"Keep raising and I promise I'll fold at the end...&quo
This is a repost of a true story I told on 2+2. I thought you guys might enjoy it; it's about a guy who wants to give away all of his money. God knows why. It's pretty long, just to warn you.
I sat down to play my usual game, 25-50 shorthanded online. I knew 3 of the players, the 4th I'd never seen before. He had about $1000, which is more than most first-timers bring to these games. It's usually either the minimum of $250 (a good way to lose $250) or the only slightly more reasonable $500.
Through the chat, I learn a few things about him. He's Russian, his connection sucks, and he's kind of drunk on vodka. He hates Americans, and likes Canadians. I'm Canadian, but I don't care what he thinks of me, I just want him to play faster. His English is limited and broken, and pretty hilarious. He says things like "You are a stuped". Which people would normally find offensive, but in some kind of immature way it was hilarious.
So we're all having a good time, except it's so slow. Kind of like this post so far. Then this guy (I'll call him Teddy KGB) says he wants to have fun, and if we bet he will raise and then fold at the end and give us his money. Now, this is possible, because at this site there doesn't have to be a bet to you in order to fold. You can act first, and press the fold button, and just fold right then and there instead of checking.
But none of us believe him. But then he does just what he said he'd do, twice, with 2 people who aren't me. He keeps betting, they keep calling (not raising--nobody really knows what to think at this point) and then on the river, he's first to act, and he just folds and gives them the pot.
I like it.
So he's lost a bit by now, he's down to like $400 or something. Folded to him in SB, I'm in BB. He's just played those two hands where he folded at the end. I have rags. He raises, and encourages me to reraise the whole way, because he wants to give me his money. He says he will fold at the end.
I ask him why he's doing this, and he says he has a lot of money in Russia. OK. Since I just saw him do this twice, I'll trust him. So we cap preflop, we cap the flop. I have absolutely nothing. We get to the turn, and we cap that too. He now has $37 left. The river card comes.
And instead of folding, Teddy KGB bets his last $37. Then he says: "I have a J and a 3" which translates to 2 pair. I call his all-in bet with nothing because I'm stunned, and he takes it down.
I don't get mad. I just ask him why he didn't fold. He tells me he would have folded if I'd raised the river. I tell him he was all-in, and that it's impossible to fold when you're all-in regardless of whether or not your opponent raises you. He says he didn't know that. I tell him I want my money back. I don't care about taking his money, I just want my part of that pot back.
He says OK. And then he starts losing it to the other players at the table. I tell him "Whoa". Don't lose it to them before you pay me back. Finally we get heads-up again. He raises UTG and I 3 bet from MP with A6o to isolate him. We cap preflop. I say that this is his chance to pay me back, we need to cap the turn, and then he needs to fold when I tell him to. He says "I have Ks Th". OK.
Flop is AA2. He bets, I raise, he calls. I tell him to get squared up we need to cap the turn. Turn is another 2. We cap the turn. River is a 5. He bets, I tell him we're even now, and when I raise, he needs to fold. He says "I have Ks Th" again. I don't know what the hell that means. Anyways, he bets, I raise.
And instead of folding, he calls. Of course I take it down with my aces full, but he called with his 2 pr king kicker instead of folding. I'm dumbfounded. Maybe I am a stuped. Maybe I'm being suckered here. I say to him "Dude, you were supposed to fold. What if I had 73o or something?" He says "I told you what I had".
Suffice it to say that the rest of the table finds our exchanges hilarious. He has like $120 left now, he loses it quickly and says "You guys want I should buy $1000?". The chat box fills up with various statements like: "Yes" and "Rebuy" and "Make it $3000". He says OK, tells us what his new username will be, and leaves.
I wrote down the new username. I haven't seen him since.
I sat down to play my usual game, 25-50 shorthanded online. I knew 3 of the players, the 4th I'd never seen before. He had about $1000, which is more than most first-timers bring to these games. It's usually either the minimum of $250 (a good way to lose $250) or the only slightly more reasonable $500.
Through the chat, I learn a few things about him. He's Russian, his connection sucks, and he's kind of drunk on vodka. He hates Americans, and likes Canadians. I'm Canadian, but I don't care what he thinks of me, I just want him to play faster. His English is limited and broken, and pretty hilarious. He says things like "You are a stuped". Which people would normally find offensive, but in some kind of immature way it was hilarious.
So we're all having a good time, except it's so slow. Kind of like this post so far. Then this guy (I'll call him Teddy KGB) says he wants to have fun, and if we bet he will raise and then fold at the end and give us his money. Now, this is possible, because at this site there doesn't have to be a bet to you in order to fold. You can act first, and press the fold button, and just fold right then and there instead of checking.
But none of us believe him. But then he does just what he said he'd do, twice, with 2 people who aren't me. He keeps betting, they keep calling (not raising--nobody really knows what to think at this point) and then on the river, he's first to act, and he just folds and gives them the pot.
I like it.
So he's lost a bit by now, he's down to like $400 or something. Folded to him in SB, I'm in BB. He's just played those two hands where he folded at the end. I have rags. He raises, and encourages me to reraise the whole way, because he wants to give me his money. He says he will fold at the end.
I ask him why he's doing this, and he says he has a lot of money in Russia. OK. Since I just saw him do this twice, I'll trust him. So we cap preflop, we cap the flop. I have absolutely nothing. We get to the turn, and we cap that too. He now has $37 left. The river card comes.
And instead of folding, Teddy KGB bets his last $37. Then he says: "I have a J and a 3" which translates to 2 pair. I call his all-in bet with nothing because I'm stunned, and he takes it down.
I don't get mad. I just ask him why he didn't fold. He tells me he would have folded if I'd raised the river. I tell him he was all-in, and that it's impossible to fold when you're all-in regardless of whether or not your opponent raises you. He says he didn't know that. I tell him I want my money back. I don't care about taking his money, I just want my part of that pot back.
He says OK. And then he starts losing it to the other players at the table. I tell him "Whoa". Don't lose it to them before you pay me back. Finally we get heads-up again. He raises UTG and I 3 bet from MP with A6o to isolate him. We cap preflop. I say that this is his chance to pay me back, we need to cap the turn, and then he needs to fold when I tell him to. He says "I have Ks Th". OK.
Flop is AA2. He bets, I raise, he calls. I tell him to get squared up we need to cap the turn. Turn is another 2. We cap the turn. River is a 5. He bets, I tell him we're even now, and when I raise, he needs to fold. He says "I have Ks Th" again. I don't know what the hell that means. Anyways, he bets, I raise.
And instead of folding, he calls. Of course I take it down with my aces full, but he called with his 2 pr king kicker instead of folding. I'm dumbfounded. Maybe I am a stuped. Maybe I'm being suckered here. I say to him "Dude, you were supposed to fold. What if I had 73o or something?" He says "I told you what I had".
Suffice it to say that the rest of the table finds our exchanges hilarious. He has like $120 left now, he loses it quickly and says "You guys want I should buy $1000?". The chat box fills up with various statements like: "Yes" and "Rebuy" and "Make it $3000". He says OK, tells us what his new username will be, and leaves.
I wrote down the new username. I haven't seen him since.
Comments
First of all, if Teddy was colluding with all of your other opponents, I think you really stuck your nose out there big time. But, let's examine the case where Teddy is acting alone.
He first blows off $200 in the two hands to set you up. Then, the next hand, he beats you for over $400 when you follow his suggestion of raising every time after he "happens" to hit a big hand. ("Online poker is rigged" theorists please stand up.) So he's up more than $200 on this entire play.
In the second hand where he has KT, he undoubdtedly thinks the King kicker is good. You might see it as Teddy getting unlucky that you actually hit a hand yourself. If Teddy also takes this pot down, you are thoroughly hosed money-wise (down 800 or 900 or so?), and (I assume, as does Teddy) you would be on maximum tilt. Also note that he told you he had J3 (two pair) when he thought it was good. Maybe he also thinks the KT is good too.
Some more specific things that make me suspicious.
A bad connection:
It's possible that Teddy is playing slowly for some other reason... perhaps he is talking to someone else he is colluding with. Or maybe it's just as simple as thinking carefully about how to pull off the scam. Does the site you were on have any way of showing you his actual connection status?
The exact things he said:
[Assuming you reported his chat verbatim]
While it is likely for someone who speaks poor English to use tenses and quantifiers ("the", "a", etc) incorrectly, in my experience, it is *very* rare that the usage will flip back and forth, as in
"You are a stuped"
"I have a J and a 3"
"I have Ks Th"
Equally rare is flipping back and forth between perfect English, and disjointed and obvious "Hollywood" Russian-English:
"I told you what I had"-- good English for a supposed Russian, in what is a somewhat difficult grammatical construct (to a non-English native)
"You guys want I should buy $1000?"-- this overly-broken sentence sounds like it's straight out of Rounders... you even called the guy Teddy KGB yourself, no? 8)
The buy-in:
You say he buys in for close to the amount a decent player would buy-in for. Suspicious? Maybe since he claimed to have a lot of money. A real, drunk "show-off" may well have bought-in for something noticable like $10,000. Or a real fish might buy in short.
The ****most**** important thing:
[drum roll...................]
If he *wasn't* trying to scam you, why did he *not* make the play he promised to make (and had made in the small pots previously) when he was up against you?
*Maybe* you got lucky and sat down with a drunk-super-fish-supreme. My guess is this was just a failed hit 'n' run attempt. Not only did you get fooled into letting Teddy take a big pot from you, he was so artful about it that *you* were practically begging *him* to get in another big pot with you after that.
Either a funny story or a scary story, depending on how you look at it I guess. 8)
ScottyZ
I knew 2 of the players very well, and trust them as much as you can trust anyone online. I have no answers unfortunately, or any reason to debate any of your theories. I just thought it was pretty funny. Would I have found it as funny if I'd lost? Probably not, but still, it's not that much money and I'd have learned my lesson. I would've left (I don't play tilted, so there's no danger of that--I just leave, and return a while later), and tried to take it back from him or from others later on in the night.
As Andyfox said: "Sometimes truth is indeed stranger than fiction".
Regards,
all_aces
You're right that this is hilarious. I think I'm going to try using that one.
ScottyZ
I'm glad you took his money all_aces, serves the guy right! But I wonder if he is doing this to anyone who isn't getting the cards. Some people on that site could be losing a lot of money falling for that tactic.
If you do play at pokerroom, don't worry. I don't work there, but I will say with confidence that this scam--if it was indeed a scam--won't happen to you.
Especially now that you've read about it.