Options

Heres the hand history

UnknownUnknown
in MTT Strategy
I appologize for the confusion on all this, but i didn't know how to get hand histories, truthfully i wondered if these guys wrote it by hand. But i started a new thread because I totally got a lot of my info wrong, I just made the story from what I remembered and thought was important in my decision....anyway don't think i lied haha cause i was recalling what i could...ignore the other post

***** Hand History for Game 8340670888 *****
NL Texas Hold'em $9 USD Buy-in Trny:47059879 Level:14 Blinds-Antes(3,000/6,000 -100) - Monday, August 17, 20:03:41 EDT 2009
Table $10K Gtd Rebuy (1735694) Table #2 (Real Money)
Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 9
Seat 10: LeGeMeauX ( 220,298 )
Seat 2: Polopony_ ( 62,049 )
Seat 4: b4sH4MentZzz ( 379,276 )
Seat 1: evs70 ( 79,166 )
Seat 8: HERO ( 123,562 )
Seat 5: its2badm8 ( 192,249 )
Seat 9: silveravant ( 57,582 )
Seat 3: svet_oll ( 40,656 )
Seat 7: thohenk ( 11,955 )
Trny:47059879 Level:14
Blinds-Antes(3,000/6,000 -100)
evs70 posts ante [100]
Polopony_ posts ante [100]
svet_oll posts ante [100]
b4sH4MentZzz posts ante [100]
its2badm8 posts ante [100]
thohenk posts ante [100]
HERO posts ante [100]
silveravant posts ante [100]
LeGeMeauX posts ante [100]
** Dealing down cards **
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to HERO [ Jd Ad ]
silveravant folds
LeGeMeauX folds
evs70 folds
Polopony_ folds
svet_oll folds
b4sH4MentZzz folds
its2badm8 is all-In [192,149]
thohenk is all-In [8,855]
HERO is all-In [117,462]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 2h, 8c, 9c ]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 8s ]
** Dealing River ** [ Kh ]
thohenk shows [ Ac, 7c ]a pair of Eights.
HERO shows [ Jd, Ad ]a pair of Eights with Jack kicker.
its2badm8 shows [ 2d, As ]two pairs, Eights and Twos.
its2badm8 wins 68,687 chips from the side pot 2 with two pairs, Eights and Twos.
its2badm8 wins 223,214 chips from the side pot 1 with two pairs, Eights and Twos.
its2badm8 wins 36,465 chips from the main pot with two pairs, Eights and Twos.
Player thohenk finished in 38 place and received $53.32 USD
Player HERO finished in 37 place and received $53.32 USD




I kept saying to myself, he has a weak ace, he has a weak ace. Is there anyway i can bring up everyones in the tourney's chip count?


And for the hand would any of you make that call?

Comments

  • compueasecompuease Admin
    With your previous read and this new info I now call for sure. Your M is only about 12, you definitely need to pick a spot soon. A lot different than before when it seemed that you had 75 x BB. However I would always prefer to be the pusher rather than the caller if I can.
  • UnknownUnknown
    compuease wrote: »
    With your previous read and this new info I now call for sure. Your M is only about 12, you definitely need to pick a spot soon. A lot different than before when it seemed that you had 75 x BB. However I would always prefer to be the pusher rather than the caller if I can.

    yes i see its different than i said before but that I felt i could still play some poker before making a move, and i can target all ins on the smaller stacks a little better and be first in, but i think i found a good spot. Its not the "top three situation" I thought i was in but I like the situation, seems to me I was close to some decent bux.
  • Wetts1012Wetts1012
    If he's shipping from the button this is a fistpump. Everytime.

    And dont tell yourself in these situations he has a weak ace. Tell yourself he has any 2 cards. Its called unexploitable pushing, and its huge in the game right now.

    If you need more info on it just google. There are alot of good articles out there on it. (And yes - it is profitable).
  • Richard~Richard~
    Excuse me? You're saying unexploitable shoving is profitable with an effective stack of 20 BB's and the image of a maniac? I really doubt that ???. If he knows what he's doing he's gonna hold A10+ minimum. Or maybe I'm wrong ._.
  • Wetts1012Wetts1012
    Even with 20BB effective I know hero can only call here with top 10-15% of his range.

    So if you know villain is shoving ATC - you still cant call down with J10, Q8, etc. Unless youre a hero.

    Profitable. Yes. By the time hero has a hand that can call your basically going 30/70, 40/60 to pay him with his own chips.
  • actyperactyper
    If I were the button, the only reason I don't shove with ATC here is because of the 1.5xBB sb, my range would most likely be 50% instead. I don't like having to show that i'm capable of shoving ATC even though others might already assume I am.

    But either way this is a call
  • Richard~Richard~
    I'm a hero ._. I call 20-22% against a maniac. (any ace, not any broadway)
    Maniac gets called 1 time out of 5.
    Maniac gains 6 BB's the first four times.
    5th time I'm down to 17 BB's and I create a pot worth 34 BB's.
    I walk away with 64% of this pot or 22BB's, villain walks away with 12 BB's.

    Now villain has lost 20 - 12 - 6 BB's or 2 BB assuming I never stole a blind during the process. If hero is not a nit it's not a plus EV shove even disregarding the SB. But then again a normal calling range might be more narrow.
  • Wetts1012Wetts1012
    Richard~ wrote: »
    I'm a hero ._. I call 20-22% against a maniac.

    But then again a normal calling range might be more narrow.

    This makes the situation different. You sir, are a hero.

    I think for the majority, the calling range is significantly smaller than top 20% of starting hands, considering that we still have a healthy 20 BB stack (ie we're not risking everything with QJ, KJ etc.) I think we're getting looked up closer to 1/9-10 here.
  • Richard~Richard~
    I don't need queen high hands. I just need any ace, 55+ QK and KJs. But I really love to show maniacs that I'm not scared so I'm a bit of a donkey.


    In this spot thogh I think it's pretty obvious that villain is shoving any ace or any pair in order to isolate SB's ATC calling range, I've done this myself so AJ has to be a snapcall, even against someone who's less of a maniac than villain.
  • blackmagiczblackmagicz
    I dont like this spot at all. But that is me personally. As Compuease said I rather be the pusher than the caller especially with AJ.

    I understand the whole M thingy and blinds yada yada but I know I could steal blinds the next orbit by playing position or outplaying someone on the flop. There are a number of stacks at our table that have half our chip value and will be putting their money in with a wider range rather than calling off our stack to a chip leader.
  • UnknownUnknown
    Richard~ wrote: »
    I don't need queen high hands. I just need any ace, 55+ QK and KJs. But I really love to show maniacs that I'm not scared so I'm a bit of a donkey.


    In this spot thogh I think it's pretty obvious that villain is shoving any ace or any pair in order to isolate SB's ATC calling range, I've done this myself so AJ has to be a snapcall, even against someone who's less of a maniac than villain.


    and i posted this 2 days ago without the hand history and explained that this guy is playing ultra aggressive, but in a terrible way. every few hands hes randomly going all in...hes making awful plays....and i know i have him beat because hed slow play KK-AA etc....I have him on a random hand at best and more likely he saw any ace and pushed.
  • LanterneRougeLanterneRouge
    As already stated, this is a way different scenario than originally posted (you only have 1/4 the m previously stated). +1 on all the responses. Although I generally don't like calling off my 12m stack with a third-rate unmade hand, I'd still call here for sure (based on your established read of the villain).
    darbday wrote: »
    Is there anyway i can bring up everyones in the tourney's chip count?

    You brought up the issue of your stack size vs. the average stack size yesterday as well. While they are numbers worth knowing (particularly your stack size vs. the average stack at your table), I think you might possibly be overvaluing their importance. Your m (stack size vs. blinds + antes) is by far the more relevant number. Sitting in last place with the lowest chip count is still not terrible if your m is 100 and you have loads of time before being under pressure from the blinds.
  • actyperactyper
    Great point, players overvalue average chip stack way too often and pannick.
  • UnknownUnknown
    LanterneRouge wrote: »
    As already stated, this is a way different scenario than originally posted (you only have 1/4 the m previously stated). +1 on all the responses. Although I generally don't like calling off my 12m stack with a third-rate unmade hand, I'd still call here for sure (based on your established read of the villain).



    You brought up the issue of your stack size vs. the average stack size yesterday as well. While they are numbers worth knowing (particularly your stack size vs. the average stack at your table), I think you might possibly be overvaluing their importance. Your m (stack size vs. blinds + antes) is by far the more relevant number. Sitting in last place with the lowest chip count is still not terrible if your m is 100 and you have loads of time before being under pressure from the blinds.


    I'll think about that thanks
  • westside8westside8
    I think seeing complete info (with regards to chip stack/blinds, etc), fist pump get this in.
  • DennisGDennisG
    blackmagicz wrote: »
    I dont like this spot at all. But that is me personally. As Compuease said I rather be the pusher than the caller especially with AJ.

    I understand the whole M thingy and blinds yada yada but I know I could steal blinds the next orbit by playing position or outplaying someone on the flop. There are a number of stacks at our table that have half our chip value and will be putting their money in with a wider range rather than calling off our stack to a chip leader.

    +1 to this...

    I say this in theory looking at it on paper. As I have just proven to myself a couple days ago, I can't lay this down and I snap call..lol..without thinking it out. Villian showed up with JJ this time for me.
  • UnknownUnknown
    Ihaveyourname wrote: »
    +1 to this...

    I say this in theory looking at it on paper. As I have just proven to myself a couple days ago, I can't lay this down and I snap call..lol..without thinking it out. Villian showed up with JJ this time for me.

    next time i will think about this and look for a even better spot, although i may use this again. I'm seriously sure you are a better poker player but I was as confident as could be that he had ace rag, and most of all i just wanted to know if he showed his cards to me would i be correct to make the call when i cleary don't have to....thanks all
  • Wetts1012Wetts1012
    Based on reads and position, You lose an absolute fortune in Cev by folding here.
  • westside8westside8
    Ihaveyourname wrote: »
    +1 to this...

    I say this in theory looking at it on paper. As I have just proven to myself a couple days ago, I can't lay this down and I snap call..lol..without thinking it out. Villian showed up with JJ this time for me.

    Folding a top 10% starting hands with a M of 12 when villain is a proven maniac, who is shoving on the button is a huge leak. You end up giving up way too much equity in a spot like this.

    Btw...that one occurrence with JJ is a bit of a small sample size don't you think?
Sign In or Register to comment.
HomeDiscussionsToggle Dark Mode