medium PP on paired board
played an interesting hand today that i thought i'd post. i'll post it in sections and hopefully get some opinions along the way.
PokerStars Game #17590979058: Tournament #88687446, $3.00+$0.30 Hold'em No Limit - Level II (15/30) - 2008/05/21 - 14:36:44 (ET)
Table '88687446 225' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: KEB1966 (2131 in chips)
Seat 2: daveu88 (2740 in chips)
Seat 3: Lowbrain (3915 in chips)
Seat 4: Nirass (3000 in chips)
Seat 5: Jacky Runner (3681 in chips)
Seat 6: Diamond Dave (2470 in chips)
Seat 7: Slin67 (2705 in chips)
Seat 8: m_dolens (3428 in chips)
Seat 9: drshiva (5870 in chips)
Lowbrain: posts small blind 15
Nirass: posts big blind 30
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to m_dolens [9c 9h]
Jacky Runner: calls 30
Diamond Dave: folds
Slin67: raises 30 to 60
m_dolens: calls 60
drshiva: folds
KEB1966: calls 60
daveu88: folds
Lowbrain: folds
Nirass: calls 30
Jacky Runner: calls 30
*** FLOP *** [Th 7h Td]
Nirass: checks
Jacky Runner: checks
Slin67: checks
m_dolens: ?
i usually like to bet a paired flop when i have a PP, but with four people in the hand i wasn't too sure. i had a feeling that the original raiser had a premium hand (perhaps a bigger PP) because he had raised min preflop prior to this with a huge hand as well.
also, what's your opinion on just a call on the raise? i don't like to get too fancy with low-medium PPs personally.
(i'll post the rest of flop play and turn play later.)
PokerStars Game #17590979058: Tournament #88687446, $3.00+$0.30 Hold'em No Limit - Level II (15/30) - 2008/05/21 - 14:36:44 (ET)
Table '88687446 225' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: KEB1966 (2131 in chips)
Seat 2: daveu88 (2740 in chips)
Seat 3: Lowbrain (3915 in chips)
Seat 4: Nirass (3000 in chips)
Seat 5: Jacky Runner (3681 in chips)
Seat 6: Diamond Dave (2470 in chips)
Seat 7: Slin67 (2705 in chips)
Seat 8: m_dolens (3428 in chips)
Seat 9: drshiva (5870 in chips)
Lowbrain: posts small blind 15
Nirass: posts big blind 30
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to m_dolens [9c 9h]
Jacky Runner: calls 30
Diamond Dave: folds
Slin67: raises 30 to 60
m_dolens: calls 60
drshiva: folds
KEB1966: calls 60
daveu88: folds
Lowbrain: folds
Nirass: calls 30
Jacky Runner: calls 30
*** FLOP *** [Th 7h Td]
Nirass: checks
Jacky Runner: checks
Slin67: checks
m_dolens: ?
i usually like to bet a paired flop when i have a PP, but with four people in the hand i wasn't too sure. i had a feeling that the original raiser had a premium hand (perhaps a bigger PP) because he had raised min preflop prior to this with a huge hand as well.
also, what's your opinion on just a call on the raise? i don't like to get too fancy with low-medium PPs personally.
(i'll post the rest of flop play and turn play later.)
Comments
i'd say if you don't re-raise preflop, you've got to be prepared to dump this if you don't hit your set. you've got a bunch of chips, i don't mind smooth calling to see what happens. or i raise to 200 and see what he does. pretty sure you are getting called anyway but likely only by the raiser.
there are couple of draws possible on the flop. since you have blockers, an OESD is less likely. if checked to you, i would think someone is either slowplaying an absolute monster (i.e. no fear of flush or straight draw...) or they have none of it. so i bet around 75% of pot. if you get raised, meh, likely fold. if you get called, meh, depends on your reads here.
I would bet also. If you get any callers you can be pretty sure you are behind and some one has a 10 and I would be just looking to dump the hand.
looking back on this hand i agree with graham and big chris. i think i should have bet the flop here (which i normally would in this scenario). i chose not to though and here's how it played out:
m_dolens: checks
KEB1966: checks
*** TURN *** [Th 7h Td] [2d]
Nirass: checks
Jacky Runner: bets 120
Slin67: folds
m_dolens: ?
flop is checked all around. UTG leads out on the turn and original raiser folds. now i'm thinking here that this raise represents one of two hands: either slowplaying a 10, or he's betting a flush draw. i really don't think he'd check the flop with a 7 or an overpair. also, since the everyone has shown weakness on the flop he could just be bluffing with air. i still have two people to act behind me. what do you do here?
Well, now it gets more tricky. If the player betting likes to steal lots of pots, and think your 9s are still good raise it up to say 360. A lot of it depends though on what kind of player is doing the betting, and what your table image is. Otherwise just fold and wait for a better spot.
If you call what are you going to do if he bets on the river? Are you going to call that?
If anything I would fold or raise here. If you raise and get action I would look to fold this hand. This seems like a slow play. Check with a 10 and hope either the pre-flop raiser or some one else does the betting. With it checked around on the flop he bets looking to see if any one has a part and will give him some action.
I think (with out any reads) that it is highly unlikely he is betting into 3 players with a hand that is weaker then 9’s.
Also because it is early I think I fold here and save my chips for later.
m_dolens: calls 120
KEB1966: folds
Nirass: folds
*** RIVER *** [Th 7h Td 2d] [Kc]
Jacky Runner: bets 300
m_dolens:?
m_dolens: calls 300
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Jacky Runner: shows [Kd 6d] (two pair, Kings and Tens)
i feel that i played this hand too passively. the call on the turn was too weak. a raise would have given me some more information for sure. i felt like i was ahead and therefore i think i should have raised it up. that being said, i just called and Kc hits the river. what do you do with his bet now?
Since you have already decided you think you are holding the better hand, you shouldnt really let a King on the river scare you. You didn't get enough information in the hand so based on your previous plays make the call and learn something about your opponent. Asking us what we would do at this point is kinda pointless though as from our replies we wouldn't have gone this far into the hand without getting some more info.
wouldn't be able to see the flop. You may get the heads up with the min raiser, with probably the worst or only slightly the better of it "but u have no way of knowing which". This wouldnt be good. 99's early in a game should be treated like any other small pocket pair. You want to get in cheap in a multiway pot, hopefully with position and hope to hit a flop or get out as cheaply as possible.
On the flop, since u missed and there is two checks and you have a couple of outs with backdoor draws, check also and hope the last player checks and u may hit free 9 or 8 for more outs. You can often get just as much info with a check, if you check and player 4 bets, u can see how 1 and 2 will react, if they reraise, fold....if player 4 bets small and 1 or 2 call , call also...but proceed with caution
Wader
Flop brings a missed set and no over pr. not sure why its says page ranking above?
Graham, how about turning that off?