2nd out of 77... some hands for discussion.
in Poker Games
Man, I'm still fuming - I know taking down 2nd is still sweet, and its my biggest payday to date, but I'm all about the hardware. And its been a while since I won any event, I get a lot of money finishes, but I can't seem to get over the hump...
BTW - I only play live games, no online for this kid.
First off, the event was held in a pool hall in Oakville. Nicely run, nice place, nice tables, professional dealers, good food, alla that... Buy in was $60, with one $30 rebuy.
I floated around with an average stack in the early going. I kept on doing really dumb stuff, like mucking pocket 3's to a small raise, only to see a 3 hit, and then also refusing to top up my small blind (2 6 off) when it was a ridiculously small amount, and then watching my mucked cards hit huge. Those two terrible plays hurt, because each hand saw a ton of action, and I would have won both. Just really dumb play, but I managed to make it to the final 3 tables, with an average stack.
So many interesting things to discuss really - where to begin? How about this move...small and big blinds decide to go have a smoke, because the TD told them they were going to make 4 tables into 3. So they split, but then the dealer says its not a break, so they lose their blinds. One player raised and another came over the top - winning the pot. When the blinds guys come back to see that they missed the hand, they went beserk - because they said the TD told them it was a break. They demanded their money back. TD deliberates with himself for a while, and then forces the winner to pay back the blinds to the guys who left. The raiser who lost, is out 1200. Then we replay the hand.
Does this make sense to anyone? Just so much wrong going on, I kept my mouth shut. What is the correct way to settle this?
con't...
BTW - I only play live games, no online for this kid.
First off, the event was held in a pool hall in Oakville. Nicely run, nice place, nice tables, professional dealers, good food, alla that... Buy in was $60, with one $30 rebuy.
I floated around with an average stack in the early going. I kept on doing really dumb stuff, like mucking pocket 3's to a small raise, only to see a 3 hit, and then also refusing to top up my small blind (2 6 off) when it was a ridiculously small amount, and then watching my mucked cards hit huge. Those two terrible plays hurt, because each hand saw a ton of action, and I would have won both. Just really dumb play, but I managed to make it to the final 3 tables, with an average stack.
So many interesting things to discuss really - where to begin? How about this move...small and big blinds decide to go have a smoke, because the TD told them they were going to make 4 tables into 3. So they split, but then the dealer says its not a break, so they lose their blinds. One player raised and another came over the top - winning the pot. When the blinds guys come back to see that they missed the hand, they went beserk - because they said the TD told them it was a break. They demanded their money back. TD deliberates with himself for a while, and then forces the winner to pay back the blinds to the guys who left. The raiser who lost, is out 1200. Then we replay the hand.
Does this make sense to anyone? Just so much wrong going on, I kept my mouth shut. What is the correct way to settle this?
con't...
Comments
It's difficult to tell who's mistake this was, though it was probably the TD's. If he/she had in fact told players that they had "time for a smoke" or something like that, the TD should have paused the entire tournament while the players were away. If the TD made no such indication to the players, the hand should have been left as it was.
ScottyZ
I hate it when I make the right move and fold a ragged hand....only to see it hit. I always remind myself that I am playing poker for the long term....and that while making the right moves might be irritating sometimes, in the long run you come out ahead! Little consolation as you see the other donks calling all in with ATo, 44 and hitting their hands.
Congrats on 2nd...
Adrienne
Then another messed up play - and I'm involved this time. Dealer forgets to raise the blinds (this was supposed to be the 1st hand at 2,000 - 4,000), and I fold my SB, and BB does as well, then the raiser complains that the blinds went up, after we mucked our cards. I say bullshit - the hand is over, you can't ask for the missed blinds, its too late. TD comes over and makes us pay the extra blinds, and I am not happy. I tell the winner that grubbing over missed blinds after the hand is dead is bad poker karma. He won the hand, he was just getting greedy. Sure, he got short-changed, but I would have played it differently, and probably called his raise, had I not mucked the hand. Is this even allowed? What the official ruling here? I can't recall having seen guys being forced to throw in missed blinds after a hand was dead. Anyways I pay him, but now I am pissed, and want to take him down.
I catch Big Slick on the very next hand, he calls me with an A6 and I take 8k off him. He's on tilt now because I told him the poker gods were angry with him, so then I fire back at his BB the very next hand with KQ suited, and he calls off all his chips with a Q2 suited - just awful play here. Knocking him out was so very sweet, but he took it like a man, no whining at all, which I respected.
So we move on to the final table - and I am the big stack with 43k.
con't...
sounds like the TD needed to read a poker book or two before deciding to run a tourney. tough luck about the blinds not being up...the whole hand was played at a level...in my catty way I probably would have fought that to the felt (and then get kicked out)
Adrienne
I catch A8 suited in the BB - and am raised all in an extra 3k - so I call, and then lose when he hits a king. Next thing I know, I am down to 17k, and there are 5 guys left. The blinds are now 8-16k and I am UTG. This sucks. But wait, rockets find their way into my hand, I jam in my chips, then get up from the table and walk away, while 3 other guys thin about it. I get 2 caller, and the 3rd (the BB) thought about his 16k for a long time, then folded. My aces hold up. Back in the chip lead....for now.
But then buddy to my left knocks out the remaining players, and its heads up. I have 67k, and he is close to 100K. I propose a deal, trying to see if he is a bafoon, and ask for 50/50 split. He says no, offers me something like 1.2 for me and 1.7k for him. The winner is getting 1.9 and 2nd gets 1k. I say forget it, but I wish I didn't. Its hard to make a deal when 30 people are telling you not to be a wimp. And I knew I was a superior player to him, because from what I had seen, he was no Jonny Moss. But I just had a bad feeling. Does anyone take this deal?
We play on and I try and steal his BB with a baby queen, and he calls me. I am ready to go home, when I hit a bitch on the river. Nice - I double up, and have the lead. I am thinking about putting a deal back over to him, but I am really liking my chances. Damn - I sooo wish I did. I got lucky, and I should have cashed in...he would have taken it too.
So then I get 99 in the BB. He raises the minimum - still 16k. What to do here? I know he probably has 2 overcards or a small to medium pair. How do you guys play this? I re-raise all in, and he calls me with K 10 off. Hits his 10 on the turn, and I am crippled.
Game over next hand. Oh well, I have zero deal making experience. I felt that as the better player, I owed it to myself to try and out play him. It didn't work. How do you guys justify deals? Any advice would be great.
Thanks
Alistair
Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you saying that the BB was already in for 16K, you raised all-in for 17K, and the BB folded?
Regarding the 'wimp' thing, I've been at a low-buyin tournament where this happened. My brother was in the final three, they were discussing a deal, and they were being drowned out by the people on the rail who were calling them--among other things--wimps. If a guy doesn't want to deal, that's fine, and I can respect that he has his reasons. But people who bring the whole 'wimp' aspect into it usually haven't played in many poker tournaments, and should be ignored.
In this case, I probably wouldn't have taken the deal. The difference between 1st and 2nd place money isn't life-changing, so you might as well play for it. Even though you had 67K and 100K, with the blinds where they were, the difference in chips isn't that big. You could very very easily reverse that situation with one key hand. A 50/50 split or no deal, IMO.
After you get the chip lead, if he's willing to take the 1.7/1.2 deal, I'd say give it to him. You are getting the best of that. Otherwise, play on, and I think that 99 is a great hand to try and end the tournament with, heads-up, and with those blinds.
Congrats on your finish.
You are totally right - I missed a hand here that totally warranted mentioning, because it was right before I caught aces. I picked up 99 (which I swear I got 5 times over the course of the 6 hours) and played them. The same guy who folded his 16k BB to my aces, had called for 8k (blinds hadn't changed yet) and I raised all-in for 17k. I got no action, and took down the 20k.
So when I found the rockets a few hands later, I actually had 37k and not 17.
Yeah - the deal making was tough. I probably would have taken 1.3k - but I figured that its not often you get to play heads up in a larger tournament, so I didn't ask for it. All the "wimp" stuff didn't faze me, although I have to admit that the energy was live.
Its a shame how it ended, but all I can think of now is that I just paid for a large chunk of my trip to Amsterdam - and I am going to hit the Aviation Club hard when I get to Paris.
Those bubble situations can be the worst, because you are now weighing in more stuff than usual (i.e., if I fold, what are the odds of someone else busting before me, how long until I have to play another blind, etc...).
But I swear like 90% of the time, the person with balls in these situations can pick up a ton of chips. Moving in with the nines, put me into position to do some real damage with the aces, which gave me a serious shot at the title.
This goes without saying, anytime you make a move in a bubble situation, and it backfires badly, you usually can't sleep for the next 2 nights and you feel like the biggest idiot. But sometimes you just gotta ask yourself, "are you playing to win"? Sometimes you will get called and lose out in the bubble spot, and it will sting for sure, but the one time you don't, you're looking at a great shot at the big prizes.... And winning one big tournament can often give you 10x as much as a bunch of different low money finishes.
I recently blew a 6 to 1 chip lead in a tourney.. That one hurt for a while.
This reminds me of a hand I Edmonton CPT. It's kind of off the topic but I have to tell you guys before I forget. This toourney was LH and was held in two casinos, we where down to three tables at the casino yellowhead and three tables at argyl casino. Anyways the BB decides to go the washroom and his hand gets mucked. Im in middle position with two tighties to my left so I rasise with 94o hoping to steal the blinds. Well the first tighty re-raises and its folded back to me.....I call. Flop K94, I check and he bets I raise. Long story short I'm allin on the river. I show two pair and he shows his king.........he was disgusted. I actually felt bad about this hand because I was just playing a steal and got lucky.
The tournament was held in two casinos? I guess the tournament director had to yell REALLY LOUD when the blinds went up....
Get in touch with modern technology chief.
He could have taken a cab over.
ScottyZ