one of those days......
I just want to ask all you some guestion.....
I think i am average player,
home games, i win 80% of the time.
I often win at casino (3/6 games)
my cash game online is been good, but my problem is, one badbeat, my bankroll is bust.
online tournment, i have win some freerolls(1500 players), 8th on $20000 freeroll, won the aussie qualitifer (1500 Player), has got deep in most of the tournment i play.
yesturday, I went to a poker club in toronto, and got my ass hand it to me
it's so bad, that during the tournment or cash game, i didn't even win one hand......that's how bad it is.
funny thing is, some player there, i see as fishes......but i can't even win 1 hand..........
During Tournment, most of hand i dealt is not playable. 52,28,T3.
I try to fight the pot with hands like T9, 86, 69, but flop is all face card in a raising pot.......so i release then quickly.
try to bluff with preflop raising on weak hand, but reraising back to me, so i fold......
last hand, got AK suited. but got knock out by pocket 7 with a 7 on the flop.
Cash games 1/2 NL.
it didn't last long
I dealt A 10 suited. raise to $10
one caller, everybody folded.
flop A6A
bet $10 got called
turn 4
since he didn't reraise me, i figure he has weak ace, or 6 with high kicker.
i went allin
he has A4.....come on man.......
river is Q
so i need some advise, this has a big dent on my confidence regarding poker.
general rules, is eaiser to win at the casino or at the private poker club?
I think i am average player,
home games, i win 80% of the time.
I often win at casino (3/6 games)
my cash game online is been good, but my problem is, one badbeat, my bankroll is bust.
online tournment, i have win some freerolls(1500 players), 8th on $20000 freeroll, won the aussie qualitifer (1500 Player), has got deep in most of the tournment i play.
yesturday, I went to a poker club in toronto, and got my ass hand it to me
it's so bad, that during the tournment or cash game, i didn't even win one hand......that's how bad it is.
funny thing is, some player there, i see as fishes......but i can't even win 1 hand..........
During Tournment, most of hand i dealt is not playable. 52,28,T3.
I try to fight the pot with hands like T9, 86, 69, but flop is all face card in a raising pot.......so i release then quickly.
try to bluff with preflop raising on weak hand, but reraising back to me, so i fold......
last hand, got AK suited. but got knock out by pocket 7 with a 7 on the flop.
Cash games 1/2 NL.
it didn't last long
I dealt A 10 suited. raise to $10
one caller, everybody folded.
flop A6A
bet $10 got called
turn 4
since he didn't reraise me, i figure he has weak ace, or 6 with high kicker.
i went allin
he has A4.....come on man.......
river is Q
so i need some advise, this has a big dent on my confidence regarding poker.
general rules, is eaiser to win at the casino or at the private poker club?
Comments
Good read, not the desired result. While you will win often with this, AT isn't that strong, and you'll oftern split (and he'll hit his 4 as well). Don't get upset that you don't win every hand - just make sure you get your money in good (and can afford to handle the swings as described above).
All depends on the players...
I had been playing tons of SNG's and a few MTT's and doing quite well. I usually play limit poker (2/4 3/6). I decided to get back into the NL cash after a long time away. I was playing 50NL and got killed. I actually regrouped, re evaluated what hands I was playing from where and tightened up large.
I went and played lots of 0.05/0.1 NL and killed the game and built my confidence up. I played at Rama on Saturday (1/2 NL) and would have done better but I got stacked early from a guy who called my $15 pfr with 8 4 off. He flopped the straight I turned a set of A's. The rest is history. I actually put him on the flush draw since he played a lot of suited semi connected cards. He would usually call 1 raise with almost any 2. These kinds of guys are dangerous because he could hit the 5 2 2 rainbow board even after a raise.
Live is a different beast and most live players are there for fun (in a casino at least). In a club they tend to be better players since they have found the club. Learn bankroll management as Beanie mentioned. Drop down stakes till you have the required bankroll or slow down until you save up the BR.
Good luck.
Excellent book on LLNL. Really opened my eyes to the thought processed needed in LLNL cash games.
i'll go back to the poker club tonight for another tournment and some cash game.
hopefully yesturday is just one of those day, nothing can go right for you......
i know i'm not the best, or consider myself a good player, but i think i can hold my own.
I can't even win a HAND yesturday, 2hr at tournment and 20 minute at cash games........ even if i got my ass kick again today, I just need to go back there. I couldn't even sleep yesturday....money is not the issue....but not even winning 1 hand......this is too much.
It's called variance. You need to figure this out, because if you're used to winning "80% of home games", that probably isn't sustainable. You can't win EVERY session. Sometimes you will lose, sometimes you will lose a lot. It's all one BIG session. When you're getting cold cards, sometimes you have to focus more on the money your aren't losing than trying to "make something happen".
This varies and I don't normally find it to be true. Usually you have 1 or 2 deep stacks (who are either good or really lucky, sometimes both) and a bunch of medium stacks.
Actually, my cash game is generally looser than my tournament game, primarily because I can reload. Your goal in a cash game is to stack your opponent, and tight play is not usually going to get paid off the same way. You need to play hands which are not as obvious if you want to get their entire stack.
Do NOT think of the chips as having a real value. Very few people can play properly when they are constantly thinking about the actual value of what they are playing for. Think about making correct decisions, make sure you have an adequate bankroll win or lose, and count your winnings (or losses) away from the table.
Live is definitely a different game than live, but limit and NL are VERY different. If you want to learn NL cash games, try NL cash games. Learning at limit will not prepare you for NL, in my opinion.
Only bluff the bluffable players, whether it's cash games or tournies. Bluffing in cash games (and stealing blinds) is an important part of the game while you wait for your bigger hands. It helps to pay for your laps while waiting, but it also provides an opportunity to hit some flops accidentally (when your bluffs don't work) as well as giving a looser image.
This is exactly the kind of game you want, isn't it?
Sorry to be so critical everyone - I guess I have a much different perspective...
Yay - some advice I can agree with. Adequately bankroll yourself, then relax and "ride the wave"...
2 good posts in a row. Redstar's point about finding out your own tells is actually a really good one. This is actually hard to uncover on your own. I've found the best way is to ask a few trusted friends (who you believe will actually tell you) after playing some home games with them, or have a buddy come along to play with you. It's really tough to notice them yourself...
Cheers
i just came back from the club
i'm getting out play that is for sure, although yesturday is definitly bad lucky day, today i did so so.
Tournment today is crazy
alot loose aggressive player
starting 5000 chips
i have AQ, raise the blind from 25 to 100. someguy in the middle position raise to 1000......called. flop raged (269 i think). i check, next guy check, then allin. follow by another allin......can't call so if fold.
win the next hand i win 2000 chip.
The game itself is crazy, can't really see the flop without invest half of my stack.......it's a game with raise, reraise, and reraise........ definily got out play there.
cash games: somewhat better then yesturday.
except this hand that crapple me.....
i have AJ raise to 10. everybody fold except 1 caller.
flop A39, i bet 30, he call
turn 7 i bet 30 he call
river Q, I check since he call me twice, he is got to have something....
he bet 20. i call(pot odds)
he has QQ in the hole......can't really put him on that hand. i totally put him on the wrong him........
after that i have 12 bux left, getting cold cards for the next two round,
then allin 6bux with A9 but run into KK flop is 88766........
I evalute myself after getting my butt kick(this time, i will admit no bad luck invole) I come to conclusion that i play too "passive" i
'm usually aggressive player, but getting overwhelm by mass aggressive players. i think one of the main difference with home games, seeing the flop is cheap. At the club, alot of chips invest before seeing the flop. my poker skill is somewhat useless, as i can do more after seeming the flop. time to learn new stuff.......
few question i need to ask you guys.
1) after you invest 30-50% of you chips in, and flop goes no where, you are up against 2 or 3 loose aggressvie player that could raise and reraise with anything, do you fold or do you bet. I fold because i have no balls.
2)after number 1 ,regardless cold cards or hot cards, you just not hitting the flop, you just invest another 40-50% of your chips to see the worthless flop. there definely no free or cheap cards at the game. then what do you do....
until i figure this out, i don't think i gonna continue going to that club, i'm just not good enough to play there.
3)after alot of cold cards, when you get something good, you are not hitting the flop (even cold cards are not hitting), at this time, i start loosing my aggression, and start playing very passively, how do you deal with that. bluff is not gonna work, because after i fold, when there is chance to see the showdown result, somebody has the cards that will not fold.
4)i try to get in there face, after short on stack , then i become passive, even with passive image , i make a big preflop raise, i get no repect, i think it's because they think they can out play me after the flop. I have weak hand (69,89,76)and of course flop is all face cards.... i feel i definely try everything in my level, how can i improve to next level?
Thanks for the advise
i actually thought of that, but i just couldn't have the balls
pay the 60 dollar buy in, kinda want to play longer....maybe that's my problem.
everybody get 5000 chip to start with.
another thing, i tend to play more safe, that is....i often stay away from colin flip situation, unless i can take the lost. the best hand i got is AJ, the entire tournment....... not sure that is strong enough to push allin.
I think you are confusing passive with tight. I'll call a lot of preflop raises from a passive player cause I know that I can push him off the hand later.
1. Beanie already mentioned this but if one bad beat eats up your bankroll you're playing outside your means, play at a level where you can manage the inevitable swings.
2. First of all AT is not that great but this comment really stood out for me:
since he didn't reraise me, i figure he has weak ace, or 6 with high kicker.
i went allin
So on an A-rag flop you put your opponent on A-rag and proceed to push? Ask yourself what you expect to happen when you push? A weaker hand will fold, a stronger hand will call, it's a no-win situation you could have avoided.
As with any hand it all depends, you need to consider more then just how much you have invested when deciding how to proceed with a hand (won't repeat it here but you can certainly search out the info)...and remember when your chips are in the middle, they are no longer your chips, don't get attached to them!!!!!
Remember most flops miss most people, you don't necessarily need to hit the flop to win a hand....that said it sounds like you need to work on post flop play and learn both how to read what your opponents have as well as figuring out what they think you have....were you the aggressor pre-flop then a flop of Q-6-3 comes down that misses you completely, a continuation bet may win the pot or get middle/small pairs out? Same situation but on a flop of Q-J-4 proceed with caution, this flop could give the other players a hand or a draw that will beat you...maybe this is too general but it sounds like you are just playing your cards?
I know when I started playing I was focused strictly on starting hands and position and I did ok but I was very weak post-flop...I didn't consider what people might call/raise with, I over-valued hands, I folded to a bet seeing monsters under the bed, I didn't maximize my draws (limit)...2 years later I think I'm much better but far from good...it was only through friends, reading, this community, reading, programs like Poker Tracker, and reading that allowed me to learn and analyze my game and improve...I hope you find the same success.
One last comment...it sounds like you're in a bit of a loose aggressive game....so I say tighten up
Although I can agree with Beanie's statement as a starting point you need to be able to switch gears during the game....you may start out looser but I think if you're in a game where the majority of players are loose and aggressive then you need to play the opposite of that and tighten up.
but I play mostly Limit so WTF do I know.
thanks for your help, and yes, i guess i'm still at the level of playing my cards.
one of the question about tighten up during loose aggressive tournment..... i find.... it boring, plus antes are catching up, I read supersystem I & II, didn't want to become bloomcorn's uncle ^^
another thing, during headup, I know both side can miss the flop, but in a ring tournment game with raising pot, you would make a bet with flop Q-6-3? say 2-3 still in?
I have to learn more about reading other players, and get my balls up, and post flop play technique.
i'm usualy play the sytle of "when getting best hand, search for 2nd best hand, and take all his chips. and also avoid losing all my chips when i have the 2nd best hand", that works really well at home games, but at poker club where alot good players. i find my tools are not working anymore. i really have to learn more about post flop play.
Care to do a book review? I haven't gotten it yet hoping Santa will bring it.
I thinking to go back on monday to try it one more time, i don't have to win, but at least i have to feel i have a chance to win it, otherwise i am wasting my money.
I did notice one thing about the club,,,alot of player are willing to go allin on middle or top pair.....sometimes after the flop, both are allin with nothing but Ace with high kicker, where my rules is don't go broke with just one pair, unless it's headup... but since they are so aggressive preflop, every hand is like headup, the field is very limited to 2- 3 players playing.
my original plan is to trap them when i have good hand, but flop has it way to miss me, and i have no ball to get in further......
I jsut brought the book on Harrington Vol 1 and 2. i wondering if i should read them first before go back in there.......
Big E, are you in toronto? if so, maybe you should come with me, i hope you win, and you can give me some advise on how i improve myself ^^
I'm a limit player, and not even a very good one
I have this very costly problem that my brain says fold and my mouth says call!
Harrington will help your NL tourney game for sure!!!
hahaha
i have exactly opposite problem
my brain say call, my mouth say fold.....when that happen, my card usually come, or has the best hand. but it's useless, since i folded.
tournment is 60dollar buy in
cash game is 1/2 NL