Help, getting killed at sit n go's

Hey guys, looking for any advice for a new player.

I started off playing S n Go's and was doing reasonable well, I would place in the money 40-50% of the time.

Now I am just getting killed, I am recognizing the donk at the table AND IT'S ME!!! :(

I am aware of a few of my faults, but any advice or tips that any of you have (keeping in mind that I am new) would be greatly appreciated.
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Comments

  • Post some hands for evaluation. That's the best way to get advice. Other than that, standard SnG strategy is to play tight early, and then open up your range as you approach the bubble, and play aggressively. Downswings happen too, so don't let them get you down.

    If you're placing ITM 50%, you're doing very well.
  • STR82ACE wrote: »
    Post some hands for evaluation. That's the best way to get advice. Other than that, standard SnG strategy is to play tight early, and then open up your range as you approach the bubble, and play aggressively. Downswings happen too, so don't let them get you down.

    If you're placing ITM 50%, you're doing very well.

    I was placing.

    I'll get some hands. Please feel free to tear me apart.
  • I'll get some hands. Please feel free to tear me apart.

    Oh we will...we most CERTAINLY will BAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
  • Full Tilt Poker Game #15468942778: $10 + $1 Sit & Go (113417794), Table 1 - 25/50 - No Limit Hold'em - 17:16:09 ET - 2009/10/20
    Seat 1: EL PADRINO 80 (2,635)
    Seat 2: Dirty theSAV (1,375)
    Seat 3: fbckicksass (950)
    Seat 4: domi1706 (1,250)
    Seat 5: Quittungsnummer (2,790)
    domi1706 posts the small blind of 25
    Quittungsnummer posts the big blind of 50
    The button is in seat #3
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to fbckicksass [Ac 7c]
    EL PADRINO 80 folds
    Dirty theSAV folds
    fbckicksass calls 50
    domi1706 calls 25
    Quittungsnummer checks
    *** FLOP *** [Kh 6h 7s]
    domi1706 checks
    Quittungsnummer bets 150
    fbckicksass raises to 900, and is all in
    domi1706 folds
    Quittungsnummer has 15 seconds left to act
    Quittungsnummer calls 750
    fbckicksass shows [Ac 7c]
    Quittungsnummer shows [Kd Td]
    *** TURN *** [Kh 6h 7s] [Qs]
    *** RIVER *** [Kh 6h 7s Qs] [3s]
    fbckicksass shows a pair of Sevens
    Quittungsnummer shows a pair of Kings
    Quittungsnummer wins the pot (1,950) with a pair of Kings
    fbckicksass stands up
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 1,950 | Rake 0
    Board: [Kh 6h 7s Qs 3s]
    Seat 1: EL PADRINO 80 didn't bet (folded)
    Seat 2: Dirty theSAV didn't bet (folded)
    Seat 3: fbckicksass (button) showed [Ac 7c] and lost with a pair of Sevens
    Seat 4: domi1706 (small blind) folded on the Flop
    Seat 5: Quittungsnummer (big blind) showed [Kd Td] and won (1,950) with a pair of Kings
  • oh man.

    Ever feel like an idiot?
  • - 15/30 - No Limit Hold'em - 15:35:29 ET - 2009/10/20
    Seat 1: fbckicksass (195)
    Seat 2: rodpet (1,455)
    Seat 3: lollywood (2,265)
    Seat 4: JMB713 (2,430)
    Seat 5: freddypug (1,725)
    Seat 6: sam182 (930)
    lollywood posts the small blind of 15
    JMB713 posts the big blind of 30
    The button is in seat #2
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to fbckicksass [9h Ts]
    freddypug calls 30
    sam182 folds
    fbckicksass: Terrible game on my part
    fbckicksass raises to 195, and is all in
    rodpet folds
    lollywood folds
    JMB713 folds
    freddypug calls 165
    fbckicksass shows [9h Ts]
    freddypug shows [3c 2c]
    *** FLOP *** [Jc Ad 3d]
    *** TURN *** [Jc Ad 3d] [Ac]
    *** RIVER *** [Jc Ad 3d Ac] [7c]
    fbckicksass shows a pair of Aces
    freddypug shows a flush, Ace high
    freddypug wins the pot (435) with a flush, Ace high
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 435 | Rake 0
    Board: [Jc Ad 3d Ac 7c]
    Seat 1: fbckicksass showed [9h Ts] and lost with a pair of Aces
    Seat 2: rodpet (button) didn't bet (folded)
    Seat 3: lollywood (small blind) folded before the Flop
    Seat 4: JMB713 (big blind) folded before the Flop
    Seat 5: freddypug showed [3c 2c] and won (435) with a flush, Ace high
    Seat 6: sam182 didn't bet (folded)




    I am making a point of showing my worst hands. I really don't want to hide from the fact that I am not very good yet.
  • Raise preflop. You're first to act in a shorthanded game now, limping bad...very bad. Limping lets the terrorists win.

    Post flop, check/fold. You can't imagine being ahead here with bottom Pair. Also, any donkey with a flush or straight draw is likely calling you here as they have you covered. I would rather save my chips for another hand with more winning potential.

    Don't worry about being a 'bad' player...concentrate on 'getting better'.
  • Full Tilt Poker Game #15466931888: $5 + $0.50 Sit & Go (113404645), Table 1 - 15/30 - No Limit Hold'em - 15:34:29 ET - 2009/10/20
    Seat 1: fbckicksass (945)
    Seat 2: rodpet (1,485)
    Seat 3: lollywood (1,455)
    Seat 4: JMB713 (2,430)
    Seat 5: freddypug (1,725)
    Seat 6: sam182 (960)
    rodpet posts the small blind of 15
    lollywood posts the big blind of 30
    The button is in seat #1
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to fbckicksass [5c 6d]
    JMB713 folds
    freddypug folds
    sam182 calls 30
    fbckicksass calls 30
    rodpet calls 15
    lollywood raises to 120
    sam182 folds
    fbckicksass calls 90
    rodpet folds
    *** FLOP *** [Ad 8d Ks]
    lollywood has 15 seconds left to act
    lollywood checks
    fbckicksass bets 210
    lollywood calls 210
    *** TURN *** [Ad 8d Ks] [7c]
    lollywood checks
    fbckicksass checks
    *** RIVER *** [Ad 8d Ks 7c] [Th]
    lollywood bets 210
    fbckicksass raises to 420
    lollywood raises to 630
    fbckicksass folds
    Uncalled bet of 210 returned to lollywood
    lollywood mucks
    lollywood wins the pot (1,560)
    fbckicksass: wow
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 1,560 | Rake 0
    Board: [Ad 8d Ks 7c Th]
    Seat 1: fbckicksass (button) folded on the River
    Seat 2: rodpet (small blind) folded before the Flop
    Seat 3: lollywood (big blind) collected (1,560), mucked
    Seat 4: JMB713 didn't bet (folded)
    Seat 5: freddypug didn't bet (folded)
    Seat 6: sam182 folded before the Flop
  • STR82ACE wrote: »
    Raise preflop. You're first to act in a shorthanded game now, limping bad...very bad. Limping lets the terrorists win.

    Post flop, check/fold. You can't imagine being ahead here with bottom Page Ranking. Also, any donkey with a flush or straight draw is likely calling you here as they have you covered. I would rather save my chips for another hand with more winning potential.

    Don't worry about being a 'bad' player...concentrate on 'getting better'.

    Thanks man.
  • - 15/30 - No Limit Hold'em - 15:35:29 ET - 2009/10/20
    Seat 1: fbckicksass (195)
    Seat 2: rodpet (1,455)
    Seat 3: lollywood (2,265)
    Seat 4: JMB713 (2,430)
    Seat 5: freddypug (1,725)
    Seat 6: sam182 (930)
    lollywood posts the small blind of 15
    JMB713 posts the big blind of 30
    The button is in seat #2
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to fbckicksass [9h Ts]
    freddypug calls 30
    sam182 folds
    fbckicksass: Terrible game on my part
    fbckicksass raises to 195, and is all in
    rodpet folds
    lollywood folds
    JMB713 folds
    freddypug calls 165
    fbckicksass shows [9h Ts]
    freddypug shows [3c 2c]
    *** FLOP *** [Jc Ad 3d]
    *** TURN *** [Jc Ad 3d] [Ac]
    *** RIVER *** [Jc Ad 3d Ac] [7c]
    fbckicksass shows a pair of Aces
    freddypug shows a flush, Ace high
    freddypug wins the pot (435) with a flush, Ace high
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 435 | Rake 0
    Board: [Jc Ad 3d Ac 7c]
    Seat 1: fbckicksass showed [9h Ts] and lost with a pair of Aces
    Seat 2: rodpet (button) didn't bet (folded)
    Seat 3: lollywood (small blind) folded before the Flop
    Seat 4: JMB713 (big blind) folded before the Flop
    Seat 5: freddypug showed [3c 2c] and won (435) with a flush, Ace high
    Seat 6: sam182 didn't bet (folded)

    I'm thinking you just took a nasty hit just prior to this hand. As it is, you really have one option open and that's to push with any two cards here. If you've been playing shortstack for more than 3 hands though, you should have pushed along time ago.

    Push, pray, and signup to another SnG.
  • Full Tilt Poker Game #15453477424: $5 + $0.50 Sit & Go (113300695), Table 1 - 40/80 - No Limit Hold'em - 22:03:30 ET - 2009/10/19
    Seat 1: fbckicksass (1,595)
    Seat 3: AJ847 (1,635)
    Seat 5: Troop21 (5,770)
    AJ847 posts the small blind of 40
    Troop21 posts the big blind of 80
    The button is in seat #1
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to fbckicksass [9c 9d]
    fbckicksass raises to 240
    AJ847 calls 200
    Troop21 calls 160
    *** FLOP *** [Js 5s Tc]
    AJ847 checks
    Troop21 bets 80
    fbckicksass raises to 400
    AJ847 calls 400
    Troop21 folds
    *** TURN *** [Js 5s Tc]
    AJ847 bets 995, and is all in
    fbckicksass calls 955, and is all in
    AJ847 shows [Qs 8s]
    fbckicksass shows [9c 9d]
    Uncalled bet of 40 returned to AJ847
    *** RIVER *** [Js 5s Tc Td] [3s]
    AJ847 shows a flush, Queen high
    fbckicksass shows two pair, Tens and Nines
    AJ847 wins the pot (3,510) with a flush, Queen high
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 3,510 | Rake 0
    Board: [Js 5s Tc Td 3s]
    Seat 1: fbckicksass (button) showed [9c 9d] and lost with two pair, Tens and Nines
    Seat 3: AJ847 (small blind) showed [Qs 8s] and won (3,510) with a flush, Queen high
    Seat 5: Troop21 (big blind) folded on the Flop
  • Full Tilt Poker Game #15453477424: $5 + $0.50 Sit & Go (113300695), Table 1 - 40/80 - No Limit Hold'em - 22:03:30 ET - 2009/10/19
    Seat 1: fbckicksass (1,595)
    Seat 3: AJ847 (1,635)
    Seat 5: Troop21 (5,770)
    AJ847 posts the small blind of 40
    Troop21 posts the big blind of 80
    The button is in seat #1
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to fbckicksass [9c 9d]
    fbckicksass raises to 240
    AJ847 calls 200
    Troop21 calls 160
    *** FLOP *** [Js 5s Tc]
    AJ847 checks
    Troop21 bets 80
    fbckicksass raises to 400
    AJ847 calls 400
    Troop21 folds
    *** TURN *** [Js 5s Tc]
    AJ847 bets 995, and is all in
    fbckicksass calls 955, and is all in
    AJ847 shows [Qs 8s]
    fbckicksass shows [9c 9d]
    Uncalled bet of 40 returned to AJ847
    *** RIVER *** [Js 5s Tc Td] [3s]
    AJ847 shows a flush, Queen high
    fbckicksass shows two pair, Tens and Nines
    AJ847 wins the pot (3,510) with a flush, Queen high
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 3,510 | Rake 0
    Board: [Js 5s Tc Td 3s]
    Seat 1: fbckicksass (button) showed [9c 9d] and lost with two pair, Tens and Nines
    Seat 3: AJ847 (small blind) showed [Qs 8s] and won (3,510) with a flush, Queen high
    Seat 5: Troop21 (big blind) folded on the Flop

    I like the preflop raise, maybe go a little harder, but that's just my take. I like the bet on the flop too, but again you have to push a lot harder than a half pot raise. Calling on the turn was really the only big mistake there. At best, you're getting in against exactly what he had, a draw. More than likely, you're fucked. I do like a lot of what you did though, just do it harder.... maybe that last comment would have more impact coming from Kristy.
  • was going to say something about the flop play, but it could get ugly on here..........
  • Full Tilt Poker Game #15475990317: $5 + $0.50 Sit & Go (113468985), Table 1 - 25/50 - No Limit Hold'em - 23:13:18 ET - 2009/10/20
    Seat 1: fbckicksass (1,835)
    Seat 2: toolittleO2 (1,710)
    Seat 4: ima horne (1,990)
    Seat 6: mysticseance (3,465)
    fbckicksass posts the small blind of 25
    toolittleO2 posts the big blind of 50
    The button is in seat #6
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to fbckicksass [Kd Kc]
    ima horne raises to 100
    mysticseance folds
    fbckicksass raises to 1,835, and is all in
    toolittleO2 folds
    ima horne calls 1,735
    fbckicksass shows [Kd Kc]
    ima horne shows [Th 7h]
    *** FLOP *** [Tc Ah Jh]
    *** TURN *** [Tc Ah Jh] [3h]
    *** RIVER *** [Tc Ah Jh 3h] [5h]
    fbckicksass shows a pair of Kings
    ima horne shows a flush, Ace high
    ima horne wins the pot (3,720) with a flush, Ace high
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 3,720 | Rake 0
    Board: [Tc Ah Jh 3h 5h]
    Seat 1: fbckicksass (small blind) showed [Kd Kc] and lost with a pair of Kings
    Seat 2: toolittleO2 (big blind) folded before the Flop
    Seat 4: ima horne showed [Th 7h] and won (3,720) with a flush, Ace high
    Seat 6: mysticseance (button) didn't bet (folded)

    This was a shot through my heart. Oh man. I
  • fbckicksass - I now play Full Tilt S&G's almost exclusively and although not a great player, I consider myself pretty solid (12% a month ROI on average). The key for me was education. Try Moshman's book on S&G's (available thru Amazon) or Phil Shaw's Secrets of Sit'n'Gos (available thru Chapters). I keep these 2 books next to my laptop and review them constantly. They are a good start. Eventually you'll develop your own style, but the books give you a solid baseline
  • CdnVet0506 wrote: »
    fbckicksass - I now play Full Tilt S&G's almost exclusively and although not a great player, I consider myself pretty solid (12% a month ROI on average). The key for me was education. Try Moshman's book on S&G's (available thru Amazon) or Phil Shaw's Secrets of Sit'n'Gos (available thru Chapters). I keep these 2 books next to my laptop and review them constantly. They are a good start. Eventually you'll develop your own style, but the books give you a solid baseline

    I'll take a look at them, thank you.
  • AJ847 and ima horne are now on my buddy list. I think I will start playing FT 6 max sngs. These guys are pure gold.
  • moose wrote: »
    AJ847 and ima horne are now on my buddy list. I think I will start playing FT 6 max sngs. These guys are pure gold.

    why?
  • why?

    Because they suck.
  • moose wrote: »
    Because they suck.

    :redface:
  • No dude. It's not your fault you get stacked by morons who want to commit their entire stack with 107 preflop. Just type yplc - you play like crap and move on.

    Your big problem is you overcommit yourself to hands. Why shove your entire stack with KK for 1900 to a 100 min raise? You didn't really want the guy to fold did you? If you knew he was a moron and was going to call, it was a great play but most often that is a dumb shove, most reasonable players would fold to a bet like that. Reraise to something like 250, build a pot, and control the pot on the flop. You want to get your opponent committed to the pot and call when behind, not commit yourself to the pot unnecessarily.
  • moose wrote: »
    No dude. It's not your fault you get stacked by morons who want to commit their entire stack with 107 preflop. Just type yplc - you play like crap and move on.

    Your big problem is you overcommit yourself to hands. Why shove your entire stack with KK for 1900 to a 100 min raise? You didn't really want the guy to fold did you? If you knew he was a moron and was going to call, it was a great play but most often that is a dumb shove, most reasonable players would fold to a bet like that. Reraise to something like 250, build a pot, and control the pot on the flop. You want to get your opponent committed to the pot and call when behind, not commit yourself to the pot unnecessarily.

    Thanks for the post.

    I do overcommit...I take your points!!

    I'm not sure why I do it, but will certainly go over it in head. Say goodbye to sleep.
  • I guess you should fold more postflop until you get better .-. Are you playing 6max? I'd play at least 18 man full ring in order to make more money and not just finish itm a lot of the times.

    Don't know if this example will help but I think it illustrates a leak that many low stakes players have when it comes to overcommiting:

    Let's say you have JJ in middle position, blinds are 25/50 and you each have about 2000 chips. Someone limps in from your right and you raise it up to 200. BB and the limper calls.

    Flop comes K86 rainbow.

    BB checks and limper bets 400 into a 650 pot (in which you have 200 invested). Note that chipwise here, making a bad call once here with cost you as much as folding in this spot twice. At the same time, making a bad push here will cost you as much as a about 4 bad calls here, just saying.

    But whatever, we're not folding here but we're definitely not raising. So we call and BB folds.

    Turn is makes the board k8610.

    Now, pot is 1450 and you have about and you have 1500 left in your stack. If villain makes an "I mean buisness" bet here I'll either fold since I give him a king, or shove here since I think he's an idiot. Anyway, this is probably where I fold if he bets.

    Let's say villain checks it to you, you should consider checking. Villain may have a hand like, 910 drawing to 8 outs or A8 drawing to 5 outs... Or you're crushed and looking for only five cards in the deck if he has a king. Also, say you check and the river is fairly safe. Villain may decide that his pair of tens or eights is good making it much better to call down or shove river than call down or shove turn (unless he's gonna draw to 8 outs for his whole stack).

    Learn to read river bets a bit maybe, small bets may mean he's scared and holding middle pair or something, if you think he does you probably shouldn't bluff him with worse, he's often stubborn and will call you down even if you raise but consider making slim valueraises.

    When villain has a big hand he will often make it between 3/4's of a pot and a whole pot. This big bet is usually dangerous so watch out a bit for it.

    My favorite part is when villain goes even bigger though, it's very dependent on the player but if he betson more than a pot on let's say a QQ5106 board he's doing something called polarizing his range. This means that he's either going to have everything, or nothing. He might have a queen, or he might have something like KJ, point is he's not gonna bet this big if he has a 10 so if you would call him down with a 10, you might even consider calling with worse like 88 or A6. Conversily if you don't think he's bluffing, you're folding something like Q7.

    (Never be afraid to give your opponent an oppertunity to bluff, when I face 3bet happy people I often see other players adjusting by shoving huge stacks into them, that's a mistake. Just hit the call button if they 3 bet and watch their stacks magically disappear. Don't be afraid of giving your opponent a chance to bluff in other words, the call button is the remedy for that)

    Hope some of this made sense, I guess the simplest way to put it is that if you overcommit, try undercommitting a little bit until you find balance in your game ^^' GL getting better.
  • Hand 1 - raise on the button don't call
    Hand 2 - Nothing you can do you are short....
    Hand 3 - 56 off suit is not a call in that position.

    The key with 6max sit and goes is that you shouldn't be calling unless you have a monster, and you should be 3-betting more unless you face resistance. Keep in mind with 6 max games it is harder for people to have quality hands so if you are able to put more money in preflop with AX and even sometimes KX when you have position you can easily C-bet when it is checked to you and take down the pot.

    From these posts it looks like you are getting into ego battles with people at the table and at this level people are playing there hands face up for the most part and they will bet when they have a hand...and monotone flops are easy steal opportunities when it is checked around to you.
  • Don't talk at the table. Read the chat, don't contribute. you give away a tonne of info. They are not your friends. they are the enemy. Talk here.

    If you have money in the pot.....it's not yours anymore. Make your decision based on the money you will have to put in to continue. if you think your hand is beat on the flop/turn/river and the other guy won't go away when you bluff....give it up. it's not money lost it is money saved.

    A previous poster said that SnG should be tight early and loose later. Some people will say the exact opposite. Aggressive early when others are playing tight..... I don't have the answer to this one but just want to make sure you know there are differences in style out there.

    Good luck. and good thread. thanks for starting it and keeping it going
  • SuitedPair wrote: »
    Don't talk at the table. Read the chat, don't contribute. you give away a tonne of info. They are not your friends. they are the enemy. Talk here.

    If you have money in the pot.....it's not yours anymore. Make your decision based on the money you will have to put in to continue. if you think your hand is beat on the flop/turn/river and the other guy won't go away when you bluff....give it up. it's not money lost it is money saved.

    A previous poster said that SnG should be tight early and loose later. Some people will say the exact opposite. Aggressive early when others are playing tight..... I don't have the answer to this one but just want to make sure you know there are differences in style out there.

    Good luck. and good thread. thanks for starting it and keeping it going

    Some really good points, cheers.

    I have read here, took some advice and have placed in the last two sng's that i have played in. And was the bubble boy in two more.
  • Played two more tonight, of the $2 variety.

    I busted out of one and came in second in the other.

    I owe you guys a coffee.
  • I owe you guys a coffee.

    COFFEE?!?!??! Damnit, I said 40%!!!!

    Lots of great advise here, and a lot of fun to participate. Sometimes you may need a thick skin, but its all about making you a better player. Keep up the good work, look for areas to improve on, and be sure to ask here when you run into something that makes you go ugh.

    This is a game of constant change, and you'll be required to change along with it. Don't be afraid to experiment, and don't let the bad beats boil your blood too much.
  • STR82ACE wrote: »
    COFFEE?!?!??! Damnit, I said 40%!!!!

    Lots of great advise here, and a lot of fun to participate. Sometimes you may need a thick skin, but its all about making you a better player. Keep up the good work, look for areas to improve on, and be sure to ask here when you run into something that makes you go ugh.

    This is a game of constant change, and you'll be required to change along with it. Don't be afraid to experiment, and don't let the bad beats boil your blood too much.

    %20 of my $5.20 winnings is roughly $2 so we'll make it a coffee and a doughnut.
  • Sweet. I'll take the coffee, Str8 can have the doughnut.....was up till 3AM....not playing poker....
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