Do you bet this river

AcidJoe

I know people chase but do you bet the river in this instance when the 3rd flush card comes. BTW Jennifer's stats were VPIP 44 PFR 1 WTSD 43 W$SD 43 Post Flop Aggression .73

ational Velvet 10474709-48156 Holdem Limit $2/$4
the wasp is the dealer.
nevatlt posted small blind.
Jennifer21 posted big blind.
Game [48156] started with 9 players.
Dealing Hole Cards.
Seat 6 : Acidjoe has Jd Jc
Dikl called $2
DcHolliday folded.
ksubpar called $2
Acidjoe called $2 and raised $2
C-Note70 folded.
TerryEva folded.
the wasp folded.
nevatlt folded.
Jennifer21 called $2
Dikl called $2
ksubpar called $2
Dealing flop.
Board cards [3h 6s Jh]
Jennifer21 checked.
Dikl checked.
ksubpar checked.
Acidjoe bet $2
Jennifer21 called $2
Dikl folded.
ksubpar called $2
Dealing turn.
Board cards [3h 6s Jh 2s]
Jennifer21 checked.
ksubpar checked.
Acidjoe bet $4
Jennifer21 called $4
ksubpar folded.
Dealing river.
Board cards [3h 6s Jh 2s 9h]
Jennifer21 checked.
Acidjoe bet $4
Jennifer21 called $4 and raised $4
Acidjoe called $4
Showdown!
Seat 6 : Acidjoe has Jd Jc
Jennifer21 has 7h 2h
Jennifer21 has Flush J9732
Jennifer21 wins $44.75 with Flush J9732
Hand is over.

DrTyore

Do I bet the river?

Probably not, if my read says she's on a flush draw, the only hand that is going to call (or re-raise) is the one that beats me. I may miss a bet there, but you're in a position where you MUST call with top set, so just check it down...

Mark

SirWatts

Yes, you played it well. Sometimes you get checkraised by a flush but most of the time she'll pay you off with her 2nd pair or whatever.

AcidJoe

I'm beginning to feel betting here is just bleeding chips off. It seems lately that if I bet I'm beat and if it goes check/check I win. I just wanted other players opinions.

specialK

I think that checking behind is a mistake on that river card. Sometimes you do get C-R by the flush but most of the time that will turn out to be 2 pair or a lower set. If villain bets into you on the river you call.

moose

Heads up, you should bet. 3 way check/call.

DrTyore

I'm really not sure why you'd bet?

I mean, the way everything has been going down, I can only assume that the person is on a flush draw.... I mean, let's look at it this way...

A: She starts in the BB, and it's one bet to her - she could have a decent range of hands here, "defending" her BB.

B: The flop comes down with a straight and a flush draw, jack high, hero bets and gets two callers. At this point, I can't put anyone on J-x since I can account for three of them, and they would probably raise it. Another set should be raising as well to deter the draws, and an over pair (AA/KK/QQ) would have re-raised preflop. Maybe 10-10 or 9-9 is there, but I doubt it.

C: Turn completes the straight possibility, Hero bets, and I agree with it - see where I'm at. It gets rid of one guy, but not the other. I find that in Limit, most people will call the "cheap" flop bet but will fold to the turn bet anyways.

Horrible card, you have top set on a board with a potential straight and a potential flush. You've done everything to prevent draws now, and River bets (IMO) are for one of two reasons: get more money when you know you're winning or bluff them off. This person checks once again, giving you the chance to minimize your losses.

I stand by my original statement that the only hand that's going to call your bet (or re-raise) is the one that beats you.

Mark

ScoobyD

I stand by my original statement that the only hand that's going to call your bet (or re-raise) is the one that beats you.

I disagree. The opponent is very loose and quite passive. This opponent is calling down with any pair here. A3, A6, A2, A9 are all in opponents range here. So is 22-TT. So is Jx. It's possible that opponent might raise J9 or 99 here (so yes I bet-call). I think you miss more bets by checking behind top set here. Yes, you occaisionally get CR'd, but that's poker. NH Joe.

AcidJoe

Wow we actually seem to have an interesting discussion going on. My main reason for betting against this opponent was their W$SD % being below 50%. I fully expected them to call down and hopefully I'd fill in the boat to ensure I shut them out. I wasn't sure this was the right play tho with top set given all the draw that could have been filled in.

After reading everyone's responses ( no offense here Mark) I believe betting out was the right thing to do. I do understand your comments because in retrospect I was questioning the play much like you are.

Thanks everyone for your input. "cheers:

DrTyore

No offense taken Joe...

Everyone has different strategies / theories on this game, and different POV is part of what makes it interesting...

At least that's what I heard Johnny T say last time I saw him and Lou on together.

Mark

AcidJoe

This time a winning hand. Do you worry the dude has the straight flush? Or do you try and cap the river too? I capped the turn then he strill bet out.


Oct 26 10:53:47] : Hand Start.[Oct 26 10:53:47] :
frankiez69 is the dealer.[Oct 26 10:53:50] : KinkyMo posted small blind.[Oct 26 10:53:50] :
My"A"game posted big blind.[Oct 26 10:53:50] :
Game [38275] started with 9 players.[Oct 26 10:53:50] :
Dealing Hole Cards.[Oct 26 10:53:50] :
Seat 3 : Acidjoe63 has 2s As[Oct 26 10:53:53] :
complexion folded.[Oct 26 10:53:57] :
jjbellachi called $1[Oct 26 10:53:57] :
SHEBABA folded.[Oct 26 10:53:58] :
-Tumsch- folded.[Oct 26 10:54:09] :
Acidjoe63 called $1[Oct 26 10:54:16] :
Champion13 called $1[Oct 26 10:54:18] :
frankiez69 called $1[Oct 26 10:54:20] :
KinkyMo called $0.50 and raised $1[Oct 26 10:54:23] :
My"A"game folded.[Oct 26 10:54:28] :
jjbellachi called $1[Oct 26 10:54:30] :
Acidjoe63 called $1[Oct 26 10:54:32] :
Champion13 called $1[Oct 26 10:54:40] :
frankiez69 called $1[Oct 26 10:54:40] :
Dealing flop.[Oct 26 10:54:40] :
Board cards [4s 7s 3s][Oct 26 10:54:43] :
KinkyMo bet $1[Oct 26 10:54:46] :
jjbellachi called $1 and raised $1[Oct 26 10:54:52] :
Acidjoe63 called $2[Oct 26 10:54:54] :
Champion13 called $2[Oct 26 10:54:57] :
frankiez69 folded.[Oct 26 10:54:59] :
KinkyMo called $1[Oct 26 10:54:59] :
Dealing turn.[Oct 26 10:55:00] :
Board cards [4s 7s 3s 8h][Oct 26 10:55:05] :
KinkyMo checked.[Oct 26 10:55:06] :
jjbellachi bet $2[Oct 26 10:55:08] :
Acidjoe63 called $2 and raised $2[Oct 26 10:55:13] :
Champion13 folded.[Oct 26 10:55:15] :
KinkyMo called $4[Oct 26 10:55:17] :
jjbellachi called $2 and raised $2[Oct 26 10:55:19] :
Acidjoe63 called $2 and raised $2[Oct 26 10:55:27] :
KinkyMo called $4[Oct 26 10:55:30] :
jjbellachi called $2[Oct 26 10:55:30] :
Dealing river.[Oct 26 10:55:30] :
Board cards [4s 7s 3s 8h 9s][Oct 26 10:55:34] :
KinkyMo checked.[Oct 26 10:55:36] : j
jbellachi bet $2[Oct 26 10:55:38] :
Acidjoe63 called $2[Oct 26 10:55:43] :
KinkyMo called $2[Oct 26 10:55:44] :
Showdown![Oct 26 10:55:44] :
Seat 3 : Acidjoe63 has 2s As[Oct 26 10:55:46] :
Seat 9 : jjbellachi has Qs Ts[Oct 26 10:55:46] :
jjbellachi has Flush QT974[Oct 26 10:55:46] :
Seat 3 : Acidjoe63 has 2s As[Oct 26 10:55:46] :
Acidjoe63 has Flush A9743[Oct 26 10:55:46] :
Acidjoe63 wins $48 with Flush A9743 (Ace kicker)

DrTyore

I would have bet the river again... I find it highly unlikely that he'd have 56s, and if he does, well, good karma for paying him off.

If I"m there with the Qx s, then I'm probably thinking you've got 4 to the flush, and hoping to catch on the river with a turn semi-bluff. Or is this what KinkyMo had?

Mark

specialK

there is no way you aren't capping the river on that... unless the turn comes with 6s or 5s maybe then you can slow down if the guy is still betting hard... otherwise he needs two cards for the SF...gotta get as many bets as you can in there

AcidJoe

If the 5 had come it would have given me a straight flush but a potential bigger one to someone else. The way today had gone I was expecting to see the 5 6 flip over. I watched the same guy cold call 3 bets with 10 J off and flop his straight over my set of A's. No help for Joe tho.