I feel great!

Muddguts

why? because after a 7 hour session of suffering suckouts and coolers worthy of a Hollywood script and watching the same thing happen to everyone else, I have to come to the conclusion that for the very select few, internet poker is a scam. By coming to that realization, it has now allowed me to free up the 10-20 hours or so that I waste sitting on my ass and shaking my head in disbelief and laughing at the absurdity of Jokerstars that I can now concentrate on other things that I enjoy and that I have been neglecting. I'll still play the forum games and live poker of course but having my blood pressure boil as I watch people shove their stacks into my aces only to have the board flush or straighten out to send me on my way or to have my PLO hand of KKKJJ get beaten by JJJJ is over. I have already destroyed one expensive laptop and quite honestly, I have no idea how this one I am typing on survived tonight.

Ahhh, that was theraputic. Good luck to the grinders here. I'll stick the BAP portion of it internet "poker" for now on :)

kwsteve

If I wasn't addicted I'd quit too.

[deleted]

I know your mostly just venting but I know the feeling, so here's my 2 cents

Poker is strange game/hobby/task, different from other things because variance can mess with the truth. Winning the pot doesn't mean we played correctly so in a way you can't learn poker like you learn anything else. The best way to judge skill is over a large sample size and most people won't ever even play that many games.

For many people, being profitable isn't even important, just winning is nice sometimes. But for most winning a little more than they used to would make them a lot happier.

I seen that you open limp Aces. However, if you always raise them your roi will increase. As a poker play I will tell you it will go up slightly. But if i was a coach I would tell you that it will change your perspective on the game and have a dramatic effect on how you view poker. But you have to do it to see it.

Obviously people have different reasons for playing, but what I would want people to know is how vast this game is. Ive studied it for about 3 years now and I blow my mind away every week with the amount of new stuff I learn, and even more stuff that I realize I have yet to learn.

So I think even recreational players, would enjoy learning a little about the game every time they play and I think its important they understand how deep the strategy goes.

Also, having a really simple but correct preflop early game construct would do wonders for many people. If the cards were always face up we could easily see that the person raising A7o under the gun is going to lose a lot of chips over his career to better aces. The same goes for flatting a hand like k9o....if the cards were face up it would be obvious that k9o is going to lose more often than not to better kings from earlier position....but people still do it. A construct changes all that, and its fairly instant.

Kinda obvious I guess but the point is if you have a proper construct to build off of the chips just sort of come your way...I can't give it because I'm not good enough but its just basically a chart of what hands you play from each position and the bet sizing (usually 3x).

philliivey

I hear ya muddguts I am a lil frustrated on stars right now myself after a good start to the month.

Maybe I will put up a small Bap and I can run bad for you;)

RWPKRPLR

IMO I don't think u should have to quit playing online poker due to the bad beats... If you use bankroll management theories, you should be able to come out above after all that variance comes your way.

Also maybe take a few of your playing hours and use them for study time. I found this helped my game greatly. Reading posts on this forum when someone posts in the analyze my hand section shows you new ways of going about playing a situation you may have encountered before and will encounter in the future.

Everyone on this forum has had a ton of bad beats! Maybe next time when It happens, post that hand and discuss it. I bet, in the discussion you will not only find out what you could of done differently , you will get other tips that will help you on your way.

betrthanphil

RWPKRPLR;309305 wroteIMO I don't think u should have to quit playing online poker due to the bad beats... If you use bankroll management theories, you should be able to come out above after all that variance comes your way.

Also maybe take a few of your playing hours and use them for study time. I found this helped my game greatly. Reading posts on this forum when someone posts in the analyze my hand section shows you new ways of going about playing a situation you may have encountered before and will encounter in the future.

Everyone on this forum has had a ton of bad beats! Maybe next time when It happens, post that hand and discuss it. I bet, in the discussion you will not only find out what you could of done differently , you will get other tips that will help you on your way.

This only applies to good players. Not everyone can just blame their losses on variance. If your playing bad poker your going to lose in the long run. The problem people have is, no one will ever admit to themselves that they are bad, and the people that do are the ones that fix their leaks and become winning players.

Cerberus

betrthanphil;309311 wroteThis only applies to good players. Not everyone can just blame their losses on variance. If your playing bad poker your going to lose in the long run. The problem people have is, no one will ever admit to themselves that they are bad, and the people that do are the ones that fix their leaks and become winning players.

Or, like some of us, just revel in the fact that they're terrible and go out looking to give bad beats :)

Muddguts

Thanks for the input everyone. I think I just need to step away for a bit and come back with a different strategy. In the future, I think I will just approach internet poker like I do live poker. If I have and itch to play, just deposit $60 and play a $55+$5 sit and go or MTT and if I cash, great and if I lose oh well, try again in a few weeks just like I would playing live.

eeetee2011

Muddguts;309317 wroteThanks for the input everyone. I think I just need to step away for a bit and come back with a different strategy. In the future, I think I will just approach internet poker like I do live poker. If I have and itch to play, just deposit $60 and play a $55+$5 sit and go or MTT and if I cash, great and if I lose oh well, try again in a few weeks just like I would playing live.

Taking breaks is critical to playing better and just enjoying the game more in general. I find when I am pissed off and running and playing bad that you are just looking for results you dont care how they come. When I am playing well I think through EVERY hand and try to make the best decision but when I am tried of losing and playing bad I will do things I know or bad in an attempt to just win the hand. Over the years I have put in more volume and am able to put things in a long term perspective. I can have a losing month and look back at results and see I have had lots of winning years in a row obv when I started playing 10 years ago I just lost it when I thought I was running bad which in turn made me play terrible.

JohnnieH

Back in the Ought's I used to play online most weeknights and a few MTTs on the weekends that there wasn't a home game somewhere. One night I was playing in 3 games and at within the same minute I was dealt AA, AA and QQ which ran into AA. Of course I busted from all 3 tournaments. I was incensed beyond belief. How can something like that NOT be rigged? (I know it's not, but still) Instead of catapulting my laptop into the farmers field outside, I simply went the cashier and withdrew most of my money except enough to cover a few prop bets. I'd had enough.

After a few days of not playing I was surprised as to what RELIEF I felt that I wasn't playing online anymore. My wife was very happy as she didn't have to listen to anymore BB stories, or put up with my outbursts. I had more way more free time for my family and other interests. No more unwanted stress so I slept better too.

I've come to realize that I'm not well suited to sitting there playing for hours on end in front of a computer screen. I don't know how you online grinders do it. I tip my hat to you guys who make a living playing online, but it's not for me.

Am I going to win the WSOP? Not without a lot of hard work and study, which I'm not willing to put into it. Am I a losing player? Oh yeah, but Poker for me is a social game that sometimes costs me money, but not always. That's life.

Mudgutts: I advise you to stop playing online now before it gets in the way of your family and friends. Shut down the computer, and find something else you love to do. There's always the odd home game to get in your gambooling fix.

JohnnieH

DennisG

I have found myself in this same boat Mudd...latealy (last 6 months?) I just can't seem to get on the good side of variance ( I have forgotten about all my suckouts) and cash decently in anything. I have a really bad time at *'s having only ever won one tournament there, and feel like I can't ever get anywhere on that site..which in turn leads me to play worse and compounding the problem.
I have been playing at the other sites I have done well at in the past few years, but seem to be lacking something still...probably patience..ok, I know it's patience..lol But dammit...it drives me up the fucking wall when someone calls a 1/2 to 2/3 pot bet on the flop with only a gutter and hits it...I know it shouldn't bother me, and it has zero to do with bankroll issues...I don't use one, never have, and don't care about the 16 bucks the tourney cost...but it is just the fact that I cannot win these days on a site I used to *crush*...
I think I am going to relook at online poker and make an attempt at some cash games again and work on my patience...this way I can set a goal to be patient for an hour...for example..and play solid...then I can walk away happy. Slowly increase my time at the tables until I feel like I can play MTTs again.. Either that, or it is a sng time for me...

Before I do anything rash though...I am gonna head to Darb's place and watch him play for a few hours..maybe get a new outlook..lol...If I can keep my head out of the smoke!! lol

[deleted]

DennisG;309441 wroteI just can't seem to get on the good side of variance ( I have forgotten about all my suckouts) and cash decently in anything.

:-X

DennisG;309441 wrote I have a really bad time at *'s having only ever won one tournament there, and feel like I can't ever get anywhere on that site..which in turn leads me to play worse and compounding the problem.

I have read and heard that stars is the tougher site out there. And yes not 'knowing' the correct answer in a hand + variance leads me, and has lead many others to create their own poker 'religions'. Variance a terrible thing for this (also having a small sample messes with this)

DennisG;309441 wrote I have been playing at the other sites I have done well at in the past few years, but seem to be lacking something still...probably patience..ok, I know it's patience..lol

I think lack of patience still implies that we are unsure in certain spots... or in other words, there is no time ;P

DennisG;309441 wroteI know it shouldn't bother me, and it has zero to do with bankroll issues...I don't use one, never have, and don't care about the 16 bucks the tourney cost

This is the part I wanted to respond to, I think this sentence contradicts trying to increase one's roi. Not sure if I'm talking mathematically or philosophically but I think its a hidden truth

Its like if you have no thoughts on brmg your concept of poker is in the air. When you think in terms of bankroll a lot of different things become defined.

I came across this thinking from something V said slightly in jest (maybe it wasn't in jest).

DennisG;309441 wroteBefore I do anything rash though...I am gonna head to Darb's place and watch him play for a few hours..maybe get a new outlook..lol...If I can keep my head out of the smoke!! lol

getting a new outlook at darb's seems kinda rash tho

DennisG

darbday;309446 wrote:-X

I think lack of patience still implies that we are unsure in certain spots... or in other words, there is no time ;P

Yeah, there is no doubt there is some uncertainty in spots..won't deny that..but it also comes to points where I absolutely know I should fold..but say "fuck it, I have outs and if I lose..oh well" Then there are the spots that we play bad hands oop because we (I) think "I can play this idiot oop"..when I know I don't need to... Or we play 2-3 hours of pretty solid poker...then blow it on a really stupid push...

This is the part I wanted to respond to, I think this sentence contradicts trying to increase one's roi. Not sure if I'm talking mathematically or philosophically but I think its a hidden truth

Its like if you have no thoughts on brmg your concept of poker is in the air. When you think in terms of bankroll a lot of different things become defined.

I think I said this incorrectly...yes, my goal is to make money...but what I meant was that the 5 bucks, 16 bucks, the 55 bucks..whatever the tourney cost me...does not matter to me. It isn't a money/bankroll issue...it is a frustration issue that compounds and leads to worse/poor play.

getting a new outlook at darb's seems kinda rash tho

you could be spot on here...but I will take a chance..

GTA Poker

I never really played online poker very much other than when I first started learning the game 9 years ago or so. Since then I have learned that for me playing online to make a profit like I do live feels like too much of a desk job to me. So, I only play online when I feel like killing a bit of time playing some games I cannot play live.

I usually enjoy playing live, but even that gets a bit tedious for me without a break now and then.

Think about what you enjoy about poker and focus on those goals or that aspect of the game. If you love playing live but get angry and frustrated online then just play live. If you really like PLO but not holdem then only play PLO. If you only enjoy playing with friends for fun then just do that.

Grinding online is basically a desk job and it isn't glamorous at all. If you don't get enjoyment from it then you will never profit much from it -- and you shouldn't be playing with the goal of profit, you should be enjoying your spare time. If you really enjoy playing (which you don't if you are destroying laptops) then you will likely make a bit of money at it as well. If you don't enjoy playing then why waste your spare time at a desk job that is losing you money?

literation

Yes GTA, it is a desk job (to me). I already do enough stuff on teh computerz, don't need to play poker there too.