Wwyd?
$1070 - MTT
Table has been very ABC with a calling station in the one seat, a LAG in the 8 seat and the ten seat is a good TAG with a WPT money , other then that everyones play is very predictable/somewhat fishy.
I am up to about 17K from original 10k and have table aces twice, AK a set etc.
Round 3 100/200
Folded to :
Hero - AA in Hijack-1 - Call 200 (hoping that LAG on the button will raise)
Lag Folds SB fold and BB who is WPT tag raises to 800.
I flat call.
Flop Q94r
BB bets 600
ME raises 1800
BB calls
turn 9
BB checks
ME checks
river 5
BB bets 1000
ME ?
Table has been very ABC with a calling station in the one seat, a LAG in the 8 seat and the ten seat is a good TAG with a WPT money , other then that everyones play is very predictable/somewhat fishy.
I am up to about 17K from original 10k and have table aces twice, AK a set etc.
Round 3 100/200
Folded to :
Hero - AA in Hijack-1 - Call 200 (hoping that LAG on the button will raise)
Lag Folds SB fold and BB who is WPT tag raises to 800.
I flat call.
Flop Q94r
BB bets 600
ME raises 1800
BB calls
turn 9
BB checks
ME checks
river 5
BB bets 1000
ME ?
Comments
There's just too much of his range that you can beat - especially by the way you played the hand.
you beat AQ, KK, JJ, 1010.
Lose to QQ
and tie if he also has AA
Is he capable of having a small PP in that spot - raising you PF out of the BB?
I know his bet on the river reeks of a value bet but with your hand I think you don't really have a choice but to call. By just limping PF, then raising the flop and then checking the turn - it may look like you have J,10.
My plan was to check the turn looking like I bet with the TJ draw, and pump the river unless the str got there, then value bet it as the str.
The weak bet on the river was confusing. 1k into 5k pot.
What things give away a protective bet vs a value bet?
A small value bet designed to get a little more money from you.
He's saying, "I'm making it cheap so that you don't fold and I get a little something for my hand.
I'd call here with aces up.
The monkey brain in me is tempted to re-suck-bet here... but it's probably a bad idea....
Comments?
I probably wouldn't raise the river, despite the small bet. Generally, as I'm sure you're aware, you want to play small, controlled pots with small hands, and big pots with big hands. You have one pair on the river here (technically two pair but you know what I mean) so I think this qualifies as a small hand. You would be sick if you raised the river and got re-raised.
If you do want to play a bigger pot with your aces here, bet 3K on the turn and check behind on the river, or bet the river if you really feel you're ahead. Re-opening the action on the river as it stands probably isn't what you're looking to do.
I agree that this sure does look like a defensive bet from a weak queen on the river, but in case it's not, check behind. You have a big stack; you don't need to take the risky approach to these situations. Just drag the pot and be happy with it IMO. Others may find this approach too weak, but as I mentioned, a river re-raise would make you sick.
To answer your final question, I find that what's in vogue these days is to make defensive bets small (like your opponent's river bet) and to make value bets (ie: from a nine in this hand) BIG. Almost over-betting the pot, so there's no way you can put him on a nine because why would he bet so much. There are no hard and fast rules here, though, and I know this contradicts what I've said up until this point. Regardless I'd still just call the river even though it really looks like a defensive bet from a weak queen.
I was really questioning whether I was missing a bet here.
I have been playing these situations defensively. I had a couple of situations where I was way good and am not sure if I am missing bets with these small defensive bets on the river when in position.
I concur that I have seen a shift from making small suck bets to overbets with the nuts.
Recalling my set over set situations where there was a huge reraise in both situations where I read them both as draw hands from aggressive players.
Oh if you want the results
I just smooth called and my AA was good against AQ
/g2
Dont worry I found another place to spew chips.
I disagree with the reraise as it would make my hand so transparent. I have AA in position, raised pot against one AND it is somewhat camoflouged.
Given the line I took, still pound the turn?
How do you determine blocking bet from suck bet?
First bad news: I find myself in the same table as Redington along with another CPT multiple money finisher (seat 1) while I am sleep-deprived. Second bad news: I find out that I did a stupid Phil Hellmuth move and had arrived late by more than an hour! Not only do I get deducted 200 chips, but there is the huge opportunity cost of not being able to accumulate chips or observe the table for 70 minutes.
In the first hand I saw Redington play, he asked how much was in the pot. I wasn't even in the hand but had tracked the pot at 925. I thought, "What!? He doesn't know how much is in the pot?!" I didn't think it was appropriate for a player not in the hand to give information so I kept quiet, & the dealer also followed the TDA rule and did not count out the pot. I don't remember ever playing against Redington in a tournament but after this hand, I assumed that he was trying to project a fishy image. I categorized him as a tricky LAG just like seat 8, and the 2 of them would be the least likely to play tight ABC poker.
I had jotted down the hand and the following is how I remember it. It was near the end of Level 2 with blinds at 50/100. I believe I was the puck, & seat 3 or 4 called. You limped with A-A with only 5 players left to act and one limper already, hoping that the loosest player in seat 8 would raise, but he folded. I had the misfortune of having a dominated A-Q. I raised to 500, and the 3 players after me folded. You chose the deceptive option of flat-calling with A-A against a TAG, which would only pay off if the TAG has top pair on the board. I agree with SirWatts that it is usually better to reraise with AA. There is now 1,250 in the pot.
With me on the puck, you check. I bet 600 and you raise another 1500. My breakeven pot odds is 28%, i.e., if I believe that I have at least 28% chance of winning the hand, then it is +EV and correct to call. Knowing that you were 1 of the most likely in the table to do a check-raise bluff, I thought that it was less likely for you to have limped in with the hands that are beating me - {AA-QQ, 99}. I put you as more likely to have {QK-, 9A-, JT or air} than {44, Q9, Q4 or 94}. I thought that I was ahead and I called. Little did I know that it was the perfect flop for you after your deceptive & risky play of flat-calling with AA. However, as we discussed later, you were scared when I called & thought that I was beating your overpair, e.g, {QQ, 99, 44}. There is now 5,450 in the pot.
If I were in your position, I would have value bet the turn. What else were you hoping for when you flat-called with AA? It was a great flop for you and the TAG bet out. Not reraising makes it unlikely that I have QQ or 44, which are the only likely hands that are beating you.
You checked again. My read was that you were weak/scared so I decided to put a small value bet of 1000. Calling for you is fine and you win a pot of 7,450.
Summary: With a limper & in middle position, a raise with AA is usually better than limping. A re-raise OOP preflop is usually better than flat-calling a TAG on the puck. A value bet on the turn is usually better than checking. Due to the set-up flop & you playing scared when I called, I ended up donking off a lot of chips to you.