ICM Software

I am looking into 2 ICM tools and would like some feedback from forumers. Currently the big 2 are SnG Wizard and SnG Power Tools.

Any comments on these from current users
ease of use
automation (i.e. rading stack sizes, integration with Poker Tracker)


Thanks

Comments

  • Sorry for my ignorance, but what does ICM stand for?
  • Independent Chip Model...basically helps you to decide hands that have +ev for pushing late in a SnG based on your opponents.

    (that's the coles notes version)
  • Oh, thanks... learn something new everyday!
  • I have been using SitNgo Wizard, but not the other one.

    I do like that it autoimports hand histories from PS and FT and lets you run through the tourney. IT shows you where you made equity mistakes and the player tendencies are pretty accurate as well.

    You can also run through the Poker Quizes which are great for learning equity shoves.

    It did take a little getting used to and the tutorials are week, but you can find videos from colin moshman showing the product in use.
  • Hobbes, you've been playing poker for like 3 years. Why in the world would you still need software to tell you what hands to play?
  • too many 2nd/3rd/bubble places and not enough 1st.
    Just want to see where I can make better decisions.
  • How much do they cost, and if I was to play about 20 tournaments a week.. 5-10 SnG's do you think that it would be worth the investment?
  • these software programs can't really help you 'play' better

    what the help you with is making better decisions when your down to 4-15 big blinds, late blind position play and making better equity decisions.

    If you really want to learn how to play SitNgos look for colin moshman's sit n go book;

    Or post more hands here and we can help
  • Redington wrote: »

    If you really want to learn how to play SitNgos look for colin moshman's sit n go book;


    Great book. reading it now.
    I'm gonna look at SnG Wizard. They have a 30 day trial.
    Gonna look at Colin's video 1st.
  • Had SNG Power Tools on my old laptop back when i used to play sngs... definitely a must for anyone who plays sngs seriously. If SNG Wizard is anything like SNG Power tools you can't really go wrong with either one.

    You can also make a spreadsheet and use pokerstove and do all this stuff manually if you have a solid understanding of the math of sng bubble play and excel.
  • too many 2nd/3rd/bubble places and not enough 1st.

    Then your issue is with Heads up play and not with ICM calculations. If I had to venture a guess, i'm gonna say yer too passive headsup.
  • Ok, here is a situation

    10player $100 SitNGo - stars blind sched

    5 players remain - top 3 pay

    You are seated 1 after UTG or one before Button depending how you look at it

    Blinds 50-100


    SB - 1250
    BB - 900
    UTG - 7200
    You 1250
    Button - 4400

    UTG folds
    You have A7s

    what is your move?

    This is what ICMs help with, not real time but it does give another strong tool for reviewing hands and to build on.

    If your getting alot of seconds and thirds, and with the amount I have played against you Hobbes, I think it would not relate to your heads up play it is your aggressiveness in accumulating chips immediately pre and post bubble.

    This puts you behing the 8ball and you are going into HU with a signifigant chip defecit.

    Try out SnG wizard and review your HH. I think your going to be surprised.
  • Redington wrote: »
    Ok, here is a situation

    10player $100 SitNGo - stars blind sched

    5 players remain - top 3 pay

    You are seated 1 after UTG or one before Button depending how you look at it

    Blinds 50-100


    SB - 1250
    BB - 900
    UTG - 7200
    You 1250
    Button - 4400

    UTG folds
    You have A7s

    what is your move?

    You really can't base your MOVE until you know a little about the players behind you. I'm assuming UTG folded. What range of hands would the other players call an all in on? You still have 12.5 BB so pushing is usually not the best option here. If you make it $300-$400 will everyone fold? How tight are you going to be recognized.

    Without answering those questions my answer on what my move would be:

    It depends
  • Graham wrote: »
    Sorry for my ignorance, but what does ICM stand for?

    YASA



    Thanks, to Acid Joe, I'm in the know


    Milton Slim or MS
  • AcidJoe wrote: »
    If you make it $300-$400 will everyone fold? How tight are you going to be recognized.

    Without answering those questions my answer on what my move would be:

    It depends


    Yes true. But ICM help you make the decision based on your stack equity to the tourny equity. Kinda like the zones of harrington but much more specific.

    SnG wizard actually accounts for the range as well when you auto import in hand histories, which helps you account for player tendency and figures the equities.
  • I have used SNG power tools when I played lots of SNG's. Right now I"m barely playing poker so I haven't dusted it off in a while.

    I know what ICM does in terms of stack equity to payout equity. I was responding to your question on what my move was. Based on what you posted I couldn't tell you my move.

    Hobbes, I have used SNGPT and it really helped me. But you need to run through specific situations where you think you may have made a mistake. From the sounds of it SNG wizard is a better program since it allows you to run HH but I haven't used it.

    Here is an old link that discusses both programs
  • Thanks for the link Joe.
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