Craps newbie questions.
Greetings,
I don't understand the appeal of craps.
Why not play Bacarrat (lower house advantage -1.06%) or flat bet basic strategy Blackjack (-.20-.66%) or card count Blackjack +1%? Why Craps?
Based on what some former's said in another post I thought I'd give craps a try.
I've tried playing twice now and I don't see the point of the game.
Both times I played the mainly Don't Pass betting the table minimum $15 and playing full odds on a 3x4x5x table ($90). Sometimes I played the Pass line taking full odds after betting the table minimum.
This gives me an average theoretical loss of $0.21 per game or about $3-5 an hour.
I can't see the point of it. Unless you can have some kind of dice control there is no skill in the game?
Stanford Wong seems to believe in dice control. What do you guys think?
Have any of you tried it seriously?
How are the comps for craps? How are they calculated?
Thoughts?
I don't understand the appeal of craps.
Why not play Bacarrat (lower house advantage -1.06%) or flat bet basic strategy Blackjack (-.20-.66%) or card count Blackjack +1%? Why Craps?
Based on what some former's said in another post I thought I'd give craps a try.
I've tried playing twice now and I don't see the point of the game.
Both times I played the mainly Don't Pass betting the table minimum $15 and playing full odds on a 3x4x5x table ($90). Sometimes I played the Pass line taking full odds after betting the table minimum.
This gives me an average theoretical loss of $0.21 per game or about $3-5 an hour.
I can't see the point of it. Unless you can have some kind of dice control there is no skill in the game?
Stanford Wong seems to believe in dice control. What do you guys think?
Have any of you tried it seriously?
How are the comps for craps? How are they calculated?
Thoughts?
Comments
Craps appeals to people because of the fast action and pace of the game...they enjoy to play it for the rush, and the excitement of craps can't be beat compared to playing bacarat and blackjack, plus bacarat is an f-ing slow game. Most casual casino visitors play craps because of the loud noise as well usually associated with the craps table - you don't ever see people screaming when they hit a blackjack, but they will when a point is made in craps even if they only have a min-bet on the pass line.
In terms of EV, craps could potentially be very low if the full odds are higher, but you really can't find anything higher than 3/4/5 anywhere (BCC had 5/5/5 but not sure if they still do) other than a few smaller Vegas casinos where they offer up to 20x odds (people claimed 100x have existed in the past but I haven't seen it)
Thanks for the input,
Casino Royale in vegas offers 100x, Seneca offers 2x and smoking , Bleah..
While I won't do the calculation for every odds situation.
Pass line with no odds is 1.41% ie Bet $10 take no odds.
Pass line with single odds ie Bet $10 take $10 odds the house edge is 0.8%
Pass line with double odds ie Bet $10 take $20 odds the house edge is 0.6%
So if you get to 3 4 or 5x odds the house edge is under 0.5%
Bad bets on the craps table are the place bets. 4 and 10 the casino edge is 6.7%. The 5 and 9 the house edge is 4%. 6 and 8 the edge is 1.52%
Hard 4 or 10 is approximately 11%, Hard 6 or 8 is approximately 9%
Bet the pass, you definitely want to be rolling with the table, not against the table. Who cares if the odds are a teensy bit more in your favour on Don't Pass. I've been on hot rolls where a guy tipped ME $25 because of all the money he made. When the table is hot there is nothing like it. The swings are huge and nothing beats the adrenaline rush of a 4 or 5 point roll, especially when you hit the max odds on a 10 or 4. It's the only game where people cheer you on. You don't see people yelling out 'ya baby, pump that one armed bandit again' or 'come on blazing 7s' or 'let's see 3 cherries'.
It is THE best casino game.
Short story - there was once I was shooting craps at Brantford while I was waiting for my name to be called for the 10/20 (before the phone-in was allowed), and before I came the table was just getting killed. The guy beside me was sitting there with about 2K in chips and I see him betting Don't Pass, so I was like "meh, why not" and started betting it with him while the entire table stuck with the Pass line. For the next 5 to 6 rows, while I was betting $10 with max odds on Don't, he was doing $100 with max odds, and 7 was being rolled literally as soon as the point was established. While he was playing Don't, he was also constant placing max on 6/8 just as "insurance", so when it got to me and I establish a point of 5 (or it was a 9), he was about to do his stuff with placing $100 on 6/8. I told him to not worry about it as 7 was coming right out, he took my advice, 7 came, and he placed one of the $100 chips in my tray saying "thanks for saving me $100" and promptly coloured up with about 3K~ in chips.
Since then I don't think I've ever bet Don't Pass.
+1. If you want to guarentee yourself a boring time playing craps, bet against the table and do your fist pumps when everyone else at the table just lost their money.
In blackjack people will berate you if you steal the dealers bust card, does that count?
/g2
What are your craps strategies?
Mine is ... Play the pass line or the don't pass. Take full odds. Buy in for a metric shitload of cash, rat hole chips to make it look like you're losing more, colour up after the shift change. Mention to bad players betting the sucker prop bets that you won a $1700 pot playing 2/5 poker.
I am a craps newbie and would play it for fun, not for profit. However, you will hear big screams at the blackjack table when I have a four-way split that has been doubled down twice when the dealer either busts - or turns a 16 in to 21.
a) Have fun.
b) Make stupid side bets for $1 against my buddy. "Next roll will be odd!"
c) Try to lose money slower than my buddy
d) If I double my $100, I pocket the orig $100 and see how long the rest lasts.... if I go on a great roll I pocket $100s here and there to guarantee a profit.
e) I bet on 6-8-9 every time the point is 5.... why? because I made $600 in 20 minutes doing that once when I hit the 5 point three times consecutively (with about ten visits to 6-8-9 in the process)
f) Not to lose more than $100
/g2
Yeah but no-one at the table could care less what you got. It is the equivalent of watching Canada playing the gold medal game at home and going to a bar. It is exciting when they score a goal but the experience is enhanced by having everyone else there cheering with you and you definitely don't want to be the lonely American in the corner cheering for the US.
The minimum bet is $5 if you want 100x odds, if you bet less than that it's 20x odds.
13cards,
Thanks for the input!
Please don't take this analysis as a criticism, I'm just trying to figure out the -EV of this system.
The place bets on 6 and 8 are the 3rd best best in craps losing -1.5% on the 6 and 8.
The 8 hardways bet is bad, -9.09%
Like I said, I'm a newbie at craps but wouldn't you be much better off making a come bet (-1.4%) and winning on a 7 then taking free full odds , getting paid 6 to 5 rather than 7 to 6 be much better for pretty much any winning sequence of rolls you can imagine? You'll be paying 0.374% on a 345x table for the come+full odds, rather than 1.5% for the place bet.
On the initial 18+1 bet ... Not making the hardways bet will reduce your average theoretical loss by a third. (not counting the toke)
Like many have said in this thread already - you cannot take an EV/analytical approach for craps. It is a FACT that you will be -EV in this game no matter what, just go and have fun and don't bother with calculating EV. If you can't do that, don't bother playing.
Me and a friend started betting the Don't because the table was cold and shortly after we had the whole table at BCC betting against the shooter. It was pretty neat.
I don't know if anyone sets the dice when they shoot, but learn what sets are good. Many people don't believe it, but I think it works...it just takes practice.
I should be at Fallsview on Sunday to play for a bit.
First roll didn't get anything going. I made a point, some few numbers and then sevened out.
Second roll was insane. I hit my $1 4 pt firebet (probably a total of 7 pts, 3 repeats) and then sevened out. I forgot to count my rolls prior, but I rolled seven three times. Twice during a comeout and then the last seven out. The roll lasted around 45 min or so. I made one guy about $3K during my roll and another guy about $1.5k when he came half way through it. I'm a very conservative better and only made about $225 on my rolling. (I just like shooting the dice) lol. This is the stuff that makes playing craps fun.
Third roll I only had 15 min so I decided to bet against myself. I warned the table, but I was the only person betting Don't. I bet my Don't Pass, rolled a 4. I bet a DC, rolled an 8. Rolled a 6 and 9 a couple of times then sevened out. Took my winnings and went to go eat buffet.