This is why today's youth are unprepared for the real world ...

Comments

  • I had a student who didn't hand in the last two assignments and failed the course by one mark. He asked to hand in the last assignment. Uh no, the course will be offered again.

    Even though there is no physical mark - effort and professionalism is part of the consideration that goes into evaluation - it shows up in zeros and also awards for excellence.

    When grading work it becomes very difficult to assign grades of less than 40% and they become fairly meaningless and arbitrary because so little of the work is completed properly, it is difficult to assess a value to any of it.

    Reading between the lines it sounds like the policy is that it is the teacher's job to ensure all the work is submitted and that the recommendation for dismissal is based on this lack of effort, not that he assigned zero grades. It is probably just an extension of some sort of retention (of students) policy.
  • speaking as a teacher, i completely agree with this guy that we should be allowed to give out zeroes. if a student does absolutely nothing and refuses to put forth any effort, how can i give them anything but a zero?

    it's worse than what you might think though. we are not even allowed to penalize for lateness at all no matter the circumstance. literally, a student could hand in every assignment for the entire year on the last day of class and we'd have to mark it completely with no possible deductions.

    i understand the argument that the other side is making - that just giving out zeroes does not help the student learn nor does it reflect their actual knowledge of the subject - and i agree. however, there needs to be some sort of limit of responsibility on behalf of the student. it should be understood that their work needs to be completely in a timely fashion. everything outside of school works that way, so why would you not teach it to students before they get pushed out there?

    i've always liked the idea of rolling due dates ever since i had a few profs use them in university. pretty much, you have an entire week to hand in an assignment. it makes it almost impossible to not hand it in. after the week though - zero. kids gotta learn how the world works.
  • I'm not quite getting what you mean by rolling due dates.

    The no late penalty thing in Ontario schools always boggled my mind too.
  • moose wrote: »
    I'm not quite getting what you mean by rolling due dates.

    The no late penalty thing in Ontario schools always boggled my mind too.

    You have until the week of September 10th - 14th to figure it out.

    Mark
  • moose wrote: »
    I'm not quite getting what you mean by rolling due dates.

    The no late penalty thing in Ontario schools always boggled my mind too.

    rolling due date (or sliding due date) is when the students have an entire week to hand in the assignment. for example, students are given an assignment on Sept. 10th and they have two weeks to work on it. the rolling due date is then Sept. 24th-Sept. 28th. after the week, if the assignment is not handed in, it's a zero. this obviously doesn't solve every problem with zeroes and late penalties but it does help.

    some teachers like to give mark or percentage deductions per day or per week an assignment is late. we're not allowed to do that either though anymore. you can also combine this practice with rolling due dates, however, i don't agree with the deduction of marks in this way.

    btw, this is a big debate right now in our education system with teachers on both sides of the fence.
  • Hmm, may give this a trial run next year. I've used extension coupons in the past - one per student/semester - get out of jail free as it were.
  • moose wrote: »
    Hmm, may give this a trial run next year. I've used extension coupons in the past - one per student/semester - get out of jail free as it were.

    i've used rolling due dates before with great success. with my current school it doesn't really fit (students just work at their own pace individually).

    another good thing about rolling due dates is that it makes it easier for the teacher to mark. instead of getting 30 assignments on one day, they kind of slowly get brought in so you can pace yourself a bit. always helpful if you have a lot of classes/students.
  • I kind of prefer getting them all at once so I know where they are and don't lose track of them but we'll see how it goes.
  • moose wrote: »
    I kind of prefer getting them all at once so I know where they are and don't lose track of them but we'll see how it goes.

    heh, yeah it might require better organization. i'm pretty OCD when it comes to keeping my work crap in order. i'm actually bothered when the books on my desk are stacked proportional to size and are straight. funny, because my bedroom is usually a mess lol.
  • moose wrote: »
    Reading between the lines it sounds like the policy is that it is the teacher's job to ensure all the work is submitted and that the recommendation for dismissal is based on this lack of effort, not that he assigned zero grades. It is probably just an extension of some sort of retention (of students) policy.

    So once again, no responsibility on the student.
  • No but students by nature are students. Teachers are supposed to teach them the importance of professionalism. Students are not required to get it all at once. Some need more hand holding than others. It doesn't mean they will never get it and remain forever useless.

    I'm not arguing for any late policy - as I said before at college in our program there is zero tolerance for lates, you either hand it in on time or don't bother. I think a rolling date policy is helpful in this regard. It doesn't fundamentally affect our late policy, but it is a relaxation of the rules in a student's mind which will create less conflict. I'll see how it goes. If it turns out 5 students come in 10 minutes late because they are out in the hallway copying out an assignment, well things will have to be adjusted. ;)

    I teach probably the only course in our program that has a late deduction policy and that is only because it is a major project course that takes 8 months to complete and some projects are more difficult than others so some flexibility in the due date is allowed.
  • Teacher was FIRED today . . . total BS, imo. School is meant to be a place of grinding oppression and iron discipline. No individualism is to be tolerated and all learning will be done by rote. Compliance is mandatory, and suggestions for improvement are not welcome. Thank you and have a nice day
  • i have to say though, as far as issues in our education system, this is low on the priority list.
  • milo wrote: »
    teacher was fired today . . . Total bs, imo. School is meant to be a place of grinding oppression and iron discipline. No individualism is to be tolerated and all learning will be done by rote. Compliance is mandatory, and suggestions for improvement are not welcome. Thank you and have a nice day

    what do you wanna do with your life?!?!?!???!
  • SuitedPair wrote: »
    what do you wanna do with your life?!?!?!???!


    You need this pic tho

    I-wanna-rock1.jpg
  • in grade 12 discrete I got an 8% on my report card for 2 reasons;

    1) hated the teacher
    2) sucked at it lol

    I should have gotten a 0 , I have no idea how I pulled off an 8... I went to class but I just sat there, didnt do tests, or home work lol

    swear on my life this is true btw

    wonder if i got an 8 because he wasnt allowed to give me a 0?
  • 10% attendance mark, imo.
  • Second term in World Issues I went to 2 classes . . . the first one, and the last. Only reason I went to the last one was because the teacher button-holed me in the caf while I was playing Euchre. Turned out he handed out copies of everything he wrote on the board all term. Got a 100% for the exam and a 55% over all for the term.
  • Milo wrote: »
    Second term in World Issues I went to 2 classes . . . the first one, and the last. Only reason I went to the last one was because the teacher button-holed me in the caf while I was playing Euchre. Turned out he handed out copies of everything he wrote on the board all term. Got a 100% for the exam and a 55% over all for the term.

    that's baller as hell lol
  • Naah . . . it was a stupid thing to do. Not that I didn't laugh my ass off at the time. Overall mark for the year was 79%.
  • Milo wrote: »
    Naah . . . it was a stupid thing to do. Not that I didn't laugh my ass off at the time. Overall mark for the year was 79%.

    Brownnoser... Only the slackers player euchre... With us it was bridge and/or hearts 1st class to noon, then the pool hall till dinner... That was my Ryerson education.... made me what I am today.. Wait a minute now...
  • Milo wrote: »
    Second term in World Issues I went to 2 classes . . . the first one, and the last. Only reason I went to the last one was because the teacher button-holed me in the caf while I was playing Euchre. Turned out he handed out copies of everything he wrote on the board all term. Got a 100% for the exam and a 55% over all for the term.
    compuease wrote: »
    Brownnoser... Only the slackers player euchre... With us it was bridge and/or hearts 1st class to noon, then the pool hall till dinner... That was my Ryerson education.... made me what I am today.. Wait a minute now...

    I had Accounting right after lunch, same time as some of my buddies had their lunch. So I took the booklet, did all the assignments in about a month, and spent the rest of the semester playing basketball in the gym.
  • The only class that I really completely skipped out on was a women's studies class I took in the summer in university. Went to the first two classes and came to the conclusion that the prof was a nutbag. Didn't attend again until last day to write the in class exam. I just emailed all other assignments to her. Think I got in the 80's still. Guess I'm not a feminist though.
  • For the sake of discussion, aren't today's youth more prepared for the "real world" tho?
  • costanza wrote: »
    For the sake of discussion, aren't today's youth more prepared for the "real world" tho?

    No. No, they're not. The vast majority of youth today have an attitude of "the world owes me so I'm not going to work for it." I will say there are a LOT of really good kids out there, which includes several CPF children by all accounts, and that's awesome. Unfortunately, there are even more that are overall just a bunch of lazy ass slackers with no work ethic and no respect.

    Fuck I sound old.
  • costanza wrote: »
    For the sake of discussion, aren't today's youth more prepared for the "real world" tho?

    Hell, no . . . they have no concept of finances. Growing up with parents who survived the Great Depression, as well as World War Two, the basic concepts of money management were drilled into my head at a very early age. I may not have always followed those lessons, but I am back on track now. Today's children have no clue about this sort of thing, and I find it almost criminal that it is not focused on more stringently in our schools. My daughter is learning, and might actually be prepared by the time she heads off to post-secondary life in a couple years.
  • If I had a no zero policy I would probably have more around a 70%, instead I dragged in 50%s sleeping most of highschool away AT CLASS!....come on, fail upwards
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