ROI in MTTs

sn1perb0y

While playing at Fallsview WPT satellite, there was a middle age decent player talking about ROI at my table. He was saying that very good players make a ROI of 100% in MTTs. I told him this is not possible because this technically means they double their money in every MTT they play. Good players usually have around 20% ROI. He said: No, What i mean is that in the long run if they invest 300$ playing tournaments in the long run its 600$. It didn't make sense for me and i thought that was wrong, but i just said okay because i wasn't 100% sure.

May someone give me the right definition of ROI and a simple example?

Thank you.

pkrfce9

he is an idiot.

total profits/total buy ins

mine is 0

pkrfce9

and don't talk to idiots at the table. unless you are Jah and having fun

compuease

pkrfce9;369847 wroteand don't talk to idiots at the table. unless you are Jah and having fun

Don't agree, reinforce their misbeliefs and profit! re ROI, is it possible to be -? If so that's me..

sn1perb0y

so if someone played 10 $1 tournaments and cashed for $20 total (profited $10). so 10/10 *100% so this player has 100% ROI? Damn i feel smart hehe

Does it matter how many tournaments is played or only the $buy-in?

sn1perb0y

compuease;369852 wroteDon't agree, reinforce their misbeliefs and profit! re ROI, is it possible to be -? If so that's me..

I think it is possible, now if you played 10 1$ tournaments and cashed for 5$ (loss of -$5). -5/10*100% your roi is -50%.

pkrfce9

Yes you should track by buy in. I expect roi at 1 is different than roi at 2500.

tapatalk puts this here to annoy YOU

pkrfce9

And I hope your sample sizes and variance are quite different too

tapatalk puts this here to annoy YOU

compuease

sn1perb0y;369864 wroteI think it is possible, now if you played 10 1$ tournaments and cashed for 5$ (loss of -$5). -5/10*100% your roi is -50%.

Not sure I'm clear on it either.

Is ROI profit/buyins expressed as a % OR is it Winnings-Buyins/buyins? One way means you can't go negative whereas the 2nd way means you can go negative.

eg supposed I have total buyins of $1000. and winnings of $800. (therefore 0 profit) my ROI is also 0 calculated the 1st way or 800-1000/1000 or -20% the 2nd way.

If I had the same buyins and winnings of $1200. then my ROI is (1200-1000)/1000 an ROI of +20% either way

At least this is my understanding.

Bfillmaff

compuease;369876 wroteIs ROI profit/buyins expressed as a % OR is it Winnings-Buyins/buyins?

trick question... both forumlas are the same!

profit = winnings-buyins

therefore profit/buyins = winnings-buyins/buyins

compuease;369876 wrote One way means you can't go negative whereas the 2nd way means you can go negative.

damn right you can go into the negative... this is poker!! The profit can go both ways so you have to include all losses in ROI, you cant just use 0.

buyins = 100
winnings = 110
profit = 10
ROI = 10%

buyins = 100
winnings = 95
profit = -5
ROI = -5%

compuease

semantics, semantics... Profit by definition is on the plus side. If it's on the negative side it's called loss..

Bfillmaff

yeah i meant to put "profit" in quotes. What I am trying to say is that yes you must account for both profit and loss. To answer your question though go with your second example!

compuease

Bfillmaff;369884 wroteyeah i meant to put "profit" in quotes. What I am trying to say is that yes you must account for both profit and loss. To answer your question though go with your second example!

lol, oh I agree we need to show a negative ROI if it is there... Just wondering why we never see anyone with a -neg ROI.. Selective formulae's perhaps?;)

Wetts1012

compuease;369886 wrotelol, oh I agree we need to show a negative ROI if it is there... Just wondering why we never see anyone with a -neg ROI.. Selective formulae's perhaps?;)

Have you seen my 2013 live poker spreadsheet? thats a big negative number!

2014 gonna make up for it tho.

compuease

Wetts1012;369887 wroteHave you seen my 2013 live poker spreadsheet? thats a big negative number!

2014 gonna make up for it tho.

Was this the one that resulted in a ladies wear shopping trip? ;)

You are the one of the few people on here whom I trust to accurately reflect your results if you so chose to publish them... At some point I would love to have a chance to play at your table again.... Your poker style is something I can only aspire to...

marban

compuease;369882 wrotesemantics, semantics... Profit by definition is on the plus side. If it's on the negative side it's called loss..

i agree with the old guy, im old too, either im up or down..same with betting horses, i either leave the track a winner or a loser..............ROI, term prolly invented by some 30 something bean counter..lol..:)

BlondeFish

While some will never understand, ROI, rake, EV and other calculations are very important in poker. The ROI formula I use is
Return on investment (%) = (Net profit / Total buy-ins) × 100.

Only the buy-ins are put in the formula, but the number of tourneys or sample size is very important. Looking at my OPR, my ROI is -100% in Limit tourneys, i.e., I did not cash in only SIX Limit tourneys that I mistakenly played due to the bad software. My ROI in Omaha tourneys is +205%, since I cashed in 1 out 3 Omaha tourneys I played. For NLHE, my ROI is 99% with 24% ITM.

sn1perb0y;369862 wroteso if someone played 10 $1 tournaments and cashed for $20 total (profited $10). so 10/10 *100% so this player has 100% ROI? Damn i feel smart hehe

Does it matter how many tournaments is played or only the $buy-in?

marban

BlondeFish;369956 wroteWhile some will never understand, ROI, rake, EV and other calculations are very important in poker. The ROI formula I use is
Return on investment (%) = (Net profit / Total buy-ins) × 100.

Only the buy-ins are put in the formula, but the number of tourneys or sample size is very important. Looking at my OPR, my ROI is -100% in Limit tourneys, i.e., I did not cash in only SIX Limit tourneys that I mistakenly played due to the bad bad software. My ROI in Omaha tourneys is +205%, since I cashed in 1 out 3 Omaha tourneys I played. For NLHE, my ROI is 99% with 24% ITM.

what the heck does all that mean?

regards, Mathtard..???

trigs

marban;369978 wrotewhat the heck does all that mean?

regards, Mathtard..???

it's called a (not so) subtle brag >:D

marban

yep, i get very confused when someone tries to communicate with me, using alphabet soup,

regards. i am the fish at the table:)