Do I fold AA here??

Quinner

I think I know I'm getting better at poker when i actually wonder if laying down american airlines is a better idea then chance a huge suckout.... the scenario here is that I'm playing a stars Hubble Freeroll, and I'm about 30,000 chips greater than the average stack at this point and we're 60 players away from the 72 players who get to move on to round 2. I get AA, raise it 3x the BB to 9,000, and immediately get moved in on by the table chip leader to my left. Is this still an automatic call?? Or should I just blind out and hope for the best?? Ps. this is sort of a get this off my chest post, here's what happened.

I call and he turns up JJ, the flop (of course) comes J 9 2 the turn brings me a flush draw, but to no avail his mother*@#$@(*&#$ JJ took down my rockets and knocked me out of the tourney when I was in fairly good shape to move on. The worst part? I would've folded any other hand (except maybe KK) in this spot.

Ugh, just ugh...... after looking at how many players are left now (about half an hour later), it looks like my best option would have been just to fold out and hope for the best. So many dumb people in these things.....

How did that wanker make it so far in this tourney?? ??

*end rant*

compuease

Jah??? ?

Hellmuth's Mole

There are times to lay down AA.

Pre-flop is definitely not one of them.

GTA Poker

fk off

moose

Freeroll? Time better spent picking up pennies in the street.

JimmyHo

compuease;181751 wroteJah??? ?

been there, done that. Best advice, filter out the idiots on this site and just read the useful posts.

Richard~

If step 2 was a new tournament where everyone started with equal stacks and I believed I could turn off my computer and make it anyway I'd fold, otherwise there's really no way ._.

zunni74

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

61,642,944 games 0.005 secs 12,328,588,800 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 81.148% 80.94% 00.20% 49896864 125190.00 { AA }
Hand 1: 18.852% 18.65% 00.20% 11495700 125190.00 { JJ }

-----------------------------

Why wouldn't you want to get it all in when you are a 4 to 1 fav??

You aren't going to get many better spots than that.

You weren't close enough to the bubble, to not want to double through the chip leader...

westside8

Not close enough to the satellite bubble situation...

pkrfce9

keep up the good work guys. soon only the 'pros' will be posting here. oh wait...

OPRC

For what its worth, i think ya made the right call. You were too far from the bubble to just sit idle and hope the other 60 ppl went out quick.

chrisrowl111

you cannot even think of lying down aces pre flop here!

you are not dominated by anything, except of course in even standing with a pair of aces. To fold the best hand pre flop that you can have, just because the chip leader put you all in, is like setting yourself up to fail. In order to win that tourney you need to take him out at some point and when better to double your stack then when u are moved all in holding aces pre flop.

The moral of this story here is that shit happens, and thats poker. JJ beats out AA sometimes, but so does 72. The only way to look at this is that you moved with the best of it, you got your money in good, and he lucked out.

AND THATS THE GAME WE LOVE TO PLAY!

P.S had he only min raised u and allowed you to see a flop, could you have folded anyways?

JimmyHo

chrisrowl111;181783 wroteP.S had he only min raised u and allowed you to see a flop, could you have folded anyways?

when the J high flop comes, he isn't going anywhere.

blackmagicz

You lose to a 2 outer no worries. Like most have already said, you are too far away from the bubble to make this decision a difficult one.

Just remember in any tournament where you go deep and/or win there are situations where you are going to have to get lucky and also hope that your hand holds up.

I have talked to many people including players who have won the Sunday Million on Stars and ask them how they won against these large player pools and they all say the same thing....they got lucky in a lot of spots and had their hands hold up.

Basically they ran like God throughout the tournament.

Just something to keep in the back of your head when playing these large MTTs. Skill will help you play consistent but every now and again luck never hurts anyone :)

LanterneRouge

Don't let anyone tell you it is never correct to fold AA. There ARE times to fold AA - although this was not one of them. It was still too early in the satellite. You played it correctly and lost. Don't worry about it. :) However...

In a satellite where every qualifier gets the exact same prize and you are at least 90% (preferably 100%) sure you can fold every hand and still blind in to that prize, folding AA pre-flop is correct.

Also, in certain (very limited) sit-n-go scenarios, folding AA pre-flop is also correct. For example:

$10 + $1 buy-in
Tourney pays: 1st $50, 2nd $30, 3rd $20
Current blind level: 500/1000
Current stacks:
Player 1: 5500
Player 2: 5500
Player 3: 37975
Player 4: 1025
Player 3 posts 500 sb
Player 4 posts 1000 bb

Player 4 (you) is dealt AhAc

Player 1 goes all-in for 5500
Player 2 calls all-in for 5500
Player 3 calls 5500
Player 4: ...

Fold your bullets here and you are virtually guaranteed to finish in at least 3rd ... possibly 2nd.

Call and you are likely to finish in 4th. Even if your AA does manage to hold up against 3 other hands (not a sure thing by any means), you're still on a very short stack and not likely to finish 1st. The gamble of the call is not worth the slightly improved chances of finishing 1st.

cadillac

moose;181757 wroteFreeroll? Time better spent picking up pennies in the street.

The cheater continues looking down his nose at every one. You sir are the captain of all things douche. Please DIAGF

Cerberus

I'll agree with the bubble situation when you're short stacked and all three other players go all in. One of them is likely to bust out in that situation. It's very rare that there will be a split pot of any sort, so you end up making the money when it was pretty unlikely you would have otherwise. For you situation, there's no way you fold that preflop. The size of your stack compared to the average, this guy was clearly making a chipstack bully move. The worst you are in that case is 80-20 to win. Two outers happens, runner runner flushes happen, four cards on the board to hit a straight happen. But that other 80%, you've just smoked the chipstack and can sit for the rest of the tourney until you qualify for the next step.

There a great quote at the end of The Cinncinnati Kid: sometimes poker is about making the wrong moves at the right time.

ReefAquarium

Quinner;181750 wroteI think I know I'm getting better at poker when i actually wonder if laying down american airlines is a better idea then chance a huge suckout.... the scenario here is that I'm playing a stars Hubble Freeroll, and I'm about 30,000 chips greater than the average stack at this point and we're 60 players away from the 72 players who get to move on to round 2. I get AA, raise it 3x the BB to 9,000, and immediately get moved in on by the table chip leader to my left. Is this still an automatic call?? Or should I just blind out and hope for the best?? Ps. this is sort of a get this off my chest post, here's what happened.

I call and he turns up JJ, the flop (of course) comes J 9 2 the turn brings me a flush draw, but to no avail his mother*@#$@(*&#$ JJ took down my rockets and knocked me out of the tourney when I was in fairly good shape to move on. The worst part? I would've folded any other hand (except maybe KK) in this spot.

Ugh, just ugh...... after looking at how many players are left now (about half an hour later), it looks like my best option would have been just to fold out and hope for the best. So many dumb people in these things.....

How did that wanker make it so far in this tourney?? ??

*end rant*

Sounds like you played well and got sucked out on.

When I first started I built my roll from freerolls.

Moose is right that for a skilled player you're better off picking pennies off the street, but when I started, I sucked so badly that freerolls were better than losing money and better than playing play money.

zunni74

Quinner;181750 wroteI think I know I'm getting better at poker when i actually wonder if laying down american airlines is a better idea then chance a huge suckout....

Not to be a prick, but no... this means you are getting worse at poker...

Get your money in with the best hand. Contemplating laying down pre-flop monsters because you fear a suck-out is horrible play..

AA's are one of those things you can't screw up pre-flop... JUST RAISE and if you get pushed on, CALL... if you get re-raised, re-raise or push yourself.

Use the betting pre-flop to figure out what hand your oppt is likely holding. If he pushes, he would likely have TT, JJ, QQ, KK, AA, AK, AQ (maybe), plus others if player is looser. You are HUGE against any of these hands.

I'm not even a fan of that SNG bubble situation, I call there and hopefully triple up. Is one player going to get eliminated?? Yes, but would you rather someone gets eliminated and you have a reasonable stack or still have your crappy short stack and likely worse cards to go with it?

Against 3 players playing top 10% of hands (which would make a certain amount of sense to call that pre-flop all-in) you are still an approx 65-35
favourite against ALL of them.

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 64.657% 62.61% 02.05% 694312 22752.33 { AA }
Hand 1: 11.746% 10.72% 01.02% 118903 11364.67 { 88+, A9s+, KTs+, QTs+, AJo+, KQo }
Hand 2: 11.801% 10.78% 01.02% 119539 11340.83 { 88+, A9s+, KTs+, QTs+, AJo+, KQo }
Hand 3: 11.797% 10.78% 01.02% 119535 11311.67 { 88+, A9s+, KTs+, QTs+, AJo+, KQo }

So I'd probably take a shot here and hope to get a stack back to start doing some damage. But that's me...

Graham

Never lay down AA preflop
Never post about laying down AA preflop

Both are bad ideas IMO