Need advice

Quinner

Can't find the hand history but went something like this.

Early stages of a 3 dollar sng and I was on the button with AJo there were multiple limpers before me and I raised it to 3xBB. I get 3 other callers making the pot 370. Flop comes down Ad 9c 3d, checked to me, I bet out 300, one flat call.

Now at this point I'm thinking I'm in way over my head as I can't see him cold calling with anything I can beat. However I'm not 100% sure, no good reads on villain yet, maybe I dunno approx. 70% sure.

My question to you all is, would you fire another bet? Or try and check down to see what he does on the river?

Another thought in my head was that if he was actually just on a flush draw I didn't want to give him a free river card. So bet or check turn? He checked turn to me btw.

Stack sizes (Initial):

Me: 1435
Him: 1060

I can't really fire again without committing both of us to the hand if he calls/shoves that was also a consideration.

Should I play it safe??

compuease

$3.? play it straight forward, push, hopefully getting called by flush draw or weaker A. No need to be tricky..

Quinner

I did that and got pwned by AKc, go me.

Graham

Quinner;186979 wroteI did that and got pwned by AKc, go me.

One of the limpers had AK? Odd at those levels.

ReefAquarium

Quinner;186970 wroteCan't find the hand history but went something like this.

Early stages of a 3 dollar sng and I was on the button with AJo there were multiple limpers before me and I raised it to 3xBB. I get 3 other callers making the pot 370. Flop comes down Ad 9c 3d, checked to me, I bet out 300, one flat call.

Now at this point I'm thinking I'm in way over my head as I can't see him cold calling with anything I can beat. However I'm not 100% sure, no good reads on villain yet, maybe I dunno approx. 70% sure.

My question to you all is, would you fire another bet? Or try and check down to see what he does on the river?

Another thought in my head was that if he was actually just on a flush draw I didn't want to give him a free river card. So bet or check turn? He checked turn to me btw.

Stack sizes (Initial):

Me: 1435
Him: 1060

I can't really fire again without committing both of us to the hand if he calls/shoves that was also a consideration.

Should I play it safe??

You need to start to think about pot commitment earlier in the hand.

Seriously .... it will take your game to the next level.

AJ on an Ad9c3d ...

Consider.

No overcards can come. Except for the flush draw, you're in a way ahead/way behind situation.

On the flop, if you bet 300 into a 370 pot and he calls, you will create a 970 pot. You don't want to play a big pot for stacks with a top pair type hand (AJo is a quintessential top pair hand).

He started with 1060 if he calls 300 he will have 700 left.

Yes there is a flush possibility on the flop , but if you bet 300 into a 370 pot you will bloat the pot size up too big for your 1 pair hand.

If you have position it sometimes makes sense to play more small ball and keep the pot small and let the hand develop more slowly letting your good position work for you.

Betting 175-200 will let the hand develop more slowly and still deny the flush draw odds to call.

The other option is to check the flop and then bet 200 on a safe turn. AJ is not that great a hand and you're in a way ahead way behind situation if your opponents aren't on a flush draw.

Quinner

I think I'm getting there slowly Reef, it used to be I hardly considered stack sizes and now it's one of my main things to think about when making bet sizes. Say instead of AJ in this situation that I had the flush draw. I know that everyone seems to say is that you want to "build" a pot with this type of hand what would you recommend doing here, betting to build the pot (if so how much?) or checking? Also does your answer differ between a cash game and a sit'n'go?

And lastly I think I would prefer betting the flop here just because there are so many people in the hand, so say I make it 200 to go, what happens on the turn? Am I checking behind for pot control and then folding to any bet on the river? Because if the flush draw doesn't hit I have a few reasons to think I have the best hand if he's checked flop and turn to me. So I can't see myself folding to any value bets on the river.

Quinner

Graham;186983 wroteOne of the limpers had AK? Odd at those levels.

Yes but good play cuz I wasn't expecting it at all.

Wetts1012

fwiw you are going to play a big multiway pot with AJ by raising 3x BB with multiple limpers in front. Nobody is folding here, especially early.

Not sure if this is something you want, because almost any respectable c-bet has a good portion of your chips in already.

[deleted]

Graham;186983 wroteOne of the limpers had AK? Odd at those levels.

these days it seems a lot of tricky players play at the small stakes, i play them myself, with all due respect Graham, its not odd at all.

[deleted]

I don't think limping with AKo is odd at all, it may not be correct, no comment on that, but whether done by a good player or a bad one I could see that happen sometimes.

And betting into a pot with limpers is allowing monsters in large pot, and generally giving odds for looser hands i think maybe too, you'd have to put aces into the villians range for sure. And with three other callers your 'villian' (which of the 3 players calls) is going to have a premium post flop hand and your stuck with A Jo. I think flopping an ace 4 ways with a medium kicker is always going to be suicide.

But I would reading negreanu's book on small ball poker. not to learn to play small ball, and its prob not the best for sit n goes, but it shows you how to play a style where you aren't in the dark with top pair good kicker. until you learn to curb these kinds of moments your gonna get busted out time after time imo. Basically there are better ways to play to swing the pots towards you and its not just about weighing stack sizes, position, ranges, and hand value.

I've only read a few but it really changed my perception

ReefAquarium

Quinner;187000 wroteI think I'm getting there slowly Reef, it used to be I hardly considered stack sizes and now it's one of my main things to think about when making bet sizes. Say instead of AJ in this situation that I had the flush draw. I know that everyone seems to say is that you want to "build" a pot with this type of hand what would you recommend doing here, betting to build the pot (if so how much?) or checking? Also does your answer differ between a cash game and a sit'n'go?

I repeat:

You're in a way ahead/way behind situation.

This is *not* a situation where you build a pot with AJo.

You need to think about this situation until you understand what it is to be in a way ahead/way behind situation.

Earlier I recommended perhaps betting 200, but it may be that you should not bet at all.

For betting to be right they would have to be on a flush draw, and it would have to hit for not betting to be wrong........

And lastly I think I would prefer betting the flop here just because there are so many people in the hand, so say I make it 200 to go, what happens on the turn? Am I checking behind for pot control and then folding to any bet on the river? Because if the flush draw doesn't hit I have a few reasons to think I have the best hand if he's checked flop and turn to me. So I can't see myself folding to any value bets on the river.

On the turn you will have more information: you will see another card and you will see what your opponents do thanks to your good position.

Consider: When you have position you can let your good position work for you,

schabs

I think you should've raised more PF tbh. $3 levels make them commit more chips PF, your on the button with a premium hand. Just got unlucky one of them had AK.

syphilaids

ReefAquarium;196890 wroteI repeat:

You're in a way ahead/way behind situation.

This is *not* a situation where you build a pot with AJo.

You need to think about this situation until you understand what it is to be in a way ahead/way behind situation.

Earlier I recommended perhaps betting 200, but it may be that you should not bet at all.

For betting to be right they would have to be on a flush draw, and it would have to hit for not betting to be wrong........

On the turn you will have more information: you will see another card and you will see what your opponents do thanks to your good position.

Consider: When you have position you can let your good position work for you,

I disagree with checking the flop. I think your 200 bet is perfect. It defines your hand and forces others to define their's. You have top pair with a decent kicker. You need to know where you stand.

If a diamond comes on the turn and someone donk bets are you calling? or even if it doesn't, and you're bet at? say a Tc comes on the turn and a villain donk bets 250 at you? now you have one less ace you're beating, but there's so much more combo draws on the turn you'd have no idea where you stand.

I agree that you dont want a big pot, but you really dont want to be throwing away the best hand on the turn due to huge bluff/scare cards.

You need to bet to get information. Multi-way pot with TP and position is good enough for me to bet on the flop. 300 is way too much, but 200 is perfect. you may get c/r by FD's but hey, thats poker. Depending on your read you can decide to push or fold.