PLO question
How big of a draw do you need in PLO to get your money in. I limped in preflop. I don't have the history but my hand was KK 53 double suited. Flop brought 2 4 Q giving me the 2nd nut flush draw and an open ended straight draw. Do you start pushing like a monkey now or wait?
Comments
You are not drawing to the nutflush and your straight draw is somewhat vulnerable.
Did you have position?
You might want to pot it from late but otherwise check and call the flop if it's not too expensive.
The only card I would feel comfortable hitting is the Ace for the wheel.
In Omaha you want the nuts - so you can bet when you get it. If you hit your K high flush and some one plays back at you - you likely have to fold.
The advantage of your flop is you have an overpair, open-ended str8 draw and flush draw. So, if the pot is big enough and you have position bet the pot if it is limped around to you. Hopefully you can take away the odds from anyone who is on just a flush or str8 draw.
The goal will be to take down the pot right here; or get rid of those on the draw and keep those with 2 pair or a set.
Once again:
With KK35;
You are playing: KK K3 K5 35 - there is only one of those hands that I would choose to play preflop.
Watching your opponents is also very important... would someone slowplay top set here (foolish IMO)? Anytime you pot bet it, not only does that re-open the betting, but they can now fire back at you with three times the size of your bet... on a non-made hand, I'd probably take the free card. I like to bet when I have a hand rather than chase (unless I have a ridiculous number of outs say, AA67 2x suited on a board of A54 with two of my suit).
Mark
It was checked to me so I potted it. Being an omaha newbie for cash games I got played back by the BB and repushed. I did buy in short stacked so it wasn't that big a deal. Turn was an A river was 8d and my king high flush did take it down.
I know you want to have the nuts or be drawing to the nuts which is why I asked this question. My omaha experience is generally heads up SNG's which again is a whole different game.
A: That's not very loose.. that's average in PLOM... the game we played at Pirahna? I was shocked at how tight everyone was..
As for your getting re-potted, do you recall what your opponent had?
Mark
Assuming he has QQxx and your flush draw is good, you have 6 striaght outs (plus 2 more that make a flush), 2 king outs, and 8 more outs that make a flush, so max of 16 outs (likely a bit less if he has a flush blocker). If he has one flush blocker you are just under a 50/50 so potting /calling the reshove is the correct play unless somehow you are extremely deep stacked and do not wish to gamble in at best a coin flip situation. Given you said you bought in short this should not be an issue.
If he has QQ and a nut flush draw, well you are not in great shape, but it is not hopeless (ie:3-1 against), but that's pretty unlikely.
Getting it all in here is fine. If you pot, get reraised and have a couple callers before you then you have to assume your flush draw is likely dead and there is also a good chance your straight draw shares outs so a fold is possible (though pot is much much bigger as well). Heads up it's gambling time Omaha style once you pot bet.
He could have Ad-xd-A or an Ad with a pair of 3's or 6's with one of the pair being a diamond as well, so your outs aren't as good as you hope, but you could be ahead.
When I have draws (unless they are too the nuts) I like to try and keep the pot small and slowly build it.
I don't want to have to face a large pot raise on the turn with one card to come.
Mark
The easiest time to steal a pot in PLO8 is on the Flop and IMO is really the best time to make this attempt.
If you get re-potted your decision is easy - FOLD.
You will have to make bets in PL08 from position on occasion without a hand or else the other players will quickly realize you only bet with a made hand.
You dont really care for a free card - because there arent too many free cards that will help you.
There is only one free card that gives you the nuts - and if some one plays back at you - you are likely being freerolled.
The card that will give you the best hand is an A or K. With the A you have the wheel - but you are likely playing against someone who is freerolling to a better str8 or nut flush.
In either of these scenarios it is correct to fold a nut str8 in PLO.
The only thing you have going for you in this hand is your POSITION.
So use it and fire a pot bet on the flop.
This really is not the type of board where he is likely to be freerolled. A board of AK10 with a flush draw and you have QJ and nothing else - that's a good chance of being freerolled. A board of Q24? Umm, not so much unless opponent has AA35 with the ace high flush draw which ok fine in that very, very specific situation you are near dead.
His position is useful here, though more information on the opponent would help (though again not so important if his remaining stack is small enough to call regardless). A lot of tight nitty nut peddlers will call pot bets with a nut flush draw, but will definitely check raise or bet out with QQ, so if I see a pot size bet called by a guy who has basically no aggression in his game then a flush hits and he comes out betting I am pretty sure my K flush is not good.
Position also allows one to take a card on the turn as well potentially if it is a blank and flop bet is just called.
Again, the only card on the turn that gives you confidence is an A or K...
I would rather bet it and take it down. If I am repotted, I know my KKs are no good, and I am not drawing on a pot - to 4 Aces or a K. Omaha 8 is an Ace rich game. With this many players in the pot - my guess is that there arent many left out there.
I dont think AA35 double suited is that big of a fluke in this situation (and that is only to be scooped).
If some already has the A3 you are only drawing to half the pot here - and you dont even know if your hand is good enough to get the top half.
Again - one of the (possibe, but not likely) 4 aces makes you confident.
Implied odds arent the same in Omaha as they are in Hold'em if you hit the Ace of your suit you can't expect to be paid off by a Q or J flush. The most likely outcome is you pay some one else's A high flush off with the King. If you arent going to pay it off - that means you arent willing to bet with it - so why play it?
Omaha 8 is a game of the nuts and "ands" - At showdown you should be able to say I have the "Nut" Flush and some sort of low.
Never chase half the pot and never chase non-nut flushes. Cardinal rule.
I don't think this is high/low
Mark
People play Omaha still
Disregard - previous.
Hmm...
Off the cuff - I think either betting or checking and taking a free card is good.
Anyone with QQ on the flop should be betting out - especially since you limped in preflop- therefore providing no safety to someone in EP with QQ that you will raise (I would bet out either way - but if you were the original raiser preflop, with QQ I may check it to you).
Considering the circumstances they would likely check QQ if they also have the flush draw.
Otherwise - they should bet out to proctect their set.
I would bet this out...hoping to take it down, but confident in playing against a caller. Cautious to a check-raise - but you still have position.