I am officially never playing online again!!!
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but how do the other players know about the Team Holdem players?
they are not entitled to that info unless it is willingly offered by the team. the knowledge of who is teaming is as important as your personal card knowledge. keep in mind that if you are teaming against us there is nothing we can do to force you to tell us that you are. we do not trust you. therefore we can only assume that you can and will team whenever you so choose. any promise on your part has no value. the only thing that has value is knowing what you can or cannot possibly do and since nobody has the power to stop you from cardsharing and or using a bot then we will behave as if you are (even if you are not).
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Do the team players tell this upfront in the chat box?
no they do not and neither do you. just because you clicked "i accept" for the site terms and conditions does not mean that i trust you. i only trust what you can physically choose to do while playing online - which includes clicking yes to a policy statement and then promptly ignoring it.
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If they don't know about it, I would say the other players have an unfair disadvantage. Don't you think so?
absolutely not. all players worldwide have 3 choices:
1) stop playing online holdem
2) start doing what others are already doing (use computer assistance and/or cardshare)
3) continue as before knowing full well that you are powerless to prevent your opponents from using computer assistance and/or cardsharing.
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The bot is one thing, but I cannot defend the moral of teaming with it. Am I missing something?
in regards to your own behavior no - you are not missing anything. we defend your privacy, power and rights as an individual player but we do not assert your power or right to determine the behavior of your opponents. you absolutely have the power to select your own behavior but you absolutely cannot govern the behavior of your opponents. (neither can we for that matter and neither can the host site).
we fully recognize that you have the power to obey the old live rules of holdem while playing online
1) no assistance of any kind including computer assistance
2) no cardsharing.
this is fully your choice and we support your right and power to select your own behavior.
we want you to support us if we decide to use the new rules
1) computer assistance allowed at anytime without informing anyone
2) cardsharing at anytime without informing anyone.
it is about freedom of choice.
our choices are not open to debate by you or anybody.
Cool
I took that from the winholdem forum (http://www.winholdem.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=605)
This is absolutely disgusting to me and I really am finished playing online because of this. I am not a cheater nor have I ever been. I find this disturbing that these people seem proud of their work. I have resisted using poker tracker as I felt this would give me an unfair advantage in the first place. But then there's stuff like this out there too. I knew it could exist all along, but when I see forums with 400 active cheaters, I can say nothing else.
I welcome anyone's feedback on the matter.
Comments
I am just finding it harder and harder to trust what's out there. It sounds like I am turning into my grandpa, with all that newfangled technology, but this forum really bothers me.
I would welcome a chance to discuss this level of advantage (read: cheating) with the various people involved, but I suspect I know their response already.
Sure there may be bots out there (which can be beaten, learn the pattern and they're yours). And there is inevitable collusio, if you detect it, move to another table or another site. Besides, there is only so much collusion can do. Is it an adavtange? Yes, but I am willing to fight those advantages. If you want to stop, you have that right and I wouldn'tthink less of you.
I think there are a lot more people out there like the posters on this forum that are playing that the cheaters.
I played a table last night that seemed "odd" to me. One guy after folding would always leave hints about his cards, so I moved tables. I don't know if he was working with another player (it was a 6 person table) but there was enough to make me move. I did and made back the money I lost and more.
But as it as been written here, your play will be affected if you go in thinking about these things. Perhaps you are best playing only live games. There are just not as convienent and you can't play in your underwear. At most places anyway.
Is it worth it to forward that thread to the customer service depts of the major sites? Would they care? Do they already know?Â
Well, maybe all the honest players should leave and then the cheaters can all cheat each other. If only it were that simple. These guys come close to those motherf-ers over at Enron.
Whiterabbit, the sites already know. Some try to do something about it, some don't. Cryptologic sites (Carribean Sun, Interpoker etc) I do not believe have the technology to detect it. Read the winholdem site, they tell you where you can use it and where you can't. Therefore, if you are worried about it, play where you think the sites are protecting you as much as they can.
Any 3 of you want to play 50-100 somewhere? my msn nickname is chubbs1002@hotmail.com (don't send me any email there though) and we can discuss how to max the game. I will send you the MSN encryption software so noone can detect that we are speaking though.
I figure we can take down about $5k before anyone notices.
(see?)
ummmmm...... are you being sarcastic....... because York certainly was.
He was just kidding.
I checked out the site ....... looks like you can only use software on PS, paradise, and Party. Does anyone know any different? How exactly does it work anyway ....... has it cracked the card generator or something? It even has an autoplay mode ....... unbelievable!!
 Just for fun, I forwarded the winholdem thread above to UB ....... I'll let you know if they have anything interesting to say.
Thank you for your concern regarding WinHoldem and PokerStars.
WinHoldem violates not one, but two separate sections of our terms of
service: engaging in automated play and hole card sharing.
The use of WinHoldem is absolutely forbidden on PokerStars, as is the
use of any other packages that violate these rules.
PokerStars monitors players to detect the use of WinHoldem, and when
use of this forbidden package is discovered we will take appropriate
remedial action against the player using it.
Thank you for your concern and report. The integrity of our games
remains our highest concern. We hope you continue to enjoy the games
here on PokerStars, secure in the knowledge that we do everything
possible to ensure a safe playing environment for our players.
Regards,
Adam
PokerStars Support Team
Or I could just be paranoid.