Right or wrong fold

isnork

Imperial Palace 1/2 NL a few hands after getting spanked (see beat story)

Sitting on about $120 played few hands - JJ in mid position, 2 folds to me raise to 12. TAG to my left pushes all in for 89, button (new player appears to be TAG as well not much history to go on) pushes all in for about 150 blinds fold, last player to push says to the other guy "I only did this to protect you buddy" to the guy to my left. Note: I am pretty sure they do not know each other.

I immediately think AQ, AJ maybe even KQ definately not a high pair. I put the guy on my left on 99-qq.

I fold, of course J comes on the flop which would have tripled me up.

QQ on my left and AK for the second push as suspected.

I think I made the right decision but that flop has me second guessing myself.

g2

Wow, fantastic. Since you would have sucked you think you should have called. Just wow.

/g2

GTA Poker

I call if you know there will be a J on the flop, no brainer. Although, you do have to avoid running straight cards and an overcard for a bigger set.

isnork

g2 wrote: »

Wow, fantastic. Since you would have sucked you think you should have called. Just wow.

/g2

Thanks for the insight Greg. What came on the flop aside, based on the information provided did I make the correct decision? I have had a bad run this trip and obviously not making all the correct decisions or something.

STR82ACE

isnork wrote: »

Thanks for the insight Greg. What came on the flop aside, based on the information provided did I make the correct decision? I have had a bad run this trip and obviously not making all the correct decisions or something.

Take the flop out of the equation...you folded anyway.

Ask yourself again if it was the right move after seeing the other's cards.

Don't let a flop you WOULD have hit convince you that your decision was a bad one.

BBC Z

I call if you know there will be a J on the flop, no brainer.

It would kill me inside if someone had this ability and was playing 1/2 NL

Graham

Good fold... knowing what you were up against. You only had 12$ in the pot so... I wouldn't risk my chips in what will either be a race or you an underdog.

Redington

isnork, sorry for the beating you're taking.

I think your question is wether you made a good fold or bad fold.

You figure out the answer by observing what you know and what you think will happen; (what you don't know).

First part of the thinking is pot odds; Do you have good pot odds for a call?
Or should you just push given stack sizes, not just pot odds.

You also should care a little about what will happen (what you dont know) based on probable outcomes of the flop and other players reaction to it.
--In this case all the money is going in preflop so you just have to make a decision based on what's in front of you.

Then given what you have, you have to to figure out what the other players probably have, you start to think of best estimates.

So lets look at the first part. Pot odds;

You open for $12 which makes the pot fifteen including blinds.
Then you get reraised allin for $89 making the pot $101.
Then the next player pushes for $150 making the pot $261, but you only have $108 left so that means you can only win $108 so the pot is really only $219 for you.

Now that gives you 2-1 pot odds. Which are pretty good, IF you have more chips behind and can win a bunch more based on implied odds (what will happen). If you had another 100bb and so did the rereraiser then you could make an arguement for a call to try and hit a set and stack him, but you don't so lets worry about what's in front of us.

Now lets look at what they likely have. Since you didn't say that either of these players were particularly aggressive, or loose lets pretend they are pretty standard players.

What would you repush all in on when someone has raised? Even if you have the position, you wanted to get all in the money in preflop what kind of hand do you have?
Most people are going to do this with AA-JJ and sometimes with AK-AQ but usually only if the player before you has really been acting aggresive or silly. So since you have two jacks, you can pretty much be sure that one of the other two players has AA-QQ all of which have you as a 4-1 dog.

So if your a 4-1 dog you need more money in this pot or another couple of players making the pot the right odds to call.

I hope that helps you figure out other poker questions too.

westside8

isnork wrote: »

I think I made the right decision but that flop has me second guessing myself.

Don't start getting result oriented...

IMO pretty easy fold...if you had QQ on the other hand...is a diff story.

JimmyHo

raise, re-raise; you know against two players you might be at best 50/50 (i.e. one player has over cards) in this situation or dominated (higher pair). I would fold. If you want to play pre-flop 50/50 poker, try the roulette (red vs black).

Its a hard decision with a decent pair but with a second caller its tough. One caller, it might be a different story.

isnork

Thanks folks. Appreciate the feedback here.

Graham

Redington wrote: »

isnork, sorry for the beating you're taking.

I think your question is wether you made a good fold or bad fold.

You figure out the answer by observing what you know and what you think will happen; (what you don't know).

First part of the thinking is pot odds; Do you have good pot odds for a call?
Or should you just push given stack sizes, not just pot odds.

You also should care a little about what will happen (what you dont know) based on probable outcomes of the flop and other players reaction to it.
--In this case all the money is going in preflop so you just have to make a decision based on what's in front of you.

Then given what you have, you have to to figure out what the other players probably have, you start to think of best estimates.

So lets look at the first part. Pot odds;

You open for $12 which makes the pot fifteen including blinds.
Then you get reraised allin for $89 making the pot $101.
Then the next player pushes for $150 making the pot $261, but you only have $108 left so that means you can only win $108 so the pot is really only $219 for you.

Now that gives you 2-1 pot odds. Which are pretty good, IF you have more chips behind and can win a bunch more based on implied odds (what will happen). If you had another 100bb and so did the rereraiser then you could make an arguement for a call to try and hit a set and stack him, but you don't so lets worry about what's in front of us.

Now lets look at what they likely have. Since you didn't say that either of these players were particularly aggressive, or loose lets pretend they are pretty standard players.

What would you repush all in on when someone has raised? Even if you have the position, you wanted to get all in the money in preflop what kind of hand do you have?
Most people are going to do this with AA-JJ and sometimes with AK-AQ but usually only if the player before you has really been acting aggresive or silly. So since you have two jacks, you can pretty much be sure that one of the other two players has AA-QQ all of which have you as a 4-1 dog.

So if your a 4-1 dog you need more money in this pot or another couple of players making the pot the right odds to call.

I hope that helps you figure out other poker questions too.

Great post Redington!

BlondeFish

isnork, you made the correct decision in that situation, but it's important to understand Redington's excellent analysis so you'll keep making decisions that will maximize your profit in the long run.

pokerJAH wrote: »

If you want to play pre-flop 50/50 poker, try the roulette (red vs black).

I would never play 39/41 -EV roulette, but I would gladly play +EV "pre-flop 50/50 poker" every single hand in a cash game if there is any dead money in the pot. Even if I knew that I have less than 50% chance of winning a hand, but I have the pot odds to call, then I will maximize my long-term profit by calling even though it is worse than a coin-flip. Very few of the players I have talked to seem to understand this, so re-read Redington's post.