Angle Shot or Not?

MrCaspan

I was watching this live on PokerGo and have not seen a clip to share to discuss. Do you think Sam should have been disqualified?

Action starts at 2m:48s

https://youtu.be/_QWMV23SdoI

Interview with him on Joe Ingram show, starts right at the beginning
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDubjr0ybIQ

DrTyore

When I first saw this, I heard someone say that he's done stuff like this before, and is kinda right up his alley...

If legit mistake, sucks... if legit a move? Angle shot - and should have some penalty... a DQ? Tough to say...

Mark

MrCaspan

I think any game in the money there should be a standard rule about folding out of turn even if they are in an all-in situation or not. You gain to make money form these mistakes or purposeful angle shots. I'm not sure what the punishment should be but it should fit the crime. Its a hard spot and this is why rules exist at the table like all in buttons so there is no mistake. Also I think players should have to make a verbal deceleration before the next player moves, if they don't its up to the player to ask the dealer what the action is. Very clear statements like CALL, RAISE, FOLD. That way there is no excuse for this kind of angle shot to happen without just not paying attention and you are at fault for that then.

djgolfcan

It really looks like he thought the other guy folded, the time bank chip sliding across could be mistaken for cards sliding into the much. Especially considering how long they must have been playing, etc...
Definitely some kind of penalty, but not a DQ, that would be too severe, especially since he made it to 4 handed.

MrCaspan

djgolfcan;413637 wroteIt really looks like he thought the other guy folded, the time bank chip sliding across could be mistaken for cards sliding into the much

Yeah time bank cards do look like cards or a single chip being thrown in. Maybe even having the dealer after the hand settle up time cards so there is no motions like that in a hand.

djgolfcan

I have always thought that poker players should verbalize what their action is before chips, cards, or any other movement is done. It would eliminate all this crap.
If he said, "Time", then put in the time bank chip as opposed to just sliding it in, it would make it less likely that the other player plays out of turn.
just like "Raise" and then say the amount, instead of other players having to guess what the other one just did

MrCaspan

djgolfcan;413639 wroteI have always thought that poker players should verbalize what their action is before chips, cards, or any other movement is done. It would eliminate all this crap.
If he said, "Time", then put in the time bank chip as opposed to just sliding it in, it would make it less likely that the other player plays out of turn.
just like "Raise" and then say the amount, instead of other players having to guess what the other one just did

Completely agree with this...

DrTyore

There are a tonne of bad habits that poker players do to "be cool" that cause shit like this...

The fact that the guy throwing his time bank chip could have been misinterpreted as someone throwing 1 chip in for an all in call (or call in general) directly lead to this angle / misunderstanding. All the bullshit of people doing stuff like this, not announcing their intentions, asking the other guy to show his cards "no I called you" kinda stupidity. Play the game, don't try to be Paul fucking Newman.

Mark

MrCaspan

DrTyore;413641 wroteThere are a tonne of bad habits that poker players do to "be cool" that cause shit like this...

The fact that the guy throwing his time bank chip could have been misinterpreted as someone throwing 1 chip in for an all in call (or call in general) directly lead to this angle / misunderstanding. All the bullshit of people doing stuff like this, not announcing their intentions, asking the other guy to show his cards "no I called you" kinda stupidity. Play the game, don't try to be Paul fucking Newman.

Mark

I thought I was the only one that thought this... Look right at the dealer and say CALL, ALL IN.. they cant misinterpret that!! Like you said Mark, people trying to act like the pro and walk the walk! I try to be verbal with every action I make. even when I check its an over exaggerated hand out double tap, some people just tap the felt with their cards in their hands and it's like "was that a check or you thinking" ?

DrTyore

There was a video a few years back where two guys were on full d-bag mode.. let me see if I can find it..

I can't.. basically, some dick bet the river, other dick calls, and they both say flip / show your cards... "i called you" "I bet" dick dick dick... eventually the guy with Q high shows one, and kinda mucks (both cards are identifiable) and the other guy celebrates showing like J high.. then pisses and moans when the dealer shows the other (again, identifiable card) and awards the pot to the other guy.. pisses, moans, and is a dick.

Mark