'Underground' tournament situation.
Last night, $250 buy-in, $100 add-on, 36 players.
We are down to 2 tables, 200/400 blinds, I have an average stack of just over 5000 or so. I'm on the button with pocket kings.
Folded to the cut-off, who just calls. I make it 1600, both blinds fold, the cut-off calls.
Flop: AA6. He pushes all-in, almost immediately. He has me covered by about 1K or so, and I know nothing about him except he's a good 15 or 20 years older than me. (I'd only been at the table for about 2 orbits, and hadn't seen anything unusual from him.)
Call or fold?
Regards,
all_aces
We are down to 2 tables, 200/400 blinds, I have an average stack of just over 5000 or so. I'm on the button with pocket kings.
Folded to the cut-off, who just calls. I make it 1600, both blinds fold, the cut-off calls.
Flop: AA6. He pushes all-in, almost immediately. He has me covered by about 1K or so, and I know nothing about him except he's a good 15 or 20 years older than me. (I'd only been at the table for about 2 orbits, and hadn't seen anything unusual from him.)
Call or fold?
Regards,
all_aces
Comments
Just my thoughts.
My guess is you call and he has A9 off though :frown: .
If my opponent consciously plays an Ace this way, then I probably get outplayed by a nice reverse reverse tell. If the opponent is a relative newbie (I'd expect you to have already noticed this, so I assume that's not the case here), I'm never calling in a million years.
Your opponent has 2 outs... hope he didn't spike one on you.
ScottyZ
He may be holding an A with a weak kicker, or worse holding the other two sixes. Either way it is better to live another day. You still have a stack to play on.
love to know the outcome.
Just my thoughts....
The reason he pushed all in is that he is looking at you as some youngster, new comer to the table. He views you as loose player and because of this, he can push all in and figures he'll get called by you anyway. Worst case for him (hopefully) is you call with your Ace and the pot is split. I don't think he wants to slowplay here because he doesn't want to run the risk of you catching something on the turn or river. He caught his Aces on the flop and he wants you to show him your Ace. This bet might not necessarily even be about the flop, he might think you have a weaker kicker, or he wants you to think that he has a strong one.
I don't know of many people calling a pre-flop raise, then bluffing when 2 Aces hit on the flop. But I could be wrong.
Very interested in what he had!
Either way, I still think a fold is in order. You said it yourself. You dont know what kind of player he is. Is it worth all your chips to find out?
I do it myself on occasion (bluffing the Ace on the flop), especially when I find a person who will call big raises with stuff like KXos and low pockets. But I will only do it when I have a good read on the person and his style of play.
As for calling. It's a coin flip, it all really depends on your read of the player, and since you say you don't really have one. I would probably fold. He might have called with a AX sooted hoping to hit the flush and is worried about his kicker. He might have called with low pocket pair and bet hoping that you don't have an Ace, but a JJ/QQ or something.
This is a though call no matter what. Now I really wanna know what happened.
As aside note, which is now thought out, if I were in this exact situation I would (hope I would) fold as long as it is not a winner takes all tourney then I call and hope for the best. Considering it is a rebuy then it is probably well worth just placing to me.
Jamie.
Call.. His bet is telling you that he doesn't have the ace but a better kicker than the 6.. If the flop was two suited, fold. He's protecting his ace.
There's also a secondary question you need to ask yourself in this situation.. "Do you want to dance?" ie Do you need to get all your chips in the pot right here right now? Is the blind structure agressive.. Are you commanding the game? etc.. I've found that since I switched over to limit in the past 2 months, I forget to ask myself these questions and land up busting out on a 55% chance early in tournaments..
The only reason you guessed that is because you figured theres a hidden point that aces is trying to make.
He noticed how you pushed your chips in and by the time he moved the toothpick from the left side to the right side of his mouth he had you pegged with a high pair. Unfortunately you didn't notice the small bead of sweat that had been clinging to your temple start to make it's way down the side of your face. Oh sure, you felt pretty good behind those sunglasses and under that faded John Deer baseball cap but your breathing had changed and he smelled the fear in you like a fresh skunk lying on the side of a two lane highway just outside of Wingham.
Your only move at this point is to fold. Give him the hand and watch him like a hawk.
(ok, so maybe some of that isn't quite what happened ... but it makes for good reading)
I'm guessing that you said this because I figure you have a hidden point that you're trying to make.
And the opponent has 76 s0000ted.
[Hint: That was meant to be a humorous guess, but I'll take full credit if I'm right.]
I really guess he has a pocket pair 77-TT.
ScottyZ
So, here's what happened.
He moved in, I thought for about 4 seconds, and called him. I showed him my kings, and then he looked at them... and looked at them... and looked at them... and flipped over A4o. The bastard slowrolled me, after calling a 1200 raise preflop with A4o. Here's the bottom line:
I got outplayed on the flop by someone who was stupid enough to call 1200 more with A4o. Yuck. I believe I said something to the effect of: "It was so obvious it was true". I love the way he played the hand after the flop, I really do. Pre-flop, however, the guy's a nut, and here's why.
He is getting almost NO implied odds here. The only way he's going to get my chips is if exactly 2 or exactly 3 aces come on the flop. If only one falls, I'm out of there at my earliest opportunity. When two fall, obviously that reduces the chances of him holding one, and that combined with his immediate all-in made me call.
So, he calls for 1600 with A4o hoping that exactly two or three aces flop. What a player. However, as I said, I love the way he played the flop, and I'm going to steal that move from him and use it myself from time to time.
Regards,
all_aces
ps: I called the TD today (Azim) and found out that he did not make the money. Surprise surprise. And it could have been worse... my first table was wacko. A very good player (I don't know this to be true, but I heard he plays Aruba, and some other major tournaments on a regular basis) got knocked out in the first 20 minutes when a player called a raise for over half of his stack with Q6s preflop. I won't get into details. But man. Oh. Man.
ScottyZ
All in all I don't like his play in this hand at all. The fact that he slow rolls it at the end makes me hurt. It would have been very hard not to tear his heart out!!!!
A-4..... Ouch, however, he did still have the Ace :frown:
At some point everyone has to make a move. He knew he had the Ace and just took a shot! Maybe he had a good read on you? Gambling every once in awhile is still a part of poker. By the sounds of it though...He gambled one too many times and eventually busted himself out.
It's a tough one to lay down. Judging by everyone else's responses, they feel the same way. Folding is very tough to do sometimes.
Everyday is a new learning experience. Good Post Aces!!
Thanks! I'm glad to be able to post my mistakes here in the hopes that people can learn from them... most importantly, myself.
Cheers,
all_aces
[/QUOTE]Pre-flop, however, the guy's a nut, and here's why.
He is getting almost NO implied odds here. The only way he's going to get my chips is if exactly 2 or exactly 3 aces come on the flop. If only one falls, I'm out of there at my earliest opportunity. .[/QUOTE] Maybe so, but I doubt he analysed things this way; he's thinking - if an ace hits, I WIN! And that's how he bet it. Heck, maybe he gets lucky and you call with a strong pair
Aces - a question - had he checked the flop, would you have moved in? Or would you have checked it also?
Another question - had just one ace flopped and he checked it to you, would you have also checked?
THanks,
NH
I generally manage not to go broke with a pocket pair and an overcard on the board.
If he had checked the flop--with one ace or two--I would have bet enough to find out if he had an ace. Then I would have exited the hand stage right, after having lost a lot of chips but nowhere near my entire stack.
Cheers,
all_aces
I agree he had no buisness be in the hand after it was reaised preflop considering we knew what you had but, he was already in the hand and although it was a bad call to continue after the flop,he did. He was hoping to catch an ace as my thinking is someone raising in the blind(s) usually has a large pair.
As far as the betting out after two aces, I think it was a good play as you said someone going all in after the flop and not slow playing trips makes you believe he does not have an ace.
I would like to know how you would have played this.
Poker stars tourney 10+1. 850 player, down to 17, I was 3rd in chips with 350K.
I raised 25k from the button with A 8 suited and the small blind (chip leader 560K)re-raised to 75k. Really I should have folded but I called.
Flop comes A88 - small blind raises 50k -
Would you slowplay or end it right there?
Answer to come.
Ummm...
I thought your opponent was the big blind, bet only 12,000 on the flop, you called, and then he bet 50,000 on the turn when it came 5h. Too bad your opponent made Tens full on the river though.
Let
it
go.
ScottyZ
If you play for a flop, and an ace comes out, staying in the hand is always a major gamble...regardless of how your opponent played pre-flop...
In pusing, there is a good chance you also just win the blinds and buddy's call - which won't win you the event right there, but sure as hell beats getting knocked out, and then of course, you can get callers with shitty hands and double up.
I definitely would have folded that hand - especially since you knew nothing about this player. Calling with cowboys against aces on the board is a coin flip at best. Better to lay em down and try and double up on a more sneaky play. It sucks to be tight sometimes, but here, I think it was the smart play.
I will remember this hand for BIPC V though....
It is a $250 buyin tourney and there is an optional $100 add-on after an hour. This tourney attracts between 33-40 players on a regular basis and is held every Tuesday (Tonight).
First prize is in the region of $5000
Thanks