Donk Reasoning - Yes this is a bad beat story :

MetroMetro
in Online Poker
So I decide to play 30 mins of poker before bed...

When I get the following hand

PokerStars Game #8317221755: Hold'em No Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2007/02/06 - 22:45:20 (ET)
Table 'Kale' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: verdi 31 ($31.65 in chips)
Seat 2: pschuurm ($62.55 in chips)
Seat 3: kizza_om ($78.35 in chips)
Seat 4: MetroTNORTH ($106.20 in chips)
Seat 5: pulless ($51.60 in chips)
Seat 6: beeds boys ($30 in chips)
verdi 31: posts small blind $0.25
pschuurm: posts big blind $0.50
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to MetroTNORTH [6d 6c]
kizza_om: folds
MetroTNORTH: raises $1.50 to $2
pulless: calls $2
beeds boys: folds
verdi 31: calls $1.75
pschuurm: folds
*** FLOP *** [Qs 6s Kh]
verdi 31: checks
MetroTNORTH: bets $3
pulless: raises $8.50 to $11.50
verdi 31: folds
MetroTNORTH: raises $8.50 to $20
pulless: raises $29.60 to $49.60 and is all-in
MetroTNORTH: calls $29.60
*** TURN *** [Qs 6s Kh] [7c]
*** RIVER *** [Qs 6s Kh 7c] [Ks]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
MetroTNORTH: shows [6d 6c] (a full house, Sixes full of Kings)
pulless: shows [Kd Qc] (a full house, Kings full of Queens)
pulless collected $102.70 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $105.70 | Rake $3
Board [Qs 6s Kh 7c Ks]
Seat 1: verdi 31 (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 2: pschuurm (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: kizza_om folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: MetroTNORTH showed [6d 6c] and lost with a full house, Sixes full of Kings
Seat 5: pulless showed [Kd Qc] and won ($102.70) with a full house, Kings full of Queens
Seat 6: beeds boys (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)


In the chat box after - he types in "Sorry - I thought you had AK."

Fair enough, then I think and respond.

"If you thought I had AK why did you call pre-flop."

His response - "I hoped to flop two pair on you...."


Well, just another day at the office :)

Comments

  • HobbesHobbes
    TNORTH wrote: »
    In the chat box after - he types in "Sorry - I thought you had AK."

    Fair enough, then I think and respond.

    "If you thought I had AK why did you call pre-flop."

    His response - "I hoped to flop two pair on you...."


    Well, just another day at the office :)

    Gotta luv these players most of the time.
    He cold called with a hand that he thought was dominated HOPING to catch 2pr. :)
  • DrTyoreDrTyore
    WEll, hang on now...

    If he thought that the hero would pay him off to the extent that he did on AK, implied odds are through the roof. I've had a player whom I can only assume respects my game put my on a dominating hand, and called hoping to hit as well with the logic of "Well, if I do hit, I can really milk him!"

    Allow me to use Zithal's analogy... in a 70/30 situation (i.e. dominated hand), it's the equivalent of rolling either a one or a six one a single dice. Yes, he's behind, and he's calling $2 into a pot of $2.75 right now (about 1.4:1 on his $) where he needs about 3:1 on his money. Given the crazyness inherent in these low limit games, any caller will make the pot $4.75 (- his $2, for 2.4:1 - getting closer).

    He really wouldn't need to win much on a flop in that scenario, he has position on you also - any continuation bet pretty much makes his implied odds close (NOTE: I didn't do the math, I'm tired also, and probably mostly speaking outta my butt - am I way off here?).

    Now, the one flaw here is he's hoping that you hit when he hits bigger, and I"m sure the math makes this a stupid call and my arugment moot. However, he may have thought AK on the flop? Unless he specified he had you on AK pre-flop...

    Mark
  • ChrisWinsorChrisWinsor
    rofl that's funny. I love players like that, they feel terrible when they put a bad beat on someone.

    What's the deal with the min raise :( that's so ugly
  • MetroMetro
    DrTyore wrote: »
    WEll, hang on now...

    If he thought that the hero would pay him off to the extent that he did on AK, implied odds are through the roof. I've had a player whom I can only assume respects my game put my on a dominating hand, and called hoping to hit as well with the logic of "Well, if I do hit, I can really milk him!"

    Allow me to use Zithal's analogy... in a 70/30 situation (i.e. dominated hand), it's the equivalent of rolling either a one or a six one a single dice. Yes, he's behind, and he's calling $2 into a pot of $2.75 right now (about 1.4:1 on his $) where he needs about 3:1 on his money. Given the crazyness inherent in these low limit games, any caller will make the pot $4.75 (- his $2, for 2.4:1 - getting closer).

    He really wouldn't need to win much on a flop in that scenario, he has position on you also - any continuation bet pretty much makes his implied odds close (NOTE: I didn't do the math, I'm tired also, and probably mostly speaking outta my butt - am I way off here?).

    Now, the one flaw here is he's hoping that you hit when he hits bigger, and I"m sure the math makes this a stupid call and my arugment moot. However, he may have thought AK on the flop? Unless he specified he had you on AK pre-flop...

    Mark


    I am just not a fan of calling with KQ to a EP or MP raise - mainly because the opponent could have AK, AA, KK,QQ all hands I am dominated in. Even if you do out flop you are still in danger of being beaten on the Turn or River by a higher two pair and your two pair plays into the opponents str8 possibilities.

    KQ is just a hand I generally ditch from 4x bb raises in EP or MP - unless it is one of the maniac players or I have good reason to think the player would dump a large quantity of chips to me with only TPTK.

    If you go by simply using the math as dictated - than why wouldnt I always call a raise with hands like J-8, Q-9, K-10? If you are only calling with KQ that will represent only a small leak - but if you are always calling behind 70/30 - that represents a huge leak.
  • DrTyoreDrTyore
    Just to clarify...

    I"m not saying this is a GOOD move.. but it is one that isn't all that uncommon, nor is it the WORST move I've ever seen.... I'll try to find a hand history for a QQ hand I played the other night where it had me staggered....

    Mark
  • MetroMetro
    I know it isnt that uncommon - and that is why I find these games particularly profitable - you find a lot of people playing hands they wouldnt/shoudnt in a full table.

    If I come in with AK and he comes in with KQ I will get a bet/call on flop, turn and river. In fact, I would say against 30% of the players you would get called down with any TP regardless of the kicker.
  • Jays_06Jays_06
    That is just an awful beat. I know there are players that go in thinking that if they hit the flop they can milk you for everything but to go into a hand when u think ur DOMINATED is just silly

    i could never make that call myself. calling when u think ur dominated. unfortuantley there are always players like this and you just have to keep playing solid poker.

    and i found it hilarious when he said sorry haha i love when people say that.
    except when they say it to me after i just got burnt.
  • 13CARDS13CARDS
    Jays_06 wrote: »
    That is just an awful beat. I know there are players that go in thinking that if they hit the flop they can milk you for everything but to go into a hand when u think ur DOMINATED is just silly

    i could never make that call myself. calling when u think ur dominated. unfortuantley ??? there are always players like this and you just have to keep playing solid poker.

    and i found it hilarious when he said sorry haha i love when people say that.
    except when they say it to me after i just got burnt.


    This entire post made me laugh.
  • DrTyoreDrTyore
    PFffffffffffffft...

    A dominated hand won!? Pshaw! Check this s#it out...

    FullTiltPoker Game #1801077305: Table Cavaliers - $0.25/$0.50 - No Limit Hold'em - 5:56:31 ET - 2007/02/15
    Seat 1: PretenderTUW ($56.60)
    Seat 2: Moist Socket ($43.75)
    Seat 3: mindyboston ($34.60)
    Seat 4: HakanTurkey ($58.75), is sitting out
    Seat 5: B MIK ($91.85)
    Seat 6: PokerDandy ($49.95)
    Seat 7: catch016 ($47.50)
    Seat 8: petridsh ($43.10)
    Seat 9: DrTyore ($44.50)
    petridsh posts the small blind of $0.25
    DrTyore posts the big blind of $0.50
    The button is in seat #7
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to DrTyore [7d 7c]
    PretenderTUW folds
    Moist Socket folds
    mindyboston folds
    B MIK calls $0.50
    PokerDandy raises to $2
    catch016 folds
    petridsh folds
    DrTyore calls $1.50
    B MIK folds
    *** FLOP *** [7s Td As]
    DrTyore checks
    PokerDandy bets $4
    DrTyore raises to $15
    PokerDandy raises to $40.50
    DrTyore raises to $42.50, and is all in
    PokerDandy calls $2
    DrTyore shows [7d 7c]
    PokerDandy shows [Kh Ad]
    *** TURN *** [7s Td As] [Qs]
    *** RIVER *** [7s Td As Qs] [Jc]
    DrTyore shows three of a kind, Sevens
    PokerDandy shows a straight, Ace high
    PokerDandy wins the pot ($86.75) with a straight, Ace high
    DrTyore is sitting out
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot $89.75 | Rake $3
    Board: [7s Td As Qs Jc]
    Seat 1: PretenderTUW didn't bet (folded)
    Seat 2: Moist Socket didn't bet (folded)
    Seat 3: mindyboston didn't bet (folded)
    Seat 4: HakanTurkey is sitting out
    Seat 5: B MIK folded before the Flop
    Seat 6: PokerDandy showed [Kh Ad] and won ($86.75) with a straight, Ace high
    Seat 7: catch016 (button) didn't bet (folded)
    Seat 8: petridsh (small blind) folded before the Flop
    Seat 9: DrTyore (big blind) showed [7d 7c] and lost with three of a kind, Sevens
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