Would you have played this different?

C_Toni

PokerStars Game #7826980521: Hold'em No Limit ($1/$2) - 2007/01/08 - 03:16:56 (ET)
Table 'Hersilia II' 6-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: darigaaz79 ($126.70 in chips)
Seat 2: LessMurphy ($194 in chips)
Seat 3: dung nhi ($83.55 in chips)
Seat 5: C_Toni ($170 in chips)
Seat 6: DreamWevvr ($236.50 in chips)
dung nhi: posts small blind $1
C_Toni: posts big blind $2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to C_Toni [Qh Jd]
DreamWevvr: raises $4 to $6
darigaaz79: folds
LessMurphy: folds
Mr. Gutshot joins the table at seat #4
dung nhi: folds
C_Toni said, "shouldnt have even called the flop"
C_Toni: calls $4
*** FLOP *** [5h 8h Ah]
C_Toni: bets $6
DreamWevvr: calls $6
*** TURN *** [5h 8h Ah] [7h]
C_Toni: bets $30
DreamWevvr: calls $30
*** RIVER *** [5h 8h Ah 7h] [Kc]
C_Toni: bets $128 and is all-in
DreamWevvr: calls $128
*** SHOW DOWN ***
C_Toni: shows [Qh Jd] (a flush, Ace high)
DreamWevvr: shows [Jh Kh] (a flush, Ace high - King higher)
DreamWevvr collected $339 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $341 | Rake $2
Board [5h 8h Ah 7h Kc]
Seat 1: darigaaz79 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: LessMurphy (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: dung nhi (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: C_Toni (big blind) showed [Qh Jd] and lost with a flush, Ace high
Seat 6: DreamWevvr showed [Jh Kh] and won ($339) with a flush, Ace high

Irish31

Well in answer to your post, the answer is "Yes", I would have.


Short handed cash games, that hand isn't bad, but its not good either. What I tell people is that if you will play that hand on a raise (which you don't want to have to) you better be good enough to make it work.

With a flop like that, you only have one realistic flop that is going to beat you if the 4th Heart comes, and thats King of Hearts/X. Since he raised, as soon as that flop comes down, i'm putting him on the King of Hearts until he gives me reason to think otherwise.

When you made your flush on the turn and bet, and he called, and you bet big, you can all but muck the hand. You know hes not drawing to some offball straight flush, since he raised that really eliminates the likelyhood he has anyting lowish, and the best he could have is a mid-sized suited connector, but to call 30$ bet, hes either horrible or you are in trouble.

Either way, once the flop came and he call you to the river, you check it down and hope for a free view of his goods. For me, if the pot is 80$ here, on the river, if he bets anything more then 1/3 the pot, you have to fold.

If its only 1/3, depending on my read on him and his table image, I may call, but I certainly would not have done what you did. The only thing you can possibly, POSSIBLY put him on with this situation is Ax Th or Ax Jh, where he has top pair, big kicker and a drawing hand to boot.

Sometimes bad players will not release these hands in the face of a higher flush, but I wouldn't risk my stack on it.


Hope this helps


Jay

C_Toni

Thanks for your answer.

Btw this guy was a very loose player that was basically playing and pushing every hand and was caught numerous times with absolutely nothing.

actyper

If thats the case its better if you become the calling station. If he's pushing when he's bluffing, chances are if he's calling your bets, he has the goods.

Monteroy

This type of situation happens a lot in Omaha, namely the what can he call your bet with that you beat syndrome (often when you have K high flush or bottom set on a drawless board). Unless he is an utterly horrid player, the answer is usually nothing and thus the bet you made really has almost no value even when it wins.

This is a much easier hand to play when in position because often you can check the river and go to a showdown for free, but that was not the case here hence the very bad spot you were in.

The fact that he is a loose bluffer does not make this any easier since again you were out of position and never forced him to bluff if that is what he would do. A check /call on river praying you induced a bluff makes a lot more sense against a player like this then the shove which unless he is playing with his screen off he cannot really call unless he has you beat.

I am not saying this was an easy hand for you to play, in fact it was an ugly one. I know in Omaha when I sense this type of situation (ie : non nut draw )and I am out of position I try best to keep the pot small and I do not get too attatched to my hand. Holdem it is a bit trickier since non nut draws are much more likely to be good.