As I said, Jesus Christ is part of the historical record . . . there are accounts that mention him by name both from his Disciples (duh) and from non-believers as well. Roman historian Tacitus mentions Jesus and his crucifixion by Pilate. The record is plentiful . . .
yes, i have agreed that there was possibly some guy named jesus at some time around 0 AD. now show me the documented evidence that this was actually jesus christ the son of god who performed many miracles that probably thousands of people if not more have seen. and the bible doesn't count as documentation. like i said, they allegedly found some historical records that a guy with that name was around then. that's all they found. they didn't find jesus christ the saviour in any historical documents or with any actual proof.
Milo;356396 wroteProof of God's existence? Look around you . . . A Catholic would tell you that all of Creation is as a result of God. You simply need to be strong in your Faith.
i don't buy for a second that just because something is beautiful or complicated or vast that it must have been made by god. there's just a logical connection there that's missing imo. all i'm saying is that there is no definitive proof that god created the universe or the universe was a creation from the big bang (or that there is only one universe or even only one big bang etc. etc. but that's for another thread). so you have to blindly accept god over other possible explanations. i can't do that. i hold it all in doubt without more proof. (we can get into scientific paradigms and all that as well if you're interested in how science is obviously flawed as well.)
As for Hell, well . . . this is where the notion of Free Will comes into play. Bear with me . . .
i don't believe in free will, but i'll hear you out still.
We have free will because God loves us. No one who loves another would ever "force" them to do anything they did not choose to do for themselves.
this is already incorrect. god forces us to do things we don't want to do all the time. let's say i don't want to be here any more and i just want to be in heaven with god celebrating the rest of eternity. i have no choice in this matter. gotta live out my life because suicide is a mortal sin even though i'm just doing it for my faith. maybe not the best example but i'm sure if you really thought about it you can think of other things we humans have to do because god is forcing us (with the punishment of eternal damnation and torture - btw, all the jews in heaven get to watch us sinners burn in hell for eternity as a reward for reaching heaven. isn't that a sweet present from their god?)
A man who slaps his children is not a loving Father, nor is the husband who locks away his wife a loving husband. God wants us to return to Him, but we must choose to do so.
why can't he (or let's say a spokesperson on his behalf) show up once every, oh idk, 100 years and just say, "hey guys, god's still here. believe in him please. here's a little miracle for those who are still in doubt. later. see you in another century." now is that so hard? choosing to believe in something with zero proof is pretty much impossible for me. is that my fault? is that me being a bad person that deserves to burn in hell for eternity? if you answer yes to those questions, then your god is worse than i'd like to imagine.
Catholics believe that this life is merely prologue for the eternal life with God that follows our mortal one. Those who choose to reject an eternity with God have chosen Hell. But the key is that we must choose for ourselves. God does not send us to Hell, those who are too prideful to accept His love choose it for themselves.
this is a complete cop out. this sounds like those abusive husbands who say things like, "well honey, i'm not choosing to beat you but if you don't do as i tell you then i just have to beat you. it's not my fault you're not doing what you're supposed to be doing. i'm just beating you out of my love for you."
Milo;356397 wroteAlso . . . blind faith? Hardly. God wants us to look within ourselves and make a choice . . .
Christ said . . . "I am the way, the truth, and the life. no one can come to the Father except through Me"
It is a road map to eternal salvation. The only thing that remains is to decide, each of us for ourselves, which path we are going to choose, and whether we have the strength to walk it.
not sure how this argues against blind faith. if you are not believing blindly, please (i'm seriously begging you) show me what you've seen that you base your faith on (we can discuss creation and the random particles as i'm assuming that's what you're talking about). unless you've actually spoken to god yourself and that's why you believe. i had an old roommate who said jesus was in his bed one morning and told him to move to korea. also had a prof once who said she would have arguments with god in her head all the time. can't say i've had those experiences yet.