Making simple S%^& complicated....

[deleted]

I know i can jam this but im working on different bet sizing and experimenting...sux that its a 2 dollar game for discusion but i think villain range is obvious and the money just goes in.....bad?

Poker Stars, $2.28 + $0.22 NL Hold'em Tournament, 200/400 Blinds, 50 Ante, 9 Players
=
UTG+2: 13,223
MP1: 11,428
JodaB. (MP2): 6,665
CO: 9,643
BTN: 4,243
SB: 5,649
BB: 5,683
UTG: 4,680
UTG+1: 14,481

Pre-Flop: (1,050) A

dealt to JodaB. (MP2)
3 folds, MP1 calls 400, JodaB. raises to 1,100, CO calls 1,100, 4 folds

Flop: (3,650) 4

(2 Players)
JodaB. bets 1,000, CO raises to 8,493 and is All-In, JodaB. calls 4,515 and is All-In

betrthanphil

jam pre......the end!

[deleted]

betrthanphil;279873 wrotejam pre......the end!

dmn....never know when to jam and when to raise.....

betrthanphil

In a small game like this, Im for sure shoving <20bb stacks pre. even more so with a limp

[deleted]

betrthanphil;279880 wroteIn a small game like this, Im for sure shoving <20bb stacks pre. even more so with a limp

ah ok ok..i see what im doing here.....my assumption is he folds alot to a shove.....and its not an arguement...normally i would shove its a no brainer....but what if he folds mostly to a shove...but calls a small iso raise...

Richard~

raise bigger pre. Otherwise betcalling every flop might be a mistake. also, don't shove, we want action from worse hands for sure

betrthanphil

You will get action lol. shove

[deleted]

Richard~;279886 wroteraise bigger pre. Otherwise betcalling every flop might be a mistake. also, don't shove, we want action from worse hands for sure

just makin sure you know we only have like 15 bbs.....

but as far as bet calling any flop vs his range of pairs and ak aq etc....we are 50/50 getting giant pot odds...i think even with this small bet pre we will always be ok getting it in and he stands to make a giant mistake by really ever folding...

[deleted]

betrthanphil;279902 wroteYou will get action lol. shove

im down im down im down..but were not just saying this cause its 2.50 game tho right...we'll shove in any game huh? I mean whatever i shove the shit out of this like 30 times a day just lookin for options in weird places.

betrthanphil

More likely to get the action in a $2.50 game, but Im shoving without hesitation at any level. not gonna raise to 1100. now everyone knows/thinks then can call the 1100 to smash a flop and stack me. It is wrong to put chips in the middle with <20bb and leave them out there. IMO. of course it does happen. But with <16bb im never leaving chips out there

Richard~

oh come on, you will NOT get action from medium to big connectors and much weaker aces by shoving. Even a 10 BB shove here will have a decent amount of fold equity against many low limit players

I really hate shoving here without a read that he'll call wide

[deleted]

Richard~;280033 wrote
I really hate shoving here without a read that he'll call wide

ya the read was he limps wide and calls tight i forgot that when i saved the hand. but i think the answer is to shove hands like k9s and j9s expecting alot of fold but to be looked up sometimes by hands like ajs or tt+......and that we should prob shove ak and the like to keep our range strong....

Richard~

Maybe if villain had 3k+ hands on us, but this is not really a question of balancing. btp argues that people will give you action and I feel that people won't

betrthanphil

have you tried it? not just 1 shove. like say doing it for a week or more. have you tried it and seen that you wont get calls, or are you just assuming.

Richard~

betrthanphil;280046 wrotehave you tried it? not just 1 shove. like say doing it for a week or more. have you tried it and seen that you wont get calls, or are you just assuming.

dunno, guess you could call it an assumption deduced from smaller shoves and my gut feeling from situations I've been in before

betrthanphil

thought so

Richard~

that doesn't mean I or the low limit training videos I've watched are wrong

betrthanphil

no but now it seems pointless to continue this discussion with a person making assumptions.

Richard~

I am allowed to generalize my experience from smaller shoves to this slightly larger shove scenario and apply the fact that every instructor has told me that you don't overshove larger aces since it scares away action from hands we want action from. Assasinatos stacksize vid said so, as did HerchelW's low limit series and every other instructor I've heard stumple onto the topic.

I can't just change what I think about it now just cause you think that a large enough % of low limit players make terrible calls to make this play optimal

betrthanphil

nooo im not thinking they will, that would be making an assumption that we already clarified thats what your doing. Im going from experience doing it.

I understand that you watch these instructors and listen to what they say, but why not make your own opinion and go out there and try different things to see what works. If everyone believed peoples theories blindly and never tried to discover things for themself then we would still think that the world is square. Come to your own conclusions by doing your own research.