Politics

Meistro

Anyone here interested in politics? Over the last year or so I have become increasingly more active in Canadian politics and have become a Libertarian (with a big L :P). How about you? What are your political views / leanings?

Milo

Small "L" Libertarian here. Dfinitely believe in the concept of a (severely) limited government.

Nooner81

My view is that people go into politics because they honestly believe that they can make a difference.

Unfortunatetly that gets thrown completely out the window when they realize that politics is just "If you scratch my back I'll scratch yours".

Too often it seems as though politicians care about is seeing their name in the paper and doing whatever it takes to remain in office. ie: Broken campaign promises.

I believe that people should have a lot more say in what goes on in our country and that our whole political landscape and legal system should be revamped.

Milo

Good luck with that, Nooner. Look what happened in Ontario when they tried to modernize the system. Any progressive changes that will have the effect of giving the electorate a bigger voice in the running of a given jurisdiction will be opposed by ALL 3 major parties. Hell, the NDP opposed MMP, even though they stood to be the major beneficiary of that system. No the only way change is coming is with a massive break-down in some part of the current system (lets say a bankrupt CPP), or a slow education process of the next large voting bloc.

BBC Z

MMP Failed in Ontario because the only person running ads for it was Elections Ontario and they have to ensure that anything they say is neutral..

Ergo, the majority of voters didn't understand what the hell it was.

The best part of the ontario elections was the complete mismanagement of the green party, whose sole campaign issue should have been MMP (THEY would have actually had seats instead of nothing).. and they didn't even mention it.

Nooner81

BBC is bang-on. My wife was in charge of a polling station. She said that the voters were completely unaware about the MMP never mind the fact that they didn't understand it.

As for change in our legal system I would like to see sentences that fit the crime. I am sick and tired of reading about pedophiles getting a slap on the wrist for raping our children. As well I would like to see much tougher sentences for people who use any kind of weapon during an offense.

Secondly I would like to see pot and prostitution legalized.

And last but not least I would like to see people hanged for stealing peoples money in phony investment scams. They should hang those bastards in the town squares.

ReefAquarium

Nooner81 wrote: »

As for change in our legal system I would like to see sentences that fit the crime. I am sick and tired of reading about pedophiles getting a slap on the wrist for raping our children. As well I would like to see much tougher sentences for people who use any kind of weapon during an offense.

Tougher sentencing doesn't deter crime.

Secondly I would like to see pot and prostitution legalized.

Legalizing pot would be a good thing. Prostitution is legal in Canada.

And last but not least I would like to see people hanged for stealing peoples money in phony investment scams. They should hang those bastards in the town squares.

Tougher sentencing doesn't deter crime.

DrTyore

As a John Howard Society drone, I'd just like to say

Thanks ReefAquarium

Mark

stpboy

I really can't see any good reason to legalize pot? If you tell me it's so that the government can tax it and that we'll somehow see a benefit from said taxes then I think that's just asenine.

The way I see that working is that they tax marijuana and then put a portion of the money into drug rehab programs. A portion being 1% if we're lucky.

Now c'mon, everyone come on and tell me that pot isn't addictive, it isn't a gateway drug, it's worse then alcohol, etc.

stp

DrTyore

stpboy wrote: »

Now c'mon, everyone come on and tell me that pot isn't addictive, it isn't a gateway drug, it's worse then alcohol, etc.

stp

Let's not forget the ever-popular

"Honestly, I drive better after I've smoked up... I'm more relaxed and avoid road rage"

Mark

Kristy

Watch me make some friends...

Chronic pot smoking is such a filthy thing to do. I feel violent when someone argues that it is in any way good for you or even ok.

Milo

Wait a minute. I agree with Kristy? Either her sarcasm button is broke, or mine is . . . (ducks in anticipation)

Nooner81

Tougher sentencing doesn't deter crime.

I am not talking about sentencing being a deterrent. I am talking about punishment fitting the crime. Pedophiles, rapists and violent offenders are free to walk the streets after serving short sentences while their victims suffer for the rest of their lives.

A judge in St Thomas just sentenced a man to 4 1/2 years in prison for molesting his child which he posted on a website for pedophiles. As far as I am concerned he has forfeited his right to ever exist anywhere but a prison.

The problem with our system is that sentences are too lenient and criminals are set free to rape & assault innocent people time and time again.

Milo

Pedophiles should never get out. Period. The damage they do is often times beyond measure, both emotionally and financially. As for the U.S. approach, I do not think that tougher sentencing is necessarily the answer either.

Kristy

watch me make more friends:

I read something that said that it is some sort of a mental/chemical issue that can be resolved. If that is the case and an individual is proven to be 'cured' then I believe they should be reintegrated to society. Otherwise let them rot.

Don't forget the systems primary focus should always be rehabilitation where plausible.

Milo

Sorry Kristy, but "the system's" primary function is the protection of the society in general. That is why punishment comes first. As for any "cure", what guarantee is there that the person in question would continue to take their meds. There are innumerable cases of bipolar citizens who go off their meds because of how lethargic it makes them feel, etc., usually with tragic results for themselves. Are you really suggesting we, as a society, take that chance with our kids. You first.

Kristy

I'm sadly underinformed on this, but I believe that most mental health meds take time to build to effective levels and also to leave ones system.

If the treatment is in pill form then couldn't a regular blood test ensure that one was taking them?

and your first and second sentences do not conjoin in any logical way.

Kristy

ok, I was in bed and this was still bothering me...

If you were chosing someone on the forum prone to blind distaste or hatred....I'd have to make the short list...but in this instance I realize that rage I'd feel towards someone who did something so horrific is essentially wasted energy that will not prevent or protect -and that is my desire.

I'm not advocating that just anyone be let free, and I'd certainly support a system that was tough to the point of gtd success, I agree we should not gamble when it comes to the saftety of children...EVER

and I'm a little pissed off that you've incorrectly twisted my words to imply that I might.

with all those precursors, I think your response is a weak cop out. I'm sick of the redneck "throw everyone in jail and lose the key" mentality. If we as a society are not actively seeking a positive resolution, whenever and wherever possible, then we have failed as a civilization

Whether we CAN ever help these sick individuals is not something I have an answer to, but the point is that I'm certain that we must always try.

Milo

You are correct, the phrasing of the first two sentences was inelegant at best. Allow me to rephrase. Convicted criminals should be punished for their crimes before rehabilitation commences. This delay could be as little as a day, or indefinite. In my view it would depend on the criminal's willingness to change. If they want to get their lives in order, I am all for helping them do that, but the effort has to come from them.
I was NOT trying to imply anything about ÿour words, nor was I trying to twist their meaning. If you (or anyone) got that I apologize. I guess you need as much work figuring out my sarcasm gauge as I do yours.
As for the meds you mention yes, they generally do have a
"lag" factor between onset and withdrawl. But that merely switches the issue from one of monitoring the taking of the meds to monitoring their continued usage (i.e. blood tests). In both cases the onus is on society to ensure these thing are being done, rather than the individual in question. As a person with libertarian leanings, I am big on personal responsibility. And I agree with you that rehabilitation is much more preferrable to incarceration. But I believe the onus should rest with the individual convict to demonstrate that they are serious about this process.
I do not think this makes me a "throw away the key" type redneck. I abhor the sort of "zero-tolerance" crap that seems to seep into every nook and cranny of our lives these days. Sadly there are some people who either cannot, or will not, be helped. These people are a danger to society, and in some cases to themselves, and should be incarcerated permanently.
But that does not mean I think they should just be abandoned in jail. I am not devoid of compassion for the truly sick. As for the failure of our society, I agree with your comments in this regard. The discussion of whether or not we have reached that point yet is a whole different thread that I am not prepared to start just yet.