The Official CRAPS Discussion thread

JohnnieH

On my last trip to Vegas Moose introduced me to Craps. I had no clue what was going on, or what to do. Thanks to a very hot shooter I was lucky enough to have a winning session and now I'm hooked. (Any time I play in Ontario I lose, but I'm still intrigued.) The wife and I watched a few videos on youtube last night and SHE'S intrigued!

Let's open a discussion up about playing and winning strategies* at Craps before I lose my bankroll.

What are the best bets to make? Worst?

Anybody have a 'system' that works for them?

*Yes I know the best way keep your money is stay off the table, so don't be a D-bag and point out the obvious.

STR82ACE

JohnnieH;254988 wroteplaying and winning strategies* at Craps before I lose my bankroll.

There IS such a thing? Always figured Craps were heavily house favoured and no chance to really be a long term winner. But I have no idea about the game either, so what do I know.

moose

Craps has the lowest house edge of any table game. Stay away from all the prop bets which have a house edge of 5-16.67%.

Best bet is pass/come with a house edge of 1.41%, taking max odds on the 5x odds offered at Brantford lowers the house edge to 0.326%, although the expected loss remains the same due to the higher average bet. 2nd best bet is placing 6 and 8, 1.52% house edge. Placing the other numbers is a house edge >5%.

There is no strategy. Playing any other bets in a 'strategy' only reduces variance but increases the house edge.

moose

If you want to play for minimal losses for a long time, you can just place the 6 and 8 for $6 each. You can make a hundo last forever that way. Make a $5 pass line bet when it is your turn to shoot, take max odds and hope you are hot.

westside8

JohnnieH;254988 wroteOn my last trip to Vegas Moose introduced me to Craps. I had no clue what was going on, or what to do. Thanks to a very hot shooter I was lucky enough to have a winning session and now I'm hooked. (Any time I play in Ontario I lose, but I'm still intrigued.) The wife and I watched a few videos on youtube last night and SHE'S intrigued!

Let's open a discussion up about playing and winning strategies* at Craps before I lose my bankroll.

What are the best bets to make? Worst?

Anybody have a 'system' that works for them?

*Yes I know the best way keep your money is stay off the table, so don't be a D-bag and point out the obvious.

Did you not get hooked on your first trip to Vegas? Took you long enough

JohnnieH

westside8;255011 wroteDid you not get hooked on your first trip to Vegas? Took you long enough

All I know about Craps from the '08 trip is that it paid for our lunch buffet at Bellagio. Thanks again!

How do you typical play, Wes? Do you ever go crazy and bet the field? Any hard numbers? Do you increase your bets when you're on a roll?

westside8

JohnnieH;255014 wroteAll I know about Craps from the '08 trip is that it paid for our lunch buffet at Bellagio. Thanks again!

How do you typical play, Wes? Do you ever go crazy and bet the field? Any hard numbers? Do you increase your bets when you're on a roll?

Max odds on pass line bet, and usually I would place the inside (5,6,8,9) and depend on the table, I would either press the place bets a couple of times, or put a come-bet out and take max odds on the come bet as well.

I rarely bet the middle, only time I do is when I'm shooting and the point is one of the hard numbers...we are gambling after all.

The only bet I would increase when the table is running hot is the pass line bet, and if anything be more willing to press my place bets an extra time or two.

13CARDS

Place either the 6 or 8 for $18.
When it hits, take the $21. You are now freerollin' up $3, even if your Place Bet loses.
When it hits again, PRESS (which means "double") your bet to $36. Net +$6.
When it hits again, PARLAY (which means "add it all and let it ride") to $78. Net +$6 still.
When it hits again, GO TO (which means "make the bet look like") $150. Net +$25.
When it hits, PRESS to $300. Net +$50.
When it hits, PRESS to $600. Net +$100.
When it hits, REDUCE to $300. Net +$1,100.
After that, just PRESS everytime until you hit Table Max.

OR

Bet $1 on either Hard 6 or Hard 8.
If it hits, PARLAY to $10.
If it hits, PARLAY to $100.
If it hits, $1,000 and DOWN!!!!

I play the first way.

CompleXEH

I love craps, I have to play every time I am at the casino but no strategies here other than pass line and 6/8. Like someone said before I will play the hardways when it is the point.
Also similar to 13cards when I am playing 6/8 I will take the first win and press from then on.

moose

13CARDS;255090 wrotePlace either the 6 or 8 for $18.
When it hits, take the $21. You are now freerollin' up $3, even if your Place Bet loses.
When it hits again, PRESS (which means "double") your bet to $36. Net +$6.
When it hits again, PARLAY (which means "add it all and let it ride") to $78. Net +$6 still.
When it hits again, GO TO (which means "make the bet look like") $150. Net +$25.
When it hits, PRESS to $300. Net +$50.
When it hits, PRESS to $600. Net +$100.
When it hits, REDUCE to $300. Net +$1,100.
After that, just PRESS everytime until you hit Table Max.

I play the first way.

Sounds like fun. Thanks.

13CARDS

moose;255312 wroteSounds like fun. Thanks.

It can be super boring, especially if the outside numbers keep rolling instead.

But, for $100, you get at least 5 chances to catch a roll with a lot of 8's.

And I like to only bet one number; that way, I lose on one number (7) and win on one number (8). If you bet across, each shot of the dice you can only get paid on ONE number but you can lose all FIVE bets at once if the shooter craps out.

westside8

13CARDS;255352 wroteIt can be super boring, especially if the outside numbers keep rolling instead.

But, for $100, you get at least 5 chances to catch a roll with a lot of 8's.

And I like to only bet one number; that way, I lose on one number (7) and win on one number (8). If you bet across, each shot of the dice you can only get paid on ONE number but you can lose all FIVE bets at once if the shooter craps out.

I like the number 8

moose

westside8;255377 wroteI like the number 8

You crazy Asians. Happy New Year!

JohnnieH

Here are the videos I watched:

Hobbes

JohnnieH;255806 wroteHere are the videos I watched:

So they teach you to be the house? ;)

ReefAquarium

Do not under any circumstances play like the guy in video's 3 and 4 above.

Errors from worst to least:

1. He makes bad place bets on the ten and four.

You should never ever place the ten or four. The house advantage is 6.67%.

2. He makes bad place bets on the five and nine.

You should never make place bets on the five or nine. The house advantage is 4%

3. He makes a bad field bet.

You should never make a field bet. The house advantage is either 5.56% or 2.78%

4. He makes all these bets but doesn't make free odds bets. Free odds bets have no house advantage. It's the best bet to make in craps.

If you play craps you should make bets that have the lowest house advantage as much as possible within the constraints of your bankroll.

Listen to Moose.

Moose's system mentioned above is a good place to start. I like to bet more of my money on the free odds than Moose's place bets on the 6 and 8, but the difference is not too significant at low stakes. For example, rather than make a place bet on the six or eight, I'd rather bet the come and take max odds.

(((Edited the above line to read "come" rather than "don't come")))

The absolute worst bet is the fire bet. The house advantage is 21-25%!!!!!!!!!

Fire bets are even worse in the US where they also take taxes after you win a fire bet!!!!!!!

The best bets to make are the free odds bets. They have zero house advantage.

If there is enough interest I'm thinking of putting together a simple beginners faq on how to evaluate craps systems/craps players.

moose

I know why the guy in the video is making those bets - just to reduce variance. I'm sure his system is very low variance, making a lot of players who play his system believe it is better because for a long time they could be a very small winner. However the house edge is obv much higher. It is the same as the craps players who bet any craps on the come out roll - it reduces variance, if they lose on 7 or 11 on the pass line, then they get some money back if the 2,3 or 12 rolls. They believe it is better because it reduces the variance on the come out roll.

As I stated above taking the max odds (5x) reduces the house to only 0.326%, only because a higher proportion of your bet goes towards a 0 EV bet. However, since you are making larger bets the expected loss is the same as not taking odds because you are betting more money and the variance is a lot higher. However, IMO this is the purpose of playing craps - the large thrill and excitement of everyone at the table winning together and winning a lot of money during a hot roll. It is by far the most exciting gaming experience of any game at the casino.

You might get a personal thrill out of winning a large pot in poker and you might get one or two NH but the entire table won't be up out of their seat shouting and cheering on every play like they will at a craps table. Gambling is a social game and it's not fun unless it is shared. Hence the popularity of several forumers heading to Vegas at once and the interest the rail threads generate.

ReefAquarium

For almost everyone, you should look for the lowest minimum pass line bet and the biggest odds up to what you can afford.

When I go to Vegas, I want to try going to a place like Joker's Wild.

The table minimum is $1 and you can put 10x free odds on it.
Bet the pass line for $1, Bet $10 free odds on your point.

Other places I'd like to see are: Casino Royal, $3 min 20x odds or $5 min 100x odds; The Cannery $3 min, 100x odds.

In Southern Ontario, I've heard Casino Winsor has 10x odds.

I know Brantford has 5x odds 1 table $5 min, Fallsview/Niagara/Seneca have 3x4x5x odds and $5 min tables.

moose

Pretty sure Casino Royale is done with the low mins and high odds. I believe last time I was there it was $5 min and 10x odds.

Bills had $3 min 5x odds Rapid craps. You roll the dice but there are no chips.

Railroad Pass and Hacienda out towards Hoover Dam had $1 min and 2x odds. Also Buffalo Bills at the California border.

JohnnieH

I knew there would be a website for this:

The Ultimate Las Vegas Craps Directory -- Minimums, Limits, and Odds