Brutal 1/2 hand Bellagio

Movowelling

I butchered this hand every street and I KNEW it while it was happening but I couldn't even stop myself.

I'm SB with 300$ BB is the best player at the table and has about 800$. Folded to the puck and he makes it 15. I look down at 10-10. I call. BB makes it 40. Puck folds. At this point these things are crossing my mind:
1) I don't need to get involved in this hand ESP against the best player who has me covered. Lots of players (tourists who were worse than me)
2) I should re raise to see where I am.

BUT I call.

Flop comes 5-8-9 rainbow.

I check. He bets 50$. I call
Turn comes 5. I check he bets 50$ and I call
River comes 3 and I lead out 100$ he puts me all in. He shows 88

My question. Ok to fold Pre to the 40 re raise? I really wanted to but I'm terrible and was drunk.

moose

I'm not flatting the first $15 unless button is incredibly spewy and I'm going to check call every street regardless of the board. As played, if you flat/4 bet, bb probably reads you for weakly played ak or midpr and shoves. Zero chance he folds preflop unless you shove first.

BlondeFish

I would have 3-bet vs. the puck, not flatted.
As played, I would 4-bet ~70% of the time vs. BB squeezer & flat the rest of the time. Folding TT would usually be the worst play.

Movowelling;357021 wroteMy question. Ok to fold Pre to the 40 re raise? I really wanted to but I'm terrible and was drunk.

Movowelling

Yeah button was my friend. More spewy than me. So, once I incorrectly call the first raise, I should have pushed or folded on that 40 pop Pre? Is it more tourney thinking to want to fold that hand so as not to tangle?

GTA Poker

This is a tough situation.

As played:

Live 1/2 150BB deep in a vacuum I call the 15 and probably feel that I'm wayyyyy behind the BB raise to 40 and muck...haha, who am I kidding, I call. BUT, I usually have a super loose table image and am often doubling through BB if I accurately know his range and hit my set...again, in a vacuum I think I fold. The reason for calling would be partly because I want a larger stack to play with and I am willing to play a bit looser to get more chips (assuming there are other larger stacks at the table).

IMO folding = calling < 4betting. BB 3betting with < JJ+ and AK in that spot is pretty rare at 1/2.

Never 4 bet pre in that spot in a 1/2 cash game with only 150bb.

Other lines:

You CAN 3 bet preflop but I prefer flatting to try and win a larger pot post-flop. Again, this is very player dependent and images play in to some degree. 3betting you either tid preflop and make $15 or you get 4 bet and have to fold or you get flatted and play a large pot oop. This isn't a tournament where you are fighting for the blinds.

I won't get into metagame examples but there are some other decent reasons for 3 betting preflop in that spot. For most players at 1/2 they would not really apply.

BlondeFish

Movowelling;357032 wroteSo, once I incorrectly call the first raise, I should have pushed or folded on that 40 pop Pre?

I thought that folding TT was the worst play, but pushing for $300 may be even worse!

GTA Poker

Movowelling;357032 wroteYeah button was my friend. More spewy than me. So, once I incorrectly call the first raise, I should have pushed or folded on that 40 pop Pre? Is it more tourney thinking to want to fold that hand so as not to tangle?

Fold or call and have a reason as to why you are doing one or the other.

Never shove 150bb at 1/2 with TT. You are being way too results oriented.

Milo

Movowelling;357032 wroteYeah button was my friend. More spewy than me. So, once I incorrectly call the first raise, I should have pushed or folded on that 40 pop Pre? Is it more tourney thinking to want to fold that hand so as not to tangle?

Maybe you called rather than raise because he is your pal? You were out of position but likely ahead of your pal, so why not make it less inviting for the BB to play?

I think you should have raised to $40.00. That way, after a raise and a re-raise, the BB has to more clearly define his hand for you.

moose

I'm not saying push, I'm saying it as played, it would have taken a 4 bet shove to get BB to go away and not a good move unless you've seen BB 3bet a wide range in this situation. You have $300, he has $800. What 4 bet could you make that doesn't effectively commit your stack on any flop if called by BB?

The way the hand played out, he hit the set and you found a board that made it tough to fold. After check calling two streets, I'm unclear on the thinking re suddenly leading out. The board didn't change, there was nothing scary there that makes BB suddenly fold if he was ahead and it was a small bet relative to the pot, so you are getting looked up 100% of the time by hands that beat you. Nothing that has happened in the hand so far says that you are value betting. River becomes a check/fold or check/call depending on how you feel about the crying call.

The ones to watch out for are the ones where it looks like villian is dividing up your stack into portions that end up committing you by the river. It's a good bet then in those situations that you are badly behind.

Movowelling

Wasn't in the original (if it makes any difference?) but the river completed a flush. Drunk enough I lead out thinking I could represent that. Wrong in the end.

JimmyHo

Movowelling;357021 wroteMy question. Ok to fold Pre to the 40 re raise?

For another $25, I never fold here. Especially with $275 behind and the other player having me covered. I'm not sure why you would check/call both the flop and turn, but bet on the river? Problem with this hand is you are not that deep so its hard to re-raise and not be pot committed. You can't really re-raise the flop to $120-$150 and get away from the hand. Its hard to fold an overpair in this situation. I may check/call the flop and see if he bets again on the turn. A lot of players continuation bet on the flop and give up on the turn. I may also lead out on the flop and if he re-raises me, I may be able to get away from the hand (or I could end up shoving as I hate money).

Meistro

You definitely could fold to the 25 more. It's intelligent to avoid the tough players. It's not a great idea to let them have position on you every hand - assuming they are aggressive - but like you said, you were drunk. A big problem is you are going to be out of position on every street. It's 25 to win 70. Getting less than 3:1, and being a 7.5:1 dog to hit your set you could justify a call on implied odds basis if you plan to set mine but I personally don't enjoy relying on implied odds too much.

What do you make of the original raisers opening range? If he would open a lot of hands there, you could three bet. TT is a tough hand to play a big pot with though... so he would have to be opening a crazy amount there or playing horrendously after the flop for me to want to venture into playing a big pot there.

Villain's three bet pre is a little on the small side, but without being there it's difficult to say exactly what that represents.

Typically when you call 4 or more times in a hand you played it poorly.