djgolfcan: posts the ante 25
1&1_lol: posts the ante 25
pipemaster55: posts small blind 150
Pjustaman: posts big blind 300
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to djgolfcan [Kc As]
ZockSteffen: folds
NikiStar777: folds
mouakk: folds
Cardsdevil27: folds
DonkCommited: folds
djgolfcan: raises 300 to 600
1&1_lol: calls 600
pipemaster55: folds
Pjustaman: raises 5837 to 6437 and is all-in
djgolfcan: calls 5036 and is all-in
1&1_lol: folds
Uncalled bet (801) returned to Pjustaman
*** FLOP *** [Th Tc 6c]
*** TURN *** [Th Tc 6c] [Jd]
*** RIVER *** [Th Tc 6c Jd] [Js]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Pjustaman: shows [2s Jc] (a full house, Jacks full of Tens)
djgolfcan: shows [Kc As] (two pair, Jacks and Tens)
Pjustaman collected 12247 from pot
djgolfcan finished the tournament in 195th place
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Comments

  • You should have been the one with J2os then you would have won.
    You are welcome .

    could be just variance ? its got to win 1 in 100 times
  • Don't give up yet, the micro millions are here!
  • lol this thread
  • meh, repost
  • i know it's frustrating to get sucked out on (all the time), and i feel the same way even though you are getting your money in good. poker can be really harsh in that perfect play can still lose. i'm a very competetive person and i hate it when i lose. i hate losing way more than i enjoy winning in fact. that's what makes poker difficult for me personally.

    how much volume are you putting in just out of curiousity? for example, how many tables do you play at once? how many tournaments in a session? i know the short answer to your issue is 'variance' and i know that doesn't really help much.

    i want to try and come up with some sort of reward system for myself every time i get it in with the best and lose just so i can program myself to feel that it's actually really a win even those variance just nailed me again.
  • I think the hardest part to swallow is that jagoffs like this are pulling this garbage at a $50 game and winning. We've all played hundreds of hours and see all kind of good hands get it in and sometimes the JJ vs QQ wins but it's crap like this that make you want to commit a crime
  • trigs wrote: »
    i know it's frustrating to get sucked out on (all the time), and i feel the same way even though you are getting your money in good. poker can be really harsh in that perfect play can still lose. i'm a very competetive person and i hate it when i lose. i hate losing way more than i enjoy winning in fact. that's what makes poker difficult for me personally.

    how much volume are you putting in just out of curiousity? for example, how many tables do you play at once? how many tournaments in a session? i know the short answer to your issue is 'variance' and i know that doesn't really help much.

    i want to try and come up with some sort of reward system for myself every time i get it in with the best and lose just so i can program myself to feel that it's actually really a win even those variance just nailed me again.

    Each loss with the best (not flips, but 85%+ favourite to win) = one fudgecicle to eat. EZ game... And possibly diabetes for DJ :)
  • So with 15bb you min raise from the cutoff and then call off the rest of your stack with Ace-high?

    Not sure why you're confused here, unless you're confused as to why you played it so poorly.
  • Card Dead wrote: »
    So with 15bb you min raise from the cutoff and then call off the rest of your stack with Ace-high?

    Not sure why you're confused here, unless you're confused as to why you played it so poorly.

    tumblr_m89mmh3rwv1rzbvsto1_500.gif
  • Card Dead wrote: »
    So with 15bb you min raise from the cutoff and then call off the rest of your stack with Ace-high?

    Not sure why you're confused here, unless you're confused as to why you played it so poorly.

    Somebody move this to the HOF
  • Card Dead wrote: »
    So with 15bb you min raise from the cutoff and then call off the rest of your stack with Ace-high?

    Not sure why you're confused here, unless you're confused as to why you played it so poorly.

    hi Pjustaman, why the name change?
  • T8urmoney wrote: »
    hi Pjustaman, why the name change?

    I think we have a case of mistaken identity.
  • costanza wrote: »
    tumblr_m89mmh3rwv1rzbvsto1_500.gif
    I have never seen something so... perfect.
  • 18 BB and min raise with AKo? that's begging for a suck out lmao. It's a hand that doesn't play well post flop. Ship it in since u have 2 shorties in the blinds. V shoved cuz he reads ur min raise and the big stack call as weakness. So yeah if u ship pre and he calls with J2o then it's a different story.
  • 18 BB and min raise with AKo? that's begging for a suck out lmao. It's a hand that doesn't play well post flop. Ship it in since u have 2 shorties in the blinds. V shoved cuz he reads ur min raise and the big stack call as weakness. So yeah if u ship pre and he calls with J2o then it's a different story.

    LOL @ shoving AKo for 18bb's

    I can bet my life you are losing money in poker online!
    The minraise is fine, and 3x is to much.. "AK plays bad post flop""??? WTF ARE U TALKING ABOUT???
  • Tcarnage wrote: »
    LOL @ shoving AKo for 18bb's

    I can bet my life you are losing money in poker online!
    The minraise is fine, and 3x is to much.. "AK plays bad post flop""??? WTF ARE U TALKING ABOUT???

    Lol who's the crybaby here? Ofc AKo doesn't play well post flop. 2/3 of the time there's no A or K on the flop, means u have A high. Here u don't want a hand that's flipping with u flat and suck out. Min raise price big stack in. The chip leader flatted cuz he wants to see a flop cheap and stack u u dummy:wink2:
  • Lol who's the crybaby here? Ofc AKo doesn't play well post flop. 2/3 of the time there's no A or K on the flop, means u have A high. Here u don't want a hand that's flipping with u flat and suck out. Min raise price big stack in. The chip leader flatted cuz he wants to see a flop cheap and stack u u dummy:wink2:

    Wat8.jpg?1315930535
  • Lol who's the crybaby here? Ofc AKo doesn't play well post flop. 2/3 of the time there's no A or K on the flop, means u have A high. Here u don't want a hand that's flipping with u flat and suck out. Min raise price big stack in. The chip leader flatted cuz he wants to see a flop cheap and stack u u dummy:wink2:

    wow, the ignorance of this post makes my head hurt
  • Richard~ wrote: »
    wow, the ignorance of this post makes my head hurt

    Lets not be too hard on Spicy, obviously quite new to poker... be gentle..:)

    And Spicy, you are getting advice from some real experienced players here, Tcarnage and ~Richard... Don't be too quick to discard their suggestions..
  • 7 stages of AK

    1) Denial: "There's no way I could've missed the flop. They were suited. I can call here, I probably still have the best hand. Shoot, I should raise to narrow the field"

    2) Anger: "I raised preflop. The board is 239. What the frig are they calling on? Oh, now they're re-raising me? Well, we'll frigging see about that. Fine, your 23o hit? Congrat-u-frigging-lations. Cap!"

    3) Guilt: "Man, I missed the turn and they're still betting into me. I am such a terrible player. I should really let go of this hand. Let go if it, dumb@ss. Let go. See, this is why you never make money at poker because you can't lay a hand down you stupid idiot JUST FOLD."

    4) Depression: "Call"

    5) Forgiveness: "It's ok, you have to look that guy up every once in a while with A high. He might've been on AQ or AJ, and you would've had the best hand then. It's good for your table image anyhow. People won't mess with you now.

    6) Acceptance: "Ok, next time I'll just limp and see a flop."

    7) Recovery: "Hey, AKs, alright - RAISE!"
  • Tcarnage wrote: »
    LOL @ shoving AKo for 18bb's

    I can bet my life you are losing money in poker online!
    The minraise is fine, and 3x is to much.. "AK plays bad post flop""??? WTF ARE U TALKING ABOUT???

    Yeah I'm just trying to be a bit sarcastic and by no means to disrespect the vets here. I didn't say I'd shove with AK, was trying to point out that only donkeys are calling 18BB shove with J2o. Still, it's certainly better than min raise with AKo. Why not 2.5x then? It's a reasonable size without pot committing urself. When it comes to shoving with all the hands I raise I'd reserve it to around 10BB. BTW I don't mind to listen to other ways of approaching in this situation. Why not tell me what u would've done here ?
  • Yeah I'm just trying to be a bit sarcastic and by no means to disrespect the vets here. I didn't say I'd shove with AK, was trying to point out that only donkeys are calling 18BB shove with J2o. Still, it's certainly better than min raise with AKo. Why not 2.5x then? It's a reasonable size without pot committing urself. When it comes to shoving with all the hands I raise I'd reserve it to around 10BB. BTW I don't mind to listen to other ways of approaching in this situation. Why not tell me what u would've done here ?

    no one 3x's anymore online, (or live) for that matter in mtt's, esp. with antes

    min raising is std
  • Yeah I'm just trying to be a bit sarcastic and by no means to disrespect the vets here. I didn't say I'd shove with AK, was trying to point out that only donkeys are calling 18BB shove with J2o. Still, it's certainly better than min raise with AKo. Why not 2.5x then? It's a reasonable size without pot committing urself. When it comes to shoving with all the hands I raise I'd reserve it to around 10BB. BTW I don't mind to listen to other ways of approaching in this situation. Why not tell me what u would've done here ?

    ok, my opinion would be to 2,2x it here, it's more or less my standard raise size at the limits I play ( when I play :< ). I really believe that if you're good enough postflop villain can never profitably defend his BB for 1,2 BB's more with these shallow stacks, if you have even more info he can for sure not defend even 1 extra BB profitably.

    The reason for this is that when we have 18 BB's our range is pretty set. Were either going to be opening what we consider a bluff (I'm doing this very rarely with this short a stack). A bluff could be a pure bluff like A6o for the blocker, 25s because people dont play much, or KJ something something darkside because you think that people flat much with worse hands but broadway type opens can be risky (all of the bluffs can be) since if someone reshoves you pre you have to give up your hand almost always so at an aggro table KJ is pretty much the same as 25. Anyway, I dont do that much

    The other part of our 18 BB open range is going to be strong. It'll be hands we want to call people's all in pre with maybe something like Aj+ 77+ something, depends a lot on your position and villain tendencies. Anyway, if someone takes his J2 up against that strong range of mine ( people talk about the 1:10 rule where you flop two pair or better about 10% of the time) so he has about a 10% chance to feel comfortable with the flop he gets, lets break it up into scenarios

    - 1. villain hits his bottom pair: This one beats some hands, impossible to know which, some of the times our bluffs will even have hit better, most villains will put the rest of the 18 bigs in and pray

    - 2. Villain his top pair: This gets a bit tricky, this beats most of our bluffs, and a couple of our pairs, top pair is something villain absolutely has to go on with if he called garbage pre

    - 3. Villain hits two pair or better: This beats most of our hands unless we hit a sick cooler flop, however, just because villain wants to get all the money in the middle, doesnt mean we have to (unless we hit a decent piece that is)

    - 3. Villain hits nothing: Villain now has the choice to either fold to our cbet or try to make a play at the pot. Again, except for when we bluff our range is going to be strong here, he can try to make a play for the pot, and he can feel like a champ when it works but, against a strong range in a spot where it's obviously tempting to bluff the check raise is probably not going to net him cash in the long run.

    With a read we can even 3 bet some ace high hands to his check raise on flops, if we can get a feel for when to do that and be right (even if only exactly 50% of the times) we will severely cripple his 1-3 scenarios and his chances of winning money in the long run from this spot.

    This is all pretty messily written but if you take it with a grain of salt I think you'll get the point I'm trying to make. Also, the 1-10 rule is pretty sweet to remember for in game math purpouses
  • Delete plz
  • Lol who's the crybaby here? Ofc AKo doesn't play well post flop. 2/3 of the time there's no A or K on the flop, means u have A high. Here u don't want a hand that's flipping with u flat and suck out. Min raise price big stack in. The chip leader flatted cuz he wants to see a flop cheap and stack u u dummy:wink2:


    Please play me Heads-up.. any stake up to $200's with a side bet...

    :D


    Any ways you realize, if you are missing 2/3rs of the time, you opponent will be missing 2/3's of the time as well, which theoreticly means that A high stil might be the best hand.. 2/3 of the time.. (OBVIOUS NOTE: IF VILLIAN MISSES FLOP AK IS AHEAD, UNLESS HAS SOME MAJOR DRAWS..)


    You are also 18bb deep in an mtt, with M = 8.38, you are going to need a double up pretty soon, and should be willing to flip in a situation like this or you are going to blind out pretty soon here..


    On a side note, you usually want to play pots with the chip leader because he is usually the one at the table that will call you the lightest when you are short. (Not saying this is proper, but it is true)

    Now if you would rather blind out with AK and minimize equity rather then maximizing it, (I've always thought this was what poker was about, but here I am obviously giving horrible advice) you want to induce and you should be able to take the flip or get it in the 68.79% favourite. (ODDS OF AKo VS J2o)

    Edit: On another note, this is a $55 MTT that has lots of fish that satty into it, with some very decent players as well.. This is something you should also put into perspective, if this was a $1 MTT i would not mind 3xing and calling a shove with it, but its just spewy in a $55 with some thinking players at ur time (Not saying the J2o guy is good)

    Just my .02 take it or leave it!
  • [ ] subtle brag

    Nice of you to go so crazy on a noob.

    This is what's wrong with strat these days, people get so offended over views and what they think is right and wrong

    Just offer your advice or thoughts and be done with it

    No one really cares about your graph tcarnage, not sure what u are trying to prove.
  • costanza wrote: »
    [ ] subtle brag

    Nice of you to go so crazy on a noob.

    This is what's wrong with strat these days, people get so offended over views and what they think is right and wrong

    Just offer your advice or thoughts and be done with it

    No one really cares about your graph tcarnage, not sure what u are trying to prove.


    Took out my graph for you..

    I'm not being harsh, I should be happy at some noob is going and trying to give advice on a Poker forum, and I hope others play the same way he is.

    If I wanted to be a dick, I would turn my head and agree with him in hopes that I get to play him one day, however trying to be nice I did give some proper advice..


    Sorry for actually trying to contribute on a poker forum and give knowledge, next time I will keep my thoughts to myself, hopefully everyone else with some poker knowledge and do the same as me, and not give any advice to the noobs.

    PS: Why would I be offended?
  • costanza wrote: »
    [ ] subtle brag

    Nice of you to go so crazy on a noob.

    This is what's wrong with strat these days, people get so offended over views and what they think is right and wrong

    Just offer your advice or thoughts and be done with it

    No one really cares about your graph tcarnage, not sure what u are trying to prove.

    Kindly stop the trolling, especially of a member who actually plays a lot of poker and very successfully... You brag here all the time so are not one to talk and I sure didn't see T's posts as brags, just establishing credibility. Rather a novel idea don't you think...?

    And T, pay no attention to the real noob... at poker at least. ;)
  • I'm oiiiiii
  • costanza wrote: »
    [ ] subtle brag

    Nice of you to go so crazy on a noob.

    This is what's wrong with strat these days, people get so offended over views and what they think is right and wrong

    Just offer your advice or thoughts and be done with it

    No one really cares about your graph tcarnage, not sure what u are trying to prove.

    Mike once again butthurt/hating on a winning poker pro ...pretty standard tbh
    Smh
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