B&M 2/4 Limit - Beatable?

Hey,

I'm going to Syracuse this weekend and will spend too many hours playing some limit holdem at Turning Stone. I am beating online .50/1 for about 2 BB/100. With all the extra rake, tokes, etc. is the B&M 2/4 beatable? What would the correct play be with all the fish & gamblers at the tables? Should I maybe play a little higher to reduce the rake effect?

Thanks!

Comments

  • Well since I didn't receive any replies here, I just had to wing it at Turning Stone. I played about 25 hours of 2/4 limit and ended up about $100. It took me a few hours to adjust to these types of players..wow! Gamblers, calling stations...unreal! I had some nasty bad beats...flopped the nut straight, raised all the way and some guy catches a river A for a boat...had my KK cracked by a guy calling all the way with 77 who catches a 7 on the river. But the times my hands did hold up I usually got paid off nicely. I can't beleive how many people play virtually every hand. It was fun though.

    On another note, Turning Stone has 3 new "Lightning Poker" tables. They are using them for $50 and $100 sit'n'gos. They are big 10 seat tables where each player has their own screen and one big screen in the middle. They had trouble getting games started but nonother than 2004 WSOP champion Greg Raymer was on hand as a promo. It was cool watching him play..he's a really nice guy and chatted everyone up...had the WSOP bracelet on too! He then got into a $2500 NL buyin regular game at the table next to me and I think he cashed out big!!

    Nice casino!
  • Sorry I didn't see this thread till today. I would play 4/8 at turning stone since the play is no different than 2/4 and the rake is the same. LOL Yes there are lots of gamblers and chasers that's what makes it great.

    You can beat the 2/4 despite everything mostly due to how fast I found the dealers there. You get in more hands there than any casino I've been to.
  • Thanks Joe...will definitely try the 4/8 next time.
  • You can beat the 2/4 despite everything mostly due to how fast I found the dealers there. You get in more hands there than any casino I've been to.

    Hands per hour doesn't tell you if a game is beatable, it could only make it more profitable.

    If it's your first few session ever, play 2/4, don't worry if it's beatable, focus on learning the flow of play, typical player types and how to handle your cards.
  • You cannot beat 2/4...ever, no way.
    Even if you do...you're still losing, unless time means nothing to you.
    Standing with a cup in your hand out front of the casino would make more than 2BB an hour.
  • josh, why do i picture you out front of a casino cup in hand with a placard reading "can't beat 2/4"? god that would be funny. haddon roxors!
  • BrickWall wrote: »
    Hey,

    I'm going to Syracuse this weekend and will spend too many hours playing some limit holdem at Turning Stone. I am beating online .50/1 for about 2 BB/100. With all the extra rake, tokes, etc. is the B&M 2/4 beatable? What would the correct play be with all the fish & gamblers at the tables? Should I maybe play a little higher to reduce the rake effect?

    Thanks!

    I don't think there are any winning 2/4 players with a statistically significant sample size.


    If they rake $4 per hand and $1 toke that means $400 + $100 is leaving the table every 100 hands..

    So that's 120 BB/100 hands leaving.
    If you win 10% of hands... you have to make over 12 BB /100 to show a profit....

    I don't think anyone with a sample size large enough to matter (30,000 hands) is beating 2/4

    If anyone on the forms is beating 2/4 or 2/5 with 30,000 or so hands I'd love to hear from you.

    Most people who can beat 2/4 or 2/5 move up to 4/8 or 5/10.

    If you're beating limit 2/4 or 2/5 long term I'd love to hear how you do it.

    I can't.
  • Your math sucks.

    You just have to play tight and be in a loose game to beat 2/4.
  • Your math sucks.

    LOL. Tough to argue with that...
  • Good thing there's a Bingo Hall in the back of Turning Stone.
    It has always baffled my why they play the 2-4 limit games in the poker room as opposed to the Bingo Hall where they belong.
  • Played 6 hours of 2/4 at Coquitlam in September to kill an afternoon...Started with a rack of singles ($100) and left with $410. Yes, lots of ATM's playing so just join crowd and get in on 95% of the hands and play till the river before folding when there isn't a lot of raises. With so many new players, just adjust to their play and chase the flushes and the straights along with them. It doesn't cost you too much and it is hours of stressless poker. I can't believe I even paid $2 or $4 for a pocket of say 3/7 offsuit but for another few bucks I'd end up with 3 7's or whatever. I folded after the flop quite often but when it only costs you $2 to see the flop most of the time, go for it...My advice...These recreational tables are all newbies and you have to adjust to their game....call, call, call, check, check, check...Patience is a virtue when you play these tables...and don't be lookin' for any adrenaline rushes...lol
  • Geez,

    As someone who plays a lot at the 2 - 4 level allow me to defend it a little.

    Can you beat it in the long term? Not likely no, which I understand was the question put forth in this post.

    However, I think that many of the players who complain about that fact, are not likely beating too many other games either.

    I play 2/4 because I can afford to. My life is pretty up and down at the moment, and does not always allow me to protect a bankroll for playing at the higher limits. Playing 2/4 does many things though. It allows me to comfortably practice a variety of poker skills, such as hand reading(made more difficult by the number of hands often in play), as well as my ability to calculate pot odds, and play in accordance. It also allows me to play some hands I might not otherwise, and practice my post flop play.

    Mostly it allows me to be playing poker at a level which is comfortable for me, and at which it is still possible to eke out some small but satisfying wins on any given day.

    I mean really, I bet noone ever asked A-Rod what he got paid in little league, but we all know where it got him.



    Cheers
  • BBC Z wrote: »
    Your math sucks.

    You just have to play tight and be in a loose game to beat 2/4.

    Yes my math does suck. 125 big bets per 100 hands will be leaving the table not 120.

    So the average player at a 10 player table will be paying 12.5 big bets in tips and rake per 100 hands.

    If you play tight and only win 5% of hands then you're paying about 6 BB/100 hands.

    If you're making 1 big bet an hour on average then that's about 3 big bets per 100 hands?


    ... it seem tough to win...No rake and no tip would make it easy but the rake seems too high.

    And it you were good enough to win you should probably be playing 5/10 to 10/20.
  • How much more difficult is B&M 5/10 vs. 2/4? I feel I have a pretty good grasp at limit...much more to learn of course but I am on the plus side over about 25,000 hands online. (insert snide comment here haddon) I am doing okay taking shots at 1/2 online...up a little but nowhere near enough hands to feel confident that I can beat it. Is B&M 5/10 similar to say online 1/2 or 2/4? I'd love to try some 5/10 at BCC this Christmas as I'll be in the area.
  • [QUOTE=BrickWall;102391 Is B&M 5/10 similar to say online 1/2 or 2/4? [/QUOTE]

    At Fallsview yes.
  • Thanks Whitehorse. That makes sense...more tourists & gamblers at Fallsview and many more grinders at Brantford? Is that right? Does Fallsview do limit as well as no-limit?
  • I havn't played at Brantford, I'd assume it's just as weak. If you're comfortable at 2/4 online you'll have no problem at 5/10 live and likely be surprised by just how loose/weak the game is.

    Fallsview normally has at least one limit game going. You can call ahead to check and get your name on the list. 905 371-7777. Good luck.
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