Fallsview Ruling?

blackmagicz

Up at fallsview this weekend playing 5/5 fishhunt...and this comes up, now I don't know if I was in the wrong as I always do the same thing when going in for a raise.

Anywho UTG makes it 25 to go I am in MP and announce raise (I am sitting directly infront of the dealer seat 5. So my cards are in front of my stack I start to count out my raise behind my cards. I have QQ and I am going to make it 75 to go. So I grab 50 and reach back and grab another 25 to add to the stack before I make my forward motion past my cards.

The dealer right away throws back 25 announcing it is a min raise?? Now the floor is called and agrees with the dealer as I reached back to my stack to take more chips so I can only do the minimum.

Now obviously I should have clearly announced my bet amount, but I was under the impression if there is no forward motion I have not committed any chips into the pot so I can do whatever I want with my chips behind my cards as long as they don't pass the "invisible plain" or it is not obvious I have put chips in and I am trying to put more in after the fact.

Can I get some help on this one. Thanks!

13CARDS

As in most situations regarding string bets, it is virtually impossible to "re-create" the scenario 100% accurately once the floor has been called over (neither the dealer nor the players will be able to do so!). So, unless there is obvious reason to rule otherwise, the floor should backup the call of the dealer; the dealer was there to witness the scenario and is in control of the game. As the dealer is seeing lots and lots of wagers (bets, raises, calls, etc.), their first instinct/reaction to what the bet is is almost always the right one.

blackmagicz

Thanks for the clarification. Next time I will divide out my chips on top of my stack to prevent confusion as obviously doing it on the felt is construde as a string bet...lol

g2

blackmagicz wrote: »

So I grab 50 and reach back and grab another 25 to add to the stack before I make my forward motion past my cards.

If you had to reach back it sounds like you've already made a forward motion.

/g2

blackmagicz

g2 wrote: »

If you had to reach back it sounds like you've already made a forward motion.

/g2

As I was saying the chips did not pass my cards which were in front of my stack. I was counting them out behind my cards. I reached into my stack to take more chips, that is when I was told it was a string bet as a moved the entire 75.00 together passed my cards.

zunni74

How I avoid this (in case you were interested) is I say raise, count out the existing bet and move that forward (so you've paid the call). Then put my raise together and then out in a single motion. You have stated raise so they know more is coming, and the single motion with the raise will never get you in trouble in terms of what's in vs. what's not.

I'm torn on your action. I can see the dealers point since you had a min raise in one hand. On the other hand, you were still behind your cards.

g2

Was the 50 in your hand or on the table when the dealer said string bet?

/g2

jpajamas

How to perform a raise:
a) Clearly announce "I raise." "raise" is also acceptable.
b) Announce how much you are going to make it.
c) Move said amount of chips forward. Do not splash the pot.
See how easy poker is! If you cannot handle this, play online, or go play slots.
This public service announcment brought to you by the Society for the preservation of sarcasm in poker forums. Save the Donkeys!

blackmagicz

I guess I am not making myself clear. I was sitting in seat 5...directly facing the dealer. I announced RAISE. I began to count out my chips. I went and just happened to have 50 available, i moved it to behind my cards, INFRONT of my chip stack (so there was space between my stacks and the cards where I placed the original 50. I then proceeded to take an addtional 25 from my stack.

Then I MOVED the entire stack forward. This is where the dealer then called it a string bet and made me MIN RAISE.

The issue I had here is I did not make a forward motion being any chips going past my cards which technically is breaking the "betting plain"

I do not splash pots and I always do the exact same thing....so I wanted to know why this time was any different. It is my understanding that a bet is not in the pot until it goes past the betting plain (IE some casinos have a betting line)

Thanks

g2

blackmagicz wrote: »

I went and just happened to have 50 available, i moved it to behind my cards, INFRONT of my chip stack

It may not have crossed the betting line, but it sounds like the dealer called that a forward motion. I'd have to have seen it to determine otherwise. In other words, if I was the floor I would have backed up the dealer, since he saw it.

/g2

jpajamas

Save yourself some grief, and announce your amount.

BlondeFish

I usually raise silently by first counting out chips in FRONT of my cards then placing them towards the pot in one motion. I have never had any dealer call a string raise on me.

It seems that the dealer interpreted your first $50 as being in the pot already, so your reaching back for more chips was considered a string raise. A dealer is responsible for calling string raises, so I agree with 13CARDS' reasoning. Next time you play af Fallsview, you may want to show a floor person how you raise to prevent future problems.

blackmagicz wrote: »

I always do the same thing when going in for a raise.
:
So I grab 50 and reach back and grab another 25 to add to the stack before I make my forward motion past my cards.

blackmagicz

Thanks for the insight everyone, I guess I just have to be more careful. It was just really odd because I have never had that problem anytime I have played ever.

Cheers