<Beat> but advice desired

Redington

I tanked on this for 45 seconds and was pretty sure I made the right decision;

Anyone else?

Button had been opening just about every HJ+



PokerStars Game #15227233569: Tournament #77138731, $50+$5 Hold'em No Limit - Level V (75/150) - 2008/02/11 - 23:18:13 (ET)
Table '77138731 1' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 3: Lacoda.Z (1940 in chips)
Seat 6: Roswel (3760 in chips)
Seat 7: hms350 (2060 in chips)
Seat 8: LLBilly (2095 in chips)
Seat 9: eshelton (3645 in chips)
Lacoda.Z: posts small blind 75
Roswel: posts big blind 150
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Roswel [As Tc]
hms350: folds
LLBilly: folds
eshelton: raises 300 to 450
Lacoda.Z: folds
Roswel: calls 300
*** FLOP ***
Roswel: bets 1050
eshelton: raises 2145 to 3195 and is all-in
Roswel: calls 2145
*** TURN *** [6h]
*** RIVER *** [Qs]
*** SHOW DOWN ***

Results below;

Roswel: shows [As Tc] (a pair of Tens)
eshelton: shows [Jc Kh] (a straight, Nine to King)
eshelton collected 7365 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 7365 | Rake 0
Board
Seat 3: Lacoda.Z (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: Roswel (big blind) showed [As Tc] and lost with a pair of Tens
Seat 7: hms350 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: LLBilly folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: eshelton (button) showed [Jc Kh] and won (7365) with a straight, Nine to King

Buddha

Redington wrote: »

Button had been opening just about every HJ+

Considering that, you made the right call. I don't like calling an all-in with top pair, but considering your read on the villain, it was the correct decision. Sorry it didn't work out that time.

Kristy

haven't looked at the results yet.

I'm not sure that I like the strong lead out on the flop. It is not usually the best way to get more money into the pot if you are truly confident you are winning, and I'm not sure there that I'm so in love with my a-10 there that I want all my chips in?

but once you did lead out 1k+ I think you should've already made the decision to marry your tptk, and so the 45second tank tells me that you've got to choose one side or the other to play this hand better.

If he's really just a frisky lp raiser, why not take his chips pf?

MY GUESS: He had KQs and was trying to stomp on you for leading into him? (but it is wayyyy funnier if he hit one of the straights)

Edit: HAHAHA

JimmyHo

I would think he has you beat with the all-in; its a tough call; if he has an over pair, such is life. If he hit trips, such is life. Anything else, he's just a donkey and got lucky. If he has trip tens, you are the donkey (joking . Top pair is always a tough hand, especially with an ace kicker. You think you are good, but there are too many hands that can beat you.

Kristy

SPOILER ALERT:

villian has 10 outs twice and Tyson is showing all kinds of weakness. I probably fist Tyson pretty often here with only a slightly stronger hand than what villian actually had, KdQx or a slightly weaker board: rainbow instead of 2d.

actyper

I like check raising the flop instead.

Redington

Thanks, Kristy your so bang on. Not to mention hot and I want to do you on a bed of poker chips!=)

I should have pushed on the flop. If I truly believed that he had a wide opening range and I was OOP I should have restole preflop or pushed on the flop.

Calling here is sooo weak. Heehaw...man I am such a donkey... maybe I should go into bestiality porn

pkrfce9

i really hate this site. i type in a detailed analysis, post the reply and the fucker tells me i'm not logged on. there's a 'beat' for ya! fuck that shit.

ok, what hands push here? better ones for sure but also your donk bet looks pretty weak so you'll find strong draws, some weaker pairs, possibly weak draws and even complete bluffs pushing against you. you haven't told us hardly any details of the table or your image at all. have you laid down big hands by any chance? have you shown that your donk bets represent strong or weak hands? does he generally continuation bet? you are getting about 2:1 on your money so against this range you have to call failing a strong read on your opponent.

but i don't think you should have gotten yourself into this situation in the first place. i think you need to go back to the PF action. based on your categorization of him as loose-aggressive, it is likely you are no worse than 50/50 here, possibly 60/40 or even 75/25 but almost never worse than 30%. has he shown the ability to lay down to a re-raise? have you been very active? any previous re-raises here?

you are the chip leader with 25xbb with 2 to go to the money. your opponent is second stack and is aggressive. do you really need a big scrap here to get to the money? i'm pretty cautious in these situations since my first goal is to not blow an almost certain money finish. how bad are the other players?

i much prefer a re-raise preflop, say to 1200. if he pushes then i guess i have stuck my neck out but with all the dead money in the pot it really comes down to a read. i guess that's not a very good spot to be in either but i really prefer it over just calling a raise from a loose-aggressive player with a hand that is good but vulnerable.

Kristy

lmao! ghost text is my fav! I feel obligated to include some having said that.

Redington

but i don't think you should have gotten yourself into this situation in the first place. i think you need to go back to the PF action. based on your categorization of him as loose-aggressive, it is likely you are no worse than 50/50 here, possibly 60/40 or even 75/25 but almost never worse than 30%. has he shown the ability to lay down to a re-raise? have you been very active? any previous re-raises here?

Yep, this is a player that has been very tight, but in the typical standard on PS has really started to push his HJ, CO and button late.

Absolutely should have restole. It was so weak not to and a HUGE leak as chips are so important here.

Is this an example where I should be pushing with a small edge, but folding to a push with a small edge?

you are the chip leader with 25xbb with 2 to go to the money. your opponent is second stack and is aggressive. do you really need a big scrap here to get to the money? i'm pretty cautious in these situations since my first goal is to not blow an almost certain money finish. how bad are the other players?

That thought crossed my mind, but all of his chips have come from strong openings in the last couple of rounds so I thought I was ahead, and I did not want to give him control in the last rounds.

I also want to go FTW rather then money. Wrong in a STT?
Haha Kristy Im using Net nyms now...woowoo I feel like a man
Table is VERY tight think it was vpip of 15.

i much prefer a re-raise preflop, say to 1200. if he pushes then i guess i have stuck my neck out but with all the dead money in the pot it really comes down to a read. i guess that's not a very good spot to be in either but i really prefer it over just calling a raise from a loose-aggressive player with a hand that is good but vulnerable.

How do you feel about a push here? PF I mean

Hobbes

Kristy_Sea wrote: »

lmao! ghost text is my fav! I feel obligated to include some having said that.

Esp when Tyson responds after that to a different post.

pkrfce9

you have too many chips to push PF. the only hands that call are way ahead or else the guy is a complete moron.

i don't like a push on the flop either. again such a large overbet only gets called by morons and hands that kill you. CR may have been a better option, you get your money in ahead but you are still likely getting called.

it's a tough hand to play. your stack is an awkward size. i'm not sure there is an 'ideal' way to play it. i'd prefer to be more aggressive PF and hopefully he is smart enough to avoid risking busting out without a premium hand.

your question about winning vs getting into the money is a good one. with SNGs, my goal is getting to the money and still having a good shot at first or second. with a shorter stack i'm much more aggressive nearing the bubble but with a big stack, i'll go more for stealing against weaker players or getting it in with a premium hand. that way doesn't always work either...

moose

Redington wrote: »

I also want to go FTW rather then money. Wrong in a STT?
Haha Kristy Im using Net nyms now...woowoo I feel like a man

I used to think the same but reread Harrington vol3. It gets so coin flippy late anyways that unless you have a huge lead I think that his discussion of making the money first is valid. I've adjusted my thinking lately more towards that end.

pkrfce9

moose wrote: »

I used to think the same but reread Harrington vol3. It gets so coin flippy late anyways that unless you have a huge lead I think that his discussion of making the money first is valid. I've adjusted my thinking lately more towards that end.

woohoo! another convert. this makes it official. tyson IS a donkey!

the winning vs making the money is a stronger argument in a big mtt where all the money is in the top few spots.

p.s ghost text rulz

DataMn

I agree with Moose & Pokerface - getting into the money is more important than getting a huge stack at this point.

If you get into the money with 27.8% of the chips in play (about what you have at the start of this hand) then your equity is around $157. If you get in with double that amount (55.6%) then your equity only jumps to $199, but if you lose a big hand right before the bubble to the other chip leader then your equity goes down to 0.

(if these numbers seem a bit odd, remember that once you get into the money $300 of the $500 (60%) in play will be settled - you are in effect only playing for 40% of the total prize pool)

Thus, you need to be sure that you are going to win 3.73 times for every time that you lose - 78.8% of the time.

This is the big difference in play around the bubble between MTT and Sit-n-gos. You have to be a lot tighter in a Sit-N-Go around the bubble.

Milo

This is why I hate A,10. Based on your assessment of his range, you were either a little ahead, or way behind pre-flop. Post-flop it becomes a push, or check-fold, situation based on pot-to-stack ratios. Once you called his initial raise, you were at a threshold point for your stack. Unfortunately, you chose A instead of B. I've been there many times, unfortunately.

ReefAquarium

Easy good decision.

Kristy

I think I woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning, but the late activity in this thread is pissing me off.

Tyson says: I did A
Kristy says: Did you consider B,C?
Tyson says: Ok, I see and am understanding you completely Kristy: Q/R FTW!
Greg says: what about 11
Moose says: 11 is my new favourite letter!
Datamn says: Go Moose and Greg I want to have your babies!
Milo says: A, Q, R, make me want to listen to EMO
Reef_Aquarium says: Can't we all just get along? Tyson I like you for you.

and all my posts feel like this, I'm not responding because I'm sure; I'm expressing my POV on the situation and would like to discuss it.

I rarely get feedback here good or bad.

BlondeFish

I agree with all the initial decisions you made: calling instead of re-raising against the other big stack, making a pot-sized value bet on the flop, and making the correct call against the all-in re-raise with 2.4-to-1 pot odds. I disagree with your second-guessing questions. Using ICM analysis with the flatter prize structure, it is more $EV to play conservatively and make it to the money first instead of making high-variance plays to win-or-bubble.

The two big stacks should have been ganging up on the three short stacks instead of eshelton going to war against the biggest stack with a non-premium hand, but eshelton also had your high-risk go FTW attitude. One of the big stacks would be eliminated, letting two of the short stacks sneak into the money.

Redington wrote: »

Absolutely should have restole. It was so weak not to and a HUGE leak as chips are so important here.

Is this an example where I should be pushing with a small edge, but folding to a push with a small edge?

I also want to go FTW rather then money. Wrong in a STT?

How do you feel about a push here? PF I mean

ChrisWinsor

Right call, but thats not a bad beat really. He had 14 outs at the flop.