The Official CRAPS Discussion thread

ReefAquarium

moose;264917 wroteMy epic roll in craps tonight. Made six points. I use the purple chips to mark the points made. Played the 13cards press the 6 and 8 strategy. Ran the 6 up to $600 and hit it, reduced to $300 and hit again. Ran the 8 to $600 but didn't hit again. Varied the pass/come bets between $5 and $30 with 5x odds.

Winnings are stacked to the left of the $1s behind the stick.

I make it $3941 in winnings on one roll.

Nice job!!!!

JohnnieH

Well done, Moose. Too bad it Had to be at home :(

Those new Paulson dice must be hot!

moose

JohnnieH;264946 wroteWell done, Moose. Too bad it Had to be at home :(

Those new Paulson dice must be hot!

Yeah but with the TV feed working in the basement now, the roll started in the 9th inning and ended after the Jays walkoff win!

Jays+craps = win win

ReefAquarium

13CARDS;255090 wrotePlace either the 6 or 8 for $18.
When it hits, take the $21. You are now freerollin' up $3, even if your Place Bet loses.
When it hits again, PRESS (which means "double") your bet to $36. Net +$6.
When it hits again, PARLAY (which means "add it all and let it ride") to $78. Net +$6 still.
When it hits again, GO TO (which means "make the bet look like") $150. Net +$25.
When it hits, PRESS to $300. Net +$50.
When it hits, PRESS to $600. Net +$100.
When it hits, REDUCE to $300. Net +$1,100.
After that, just PRESS everytime until you hit Table Max.

Thanks to 13 cards for putting the above system up.
I like the above system.

If you play the above system you will be playing better than 99% of craps players.

If you use 13Cards system you will be giving the house a 1.51% advantage.

If you are betting small amounts it doesn't matter very much if you make place 6/8 bets or pass/come bets. The advantage of pass/come bets over place6/8 bets is trivial pennies when the bets are small ... ($5pass=-$.07EV vs $6place6/8=-$.09EV).

But when you start to bet larger sums placing the 6/8 gets more expensive. ($100pass+$500odds=-$1.41 EV vs $600 place6/8=-$9.06 EV

When the bets are larger at a 5x odds game, place 6/8 betting is over 4x as expensive in HA as Pass/Come betting with max odds.(0.326% vs 1.51%)

When playing at somewhere like Brantford that has a $100 max bet Plus $500 odds bet I suggest you switch to making come/pass bets with 5x(max) odds. This way you pay less (0.326% vs 1.51%) house advantage. Therefore you will make more money/lose less on average.

Modified 13cards system Version 2.0 for playing at places like Brantford ($100max bet +$500 odds bet).

Make a $5 pass/come bet and take $15 odds if the point is 4,6,8 or 10(or max odds) Take $16 odds if the point is 5 or 9 (or max odds $26)
When it hits, take the $. You are now freerollin', even if your Bet loses.

Make another $5 pass/come bet and take $15 odds if the point is 4,6,8 or 10(or max odds) Take $16 odds if the point is 5 or 9 (or max odds $26)
When it hits again, PRESS (which means "double") $6 come/pass bet, with $30 odds

When it hits again, PARLAY (which means "add it all and let it ride") to $12 Come/pass bet with $60 odds.

When it hits again, GO TO (which means "make the bet look like") ($25 Come/pass then take $125 odds). If the point is 5/9 take $126 odds.

When it hits, PRESS to ($50 come/pass , $250 odds).

When it hits, PRESS to ($100 come/pass, $500 odds). .

When it hits, REDUCE to ($50 come/pass , $250 odds).

After that, just add another $100 come bet with full odds every time until you cover all the numbers at Table Max. $3600 down.

What do you guys think?

moose

I'll give it a try tonight. Thanks.

One caveat about Brantford - the ev on the place bets never gets that large because $100 is the largest place bet, however I assume Brantford lets you make a $100 pass bet with $500 odds. I should ask next time.

I think it would be a lot of fun to play that way at Brantford because you would certainly look like a big time balla' betting table max with $500 odds.

Reef what's your feeling on turning odds on on a come out roll? I know this is slightly in the house's favour if you don't but on the other hand statistically if a seven has to eventually come, you can extend the winnings a lot further if the seven happens to roll on a come out roll. The ev difference is minimal and it is a soul killer when the seven rolls when you have odds working.

JohnnieH

moose;265504 wroteI'll give it a try tonight.

Owning your own craps table most be so sick.

ReefAquarium

moose;265504 wroteI'll give it a try tonight. Thanks.

One caveat about Brantford - the ev on the place bets never gets that large because $100 is the largest place bet, however I assume Brantford lets you make a $100 pass bet with $500 odds. I should ask next time.

I think it would be a lot of fun to play that way at Brantford because you would certainly look like a big time balla' betting table max with $500 odds.

Yes, at Brantford you can bet $100 pass line with $500 odds or $100 don't pass with $1000 odds. That's one of the reasons the system I suggested does not make big place bets (you can't make place bets over $100 at Brantford).

Reef what's your feeling on turning odds on on a come out roll? I know this is slightly in the house's favour if you don't but on the other hand statistically if a seven has to eventually come, you can extend the winnings a lot further if the seven happens to roll on a come out roll. The ev difference is minimal and it is a soul killer when the seven rolls when you have odds working.

It depends what your objective is.

As you correctly pointed out, you need to decide if you want to minimize the house advantage by a small amount, or maximize your time playing?

Personally I like to keep them working, but only you can decide if you want them on or off.

But ... If I'm there to gamble, I'd rather make more bets at 0% house advantage, than make bets at 1.41% house advantage. I'm not there to maximize my playing time.

On a related note: Most craps players don't play with minimal house advantage. How many people do you see taking advantage of 10x, 20x, 100x, 500x free odds when they are offered?

ReefAquarium

JohnnieH;265507 wroteOwning your own craps table most be so sick.

If anyone is going to develop a controlled throw, it's going to be the guy with a craps table.

moose

Ok after at least 50 rolls - it's tough. The main problem is that to get a point you have to roll it first and then hit it again. If you place a point, you only have to hit it once to break even. You could just play a pass line but then you are expecting the shooter to make 7 points - really tough. I tried playing a pass line bet and two come bets but since you keep rolling the winnings into larger bets it's tough to get ahead of the initial outlay.

Will keep trying, though I've gotten to the $50 flat and $250 behind only a couple times and never hit.

Although I did play today at Brantford, playing 2-3 points at a time. After a brutal orbit of every player making a point and immediately sevening out - the dice finally make it back to me. I put my last $100 in so that I can make some bets - grit my teeth and resolve to bet everything until I am down to the felt (-$400). Well I make 4 points - 4, 5,6, 10 which pays the fire bet and come out on the 9 for a 5th point but alas don't make that one, which I think paid 250 to 1 or something. I don't make fire bets but a few people made money on the 4 pointer and everyone was very happy after such a brutal orbit, especially with making 4 easy and hard 10.

Started with the 5/25 then 6/30 and 12/60. Didn't have the balls to go to 25/125, which would have hit on the last point of 10 and I did make the 12/60 a couple times on a few numbers so it was a great roll. So I rolled my last hundo into $540 and cashed out a purple. My first BCC purple! I so love craps.

moose

Strangely enough I just came from my basement where I had a 7 point roll, so I finally did hit a 100/500 and reduced to 50/250. Profit on that roll was 1266. So after 105 rolls I am up +85 on this system.

However in that time I also hit a $600 placed 6 or 8 three times. So on my biggest two rolls out of that 105 rolls the tally is:

13cards............. Reef
1150 (approx)..... 1266
1880.................. 376 (remember the dice determine what number you play under the Reef system and by luck my money kept landing on other numbers and then subsequently I would hit the 6 or 8 instead, which was placed by the 13cards system and would always win)

Now I haven't been tracking the net of the 13cards system but so far using 13cards' system it just seems easier to hit and the big rolls so far are more profitable.

I'll probably play this system up to 200 rolls or so and see how it goes.

CompleXEH

Was at BCC playing tonight walked away up only $20 but man the dealers were S L O W....I wanted to honestly shoot myself....even the rolls that had no action we were waiting 2 minutes for the dice to come out

ReefAquarium

Very important changes to the craps system. Always take an even number of odds is your point is 5/9.

I changed it so that you're betting $16 odds rather than $15 odds if the point is 5 or 9.
This is very important at places that don't pay off the breakage with .50 chips. Also take $126 odds if you're making a place bet of $25 and the point is 5/9.

Now the system reads.

Modified 13cards system Version 2.0 for playing at places like Brantford ($100max bet +$500 odds bet).

Make a $5 pass/come bet and take $15 odds if the point is 4,6,8 or 10(or max odds) Take $16 odds (or max odds) if the point is 5 or 9 (or max odds)
When it hits, take the $. You are now freerollin', even if your Bet loses.
Make another $5 pass/come bet and take $15 odds if the point is 4,6,8 or 10(or max odds) Take $16 odds if the point is 5 or 9 (or max odds)
When it hits again, PRESS (which means "double") $6 come/pass bet, with $30 odds
When it hits again, PARLAY (which means "add it all and let it ride") to $12 Come/pass bet with $60 odds.

When it hits again, GO TO (which means "make the bet look like") ($25 Come/pass then take $125 odds) Take $126 odds if the point is 5/9.
When it hits, PRESS to ($50 come/pass , $250 odds).
When it hits, PRESS to ($100 come/pass, $500 odds). .
When it hits, REDUCE to ($50 come/pass , $250 odds).
After that, just add another $100 come bet with full odds every time until you cover all the numbers at Table Max. $3600 down.

If the point is 5 or 9 you can round your odds up to an even number if your pass/come bet was an odd number. This gives your slightly better than 5x odds.

Remember to always round your odds up to an even number is the point is 5 or 9 and your pass/come bet was an odd number.

ReefAquarium

I modified the system to use if you're not comfortable with betting $25 pass with $125 odds.

Now the max it gets up to is $15 pass/come with $75 odds ($76 odds if the point is 5/9). Also you odds bet is an even number if the point is 5/9.

What do you think?

Modified 13cards system Version 3.0 for playing at places like Brantford ($100max bet +$500 odds bet).

Make a $5 pass/come bet and take $15 odds if the point is 4,6,8 or 10(or max odds) Take $16 odds if the point is 5 or 9 (or max odds $26)
When it hits, take the $. You are now freerollin', even if your Bet loses.
Make another $5 pass/come bet and take $15 odds if the point is 4,6,8 or 10(or max odds) Take $16 odds if the point is 5 or 9 (or max odds $26)
When it hits again, PRESS (which means "double") $6 come/pass bet, with $30 odds
When it hits again, GO TO (which means "make the bet look like") to $8 Come/pass bet with $40 odds.

When it hits again, GO TO (which means "make the bet look like") ($10 Come/pass then take $50 odds).
When it hits, Go To to ($12 come/pass , $60 odds).
When it hits, Go To to ($15 come/pass, $75 odds). $76 odds if the point is 5/9 .
When it hits, REDUCE to ($12 come/pass , $60 odds).
After that, just add another $15 come bet with full odds($75) ($76 odds if the point is 5/9) every time until you cover all the numbers at Table Max.

ReefAquarium

moose;265710 wroteOk after at least 50 rolls - it's tough. The main problem is that to get a point you have to roll it first and then hit it again. If you place a point, you only have to hit it once to break even. You could just play a pass line but then you are expecting the shooter to make 7 points - really tough. I tried playing a pass line bet and two come bets but since you keep rolling the winnings into larger bets it's tough to get ahead of the initial outlay.

Will keep trying, though I've gotten to the $50 flat and $250 behind only a couple times and never hit.

Although I did play today at Brantford, playing 2-3 points at a time. After a brutal orbit of every player making a point and immediately sevening out - the dice finally make it back to me. I put my last $100 in so that I can make some bets - grit my teeth and resolve to bet everything until I am down to the felt (-$400). Well I make 4 points - 4, 5,6, 10 which pays the fire bet and come out on the 9 for a 5th point but alas don't make that one, which I think paid 250 to 1 or something. I don't make fire bets but a few people made money on the 4 pointer and everyone was very happy after such a brutal orbit, especially with making 4 easy and hard 10.

Started with the 5/25 then 6/30 and 12/60. Didn't have the balls to go to 25/125, which would have hit on the last point of 10 and I did make the 12/60 a couple times on a few numbers so it was a great roll. So I rolled my last hundo into $540 and cashed out a purple. My first BCC purple! I so love craps.

Very cool Moose!!

I put some more thought into the system and improved it a lot, see my version 2.0 and version 3.0.

ReefAquarium

moose;265742 wroteStrangely enough I just came from my basement where I had a 7 point roll, so I finally did hit a 100/500 and reduced to 50/250. Profit on that roll was 1266. So after 105 rolls I am up +85 on this system.

However in that time I also hit a $600 placed 6 or 8 three times. So on my biggest two rolls out of that 105 rolls the tally is:

13cards............. Reef
1150 (approx)..... 1266
1880.................. 376 (remember the dice determine what number you play under the Reef system and by luck my money kept landing on other numbers and then subsequently I would hit the 6 or 8 instead, which was placed by the 13cards system and would always win)

Now I haven't been tracking the net of the 13cards system but so far using 13cards' system it just seems easier to hit and the big rolls so far are more profitable.

I'll probably play this system up to 200 rolls or so and see how it goes.

Neat!

If you're going to trial the system...

Please trial my version 2.0 or 3.0 system that is improved by always betting an even number on the odds when point is 5/9.

moose

I was just automatically making bets of 5/20, 5/26, 6/30, 12/60 anyways for 5 and 9.

[deleted]

da best craps strategy is follo someone whos rollin hot

CompleXEH

At BCC again tonight.....pretty much every roll was get the number and roll a 7. I hate nights like that! lol

BlondeFish

Two poker pros accused of cheating at craps at Wynn

SuitedPair

thread resurrection,

played craps for the first time last night. Have always wanted to play because it looks so fun even though I know the house wins over time. As Moose said early in the thread the social factor is huge.

Won 200 playing 1/2 at Niagara and my buddy wanted to hit fallsview for some slots. Watched the craps table for about 1/2 hour where a guy had about 1k in front of him and was playing well for a while. I asked one of the table guys a few questions (table wasn't busy with betting so it wasn't too big a deal) and got a feel for it. So the bettor is placing pass bets, then after roll out starts putting bets on 5 and 9, then hard 6,8,10. From what I've seen the 5/9 are -EV compared to the 6/8. Anyway, he goes on a bit of a down swing and I throw $100 on the table.

The bettor is about to leave and the dealer informs him it's my first time playing so he might want to stay. I went on a heck of a run. I didn't take max odds which is incredibly stupid I know now (I would have been up a tonne) but was playing like a nit.

I followed the 5/9 bets but not the hard bets as I didn't think the odds made sense to be profitable. I just quickly ran it in my head and it didn't seem right.

so with this silly strategy ($10 Pass, then 10 on the odds, with 10 each on 5 and 9) I just kept tossing fives and nines and hit my number a few times. When I finally seven-ed out I was up $130. Bettor dude was up quite a bit.......if only I'd bet max odds. I hit it twice I think before the seven out but rolled a seven out the gate after both.

So all in all a fun time and now armed with the Reef/13Cards/Moose knowledge trust from above I shall try to at least make sure I'm giving myself the most time with my cash while having a tonne of fun.

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