2 hands I will remember
Im gonna start this by saying that although this is a bad beat im not posting to whine or complain about it as I know there are enough of those posts you could find all over the internet.
It all started over a year ago playing in my basement at 1/2 NL. I was pretty new to NL but had played hold'em forever just at fixed limit. Bob who most of you KWers will know was playing in the game. Bob is a great player (maybe the best I play with on a regular basis). There was a VERY loose player in the game who was raising pot after pot and I picked up KK. Bob had limped in UTG and I had decided to go for a limp re-raise seeing as the button (very loose player) could be counted on to raise. The button chose this time of all times to just limp. The BB checked and 4 of us took the flop.
Flop K82 rainbow. DING DING DING!
BB checks, Bob checks and I check hoping that the button will not turn down the chance to bet when checked around. The button again checks and we go to the turn with 4.
Turn is a 7. BB checks and now Bob leads at the pot with $5. I thought that Bob may have hit his second pair and lead weak hoping to induce a raise from the button as this was a fairly weak lead. I flat called and the button and BB muck. This hand did not turn out the way I had hoped but oh well I have top set and a chance to take a pot off the player I love to beat in a hand the most.
The river is an 8. BINGO! bells are ringing in my head as I try to think of my next move. Bob leads out with $10 and I am 100% certain he has an 8. I think that he thinks I have been slow playing a good K or maybe have limped in with AA to try and trap the button as I know he can see me making this play. I decide to raise the minimum knowing with an 8 he will play back. Bob doesn't let me down and makes it $60 to go. I then push all in with a raise to $200. Bob calls so fast I know now what has happened he has 88 and I am toast.
This hand haunted me forever and mostly because all of my money went in dead. I dont know if I could have played it any worse.
A long time passes and I am talking to Bob about some of the hands I have played that week. I like talking to Bob about hands because he is a great player who I have a ton of respect for so it helps my game a great deal I think. So I tell him about a hand I played in Brantford that week which was so funny because in the middle of the hand I am having a conversation with some guys at the table that were saying "online poker is fixed". I raise with TT UTG+1 after one limper in a 10/20 game. Just the limper calls and the flop comes 822 (looks good) the limper leads and I raise. He calls. The turn comes a 10 and the limper once again leads, I raise. The river comes an 8 and he leads AGAIN! I raise to 40, he raises to 60 and I make it 80 figuring that his lone 8 was being very overplayed here. My play might sound a little bad but if youve played in Brantford you will know that not only is a lone 8 possible but a deuce is too! UTG makes it 100 and I just call asking "did you flop or river quads?". He shows 88 and one of the kids that had complained about online poker asked the dealer to show my hand. Before the dealer could flip my cards I said "Ive got one of those rigged internet hands"
A week after telling Bob about that hand he is online playing Omaha .25/.5 PL on party. He is playing every hand and just having a good time. He messages me and tells me to come join and I do. I decide im gonna play ever hand as well and most likely shoot off $100 or so. after a while goes by this hand comes up. I limp UTG with KKxx hoping to wrap it and make a big pot. This is a poor play but I am just having fun anyway and whats more fun than a big pot? Everyone just calls and way to many people see the flop. The flop comes picture perfect with K85 rainbow. The BB leads I call and Bob calls. The turn comes with a 2 and the BB leads again. I make a pot sized raise at this point and Bob re-raises all in. I quickly call with the nuts and we go to the river set over set once again with 88vsKK. I think you all realize by now what the river was.
Im not sure what the moral of the story is but I mean what are the odds? The same guy the same two sets and the same river card. He has now named 88 JWHACKERS and im sure he will remember those hands as long as I do.
At least all the money went in when he was drawing to one out this time and thats all that actualy matters.
Jeremy
It all started over a year ago playing in my basement at 1/2 NL. I was pretty new to NL but had played hold'em forever just at fixed limit. Bob who most of you KWers will know was playing in the game. Bob is a great player (maybe the best I play with on a regular basis). There was a VERY loose player in the game who was raising pot after pot and I picked up KK. Bob had limped in UTG and I had decided to go for a limp re-raise seeing as the button (very loose player) could be counted on to raise. The button chose this time of all times to just limp. The BB checked and 4 of us took the flop.
Flop K82 rainbow. DING DING DING!
BB checks, Bob checks and I check hoping that the button will not turn down the chance to bet when checked around. The button again checks and we go to the turn with 4.
Turn is a 7. BB checks and now Bob leads at the pot with $5. I thought that Bob may have hit his second pair and lead weak hoping to induce a raise from the button as this was a fairly weak lead. I flat called and the button and BB muck. This hand did not turn out the way I had hoped but oh well I have top set and a chance to take a pot off the player I love to beat in a hand the most.
The river is an 8. BINGO! bells are ringing in my head as I try to think of my next move. Bob leads out with $10 and I am 100% certain he has an 8. I think that he thinks I have been slow playing a good K or maybe have limped in with AA to try and trap the button as I know he can see me making this play. I decide to raise the minimum knowing with an 8 he will play back. Bob doesn't let me down and makes it $60 to go. I then push all in with a raise to $200. Bob calls so fast I know now what has happened he has 88 and I am toast.
This hand haunted me forever and mostly because all of my money went in dead. I dont know if I could have played it any worse.
A long time passes and I am talking to Bob about some of the hands I have played that week. I like talking to Bob about hands because he is a great player who I have a ton of respect for so it helps my game a great deal I think. So I tell him about a hand I played in Brantford that week which was so funny because in the middle of the hand I am having a conversation with some guys at the table that were saying "online poker is fixed". I raise with TT UTG+1 after one limper in a 10/20 game. Just the limper calls and the flop comes 822 (looks good) the limper leads and I raise. He calls. The turn comes a 10 and the limper once again leads, I raise. The river comes an 8 and he leads AGAIN! I raise to 40, he raises to 60 and I make it 80 figuring that his lone 8 was being very overplayed here. My play might sound a little bad but if youve played in Brantford you will know that not only is a lone 8 possible but a deuce is too! UTG makes it 100 and I just call asking "did you flop or river quads?". He shows 88 and one of the kids that had complained about online poker asked the dealer to show my hand. Before the dealer could flip my cards I said "Ive got one of those rigged internet hands"
A week after telling Bob about that hand he is online playing Omaha .25/.5 PL on party. He is playing every hand and just having a good time. He messages me and tells me to come join and I do. I decide im gonna play ever hand as well and most likely shoot off $100 or so. after a while goes by this hand comes up. I limp UTG with KKxx hoping to wrap it and make a big pot. This is a poor play but I am just having fun anyway and whats more fun than a big pot? Everyone just calls and way to many people see the flop. The flop comes picture perfect with K85 rainbow. The BB leads I call and Bob calls. The turn comes with a 2 and the BB leads again. I make a pot sized raise at this point and Bob re-raises all in. I quickly call with the nuts and we go to the river set over set once again with 88vsKK. I think you all realize by now what the river was.
Im not sure what the moral of the story is but I mean what are the odds? The same guy the same two sets and the same river card. He has now named 88 JWHACKERS and im sure he will remember those hands as long as I do.
At least all the money went in when he was drawing to one out this time and thats all that actualy matters.
Jeremy
Comments
As an aside, I have those rigged feelings from time to time. I normally start thinking the site must be rigged, to the dealer must be in cahoots with the player, to God must really be upset with me. After all, there's no higher force than God that can control my enviroment. It can't possibly be random acts of nature and my inability to manage them properly. Alas, a few good night's sleep along with a winning session, and the universe is back in equilibrium. Life is good again.
One of things I've noted is that my percpetion of my skill level in combination with my motivational force of greed or fear, often clouds my judgement.
In all these bad beats it looks like greed was your main driving force (how could it not be!). Then you percieve that you've masterfully decieved your opponent into thinking they have you beat, when they in fact have a worse hand. Other than the last hand you mention (had a laugh there -- hope you can laugh about it too!), you have incorrectly assessed your opponents because (imo) greed has clouded your judgement.
If we focus more on making the right plays rather than getting paid, I think we'll be better players.
I think in this case, the proper conclusion is that Bob is rigged.
ScottyZ
Just had a good laugh!
Don't you worry -- if I knew Bob, he'd be on my list of things that were rigged. I leave not stones unturned for my paranoia. And, from your comment, it's likely that Bob is a good candidate for being rigged.
Cheers
Magi
I didn't mean to imply that Bob is the kind of player who gets lucky all the time... just that in this case, he was the common factor to both hands rather than the poker venue.
He may also be a bot... the jury is still out on that one.
Just kidding again. Like ComaU said, Bob's a great (human) player.
That is pretty wild that the exact *form* of the hands (set of 8's beating a set of K's each time) was the same. Bob can probably now run ComaU off a hand more easily when an 8 falls off the deck. (Scare card!) :cool:
ScottyZ
Sorry, didn't mean to imply Bob was cheating. I need to find a better way to relay my sarcasm.
Cheers
Magi
I never actualy get those because I believe online poker is not fixed. I guess that might make me a minority on the internet. I do get those "man I just cant beat that guy" feelings though.
I did laugh. I think I lauged for about 1 hour straight. I posted this not to complain or anything but just because it was pretty funny seeing as it was the same player and the same cards etc..
You couldn't be more right!
And just like Scotty said the 8 might be a scare card for me now! I gotta admit if I ever make kings full of eights again and Bobs in the hand it might cost me a few bets when I just call instead of raising
It looks like I'm in the minority. Perhaps it's my Italian backgroud -- we're trained to believe everything is rigged!!
I regularly get the feelings that the poker sites are rigged. But then again, I regularly get feelings that Canadian Tire (substitute any vendor as well) is out to screw me. Fortunately, I'm able to process information in an unbiassed manner and have to accept the fact that no one was out to "get me". Then, I need someone to blame other than myself. For that I look for a higher being -- God. Well, he must be out to get me. Then I'm at the end of the cycle and accept that I must change my approach or behaviour to get better results. Knowing all this, I wish I could circumvent this whole process and just go directly to changing my behaviour. But, I've kinda grown to like the process.
It also reveals that I have a big ego. How else could I believe that the world would actually be that interested in me, that it would be set up to get me! And, I think I've found a game that requires a big ego. Thank goodness I'm Canadian with enough humility to allow myself to continue to learn!
Once again I thank the forum for indulging me in my crazy thoughts. It's cheap psychotherapy!
Cheers
Magi