Friendly games & lending money?

esool

When I go to a poker game I always take more money then I am willing to lose, 50-100% more. My thinking is that it is better to have more then less. If I lose all of my main $$ but I feel that it was just a bad run or for any other reason I want to get back in I have the reserve $$ to do it. Also I am playing with "poker money" not real money. I have not had to reach for the reserve $$ in recent memory so it has not been a problem for me luckily.
Now what do you do when at a game with buddies and one of your friends busts out and has no more cash? I use to offer them $$ if I was up or still had lots of $$ in my pocket, but I do not do that any more.
My new program is to stay quiet. If they ask me straight out then I will lend it to them, if they don't, I mind my own business.
My thinking is this. I don't mind them coming back to win their own $$ back but I do not want them taking my cash in the process. This is just bad business.
I have one buddy that whenever one of our friends has bust out he hounds them to take some money from him so they can get back in the game. :shock:
Especially now that we play mainly tourny hold'em, I want to win! For the $$ but more so for the bragging rights :twisted: :shock:

What about you?

professor

I usually don't stake the other guys at the game. Many of the other guys will stake a player who busts out, and I'm glad they do. Their thinking is this -- he's gone broke once, so he's more likely to go broke again. I've seen guys get into someone's pocket for more than they brought to the game in the first place! It puts more money on the table in the hands of the guys who can hold onto it the least. Of course, you have to know that he's good for it by the end of the day.

Altogether a dangerous practice... If I go broke I can usually point to a beat or two, possibly a little tilt, and one or two horribly bad plays. When I start making those it's time to leave a half hour ago anyway.

ScottyZ

Whether or not to lend money is a very personal decision. It's really up to you if you want to lend money to people in a poker scenario.

In some cases (as with establishing the rules of the game), this may be better discussed *away* from the game. For example, if you find that one player is consitently asking you for loans, you might want to discuss this with him/her outside of the game. [Hopefully this is obvious, but if this is someone you would never talk to outside of the poker game, do not lend this person money.] Then, when it comes up in the heat of the moment at a game, you have at least previously established some kind of parameters or protocol to deal with the situation.


I rarely loan people money to play poker with. I'll *never* loan money

1. To someone I don't know well.

2. Without the expectation of getting paid back very quickly.

3. If I have a pre-arranged agreement (such as "don't lend each other money while we're in Vegas") with a friend.

4. If I don't feel good about it in any way, even if I just get a bad feeling with no (apperent) rational basis. This includes feeling like someone is pressuring me into it, any doubts about getting paid back, etc.


Why do I almost never lend money?

1. I always go out of my way myself to make sure I have enough money to play with when I sit down in a poker session. Why shouldn't you do the same? Also, why should I put the level of my own chips and/or pocket money at risk? Let's say I brought $200 to a 2-4 game, and I'm down $100 myself and you ask me to loan you $100. Obviously the answer is no. How about if I am even? The answer is still no, because there is the possibility that I will lose $100 within the next couple of hours, and then we're just in a time-shifted version of the previous case.

2. We are in a wonderous age of technology where there are probably ATM's withing short walking/driving distance of your game. If you counter this with the fact that you have no money in the bank, this does not motivate me to lend you money. As is (sadly) true in the real world, the more you need a loan, the less likely you are to get it.

3. Banks, credit card companies, etc. charge people money for giving loans. A person-to-person loan is more risky, therefore should also charge something (in fact, more than banks do) for use of the money. It normally ends up that either you make a "friendly loan" and get nothing in return, or you end up going into some kind of load sharking opertion. Neither of these apeals to me.

4. Back to poker, most people *grossly* underestimate the amount of money they will need for a session. I normally bring at least $500 to a 3-6 game, and $1,000 to 5-10. Of course, I don't expect to realistically lose (or win) as much as $500 in 3-6, but a swing of say $200 is not unreasonable. Am I going to be happy if I am down $200 in what apprear to be a juicy game and I only brough $250 with me? [Note: you do not have to physically bring all the money with you if you are taking advantage of point #2 and are willing to hit the ATM yourself.]

5. [Don't read this one if you're a bad player...] Generally, it is the bad players who are busting out much more than usual. This is not only because they play badly, but also because they usually don't bring enough money to the game (possibly due to the fact that they have some "goal" in mind that they want to lose at most $x). If a bad player learns that he/she cannot get a loan at the table, they may very well get some more money into the game; either immediately (by hitting the ATM), or next session they might decide to bring more money. Many players think that loaning fish money ("feeding the fish") will keep the fish in the game, or keep the fish happy. While this is probably somewhat true in the short term, I think that feeding the *game* (i.e. getting more money to the table overall) is more important in the long term.

Finally, I'd strongly suggest that you *never* allow rat-holing. If a player needs a loan (and manages to secure one), the money comes out of the lender's pocket, *not* his/her chips.

It's probably obvious to you that if you don't *give* many (or any) loans, you shouldn't expect to *get* any loans yourself. So if you're the type who often wants a loan, you had better be willing to give loans fairly libreally yourself. And conversely, if *I* ever ask you for a loan, you are perfectly justified in saying something like, "Take off, you hoser! I read that post you made on the poker forum..."

Note that all of this analysis is conditional on playing poker for stakes *that you care about*. If you are playing kitchen table poker with your friends for a $1 buy-in, then let the loans fly, and pass the Coca-Cola! 8)

ScottyZ

Jeremy

I never offer to lend money, but I try to only play in home games with honest people(I know, laugh if you must, but I did say TRY). That being the case, if someone asks me I will almost always lend it. Surprisingly, the majority of guys pay me back as soon as they see me next time, with no prompting.

djw

What about sponsoring someone, say in a tournament? Has anyone done this?

Jeremy

If someone is looking to sponsor someone, I am available

professor

How about making a last longer bet -- say $20 -- on a $60 buy-in tourney, and swapping 10% equity with the other guy?

Does that count?

Didn't think so.

Anyone want some of that for this Saturday's tourney?

Didn't think so.

Of course, big players get staked in big tourneys all the time. It'sjust that I don't know them.